Dark Germanic Heathenism

[Saint Frankenstein]

I know this thread is old, but there's a lot of mistaken assumptions here.

There is no "good" or "evil" dichotomy in the groups of Divine Beings in Germanic religion. The Jötnar are not "evil". They are analogous to the Greek Titans in that they are the primeval forces of the Cosmos and celestial bodies. For example, Jord is the Earth and She is certainly not "evil. She is our Mother. Some of the Jötnar were on friendly terms with the Gods and even had offspring with them, same as how some of the Titans were viewed positively to the Greeks. However, the Gods uphold order, balance and law and the Jötnar, as primal forces, would of course be in opposition to them as they are often chaotic. Eventually the Jötnar "win out" over the Gods because the universe is cyclic, going through phases of life, death and rebirth. They are just part of the innate workings of the cosmos, but the Gods try to hold this off in working to give everything the time needed. But after this universe comes to end, the process starts again. So Jötnar aren't "evil". Chaos and destruction and form and order cannot survive without each other, same as life and death. They are intrinsically linked.

So the dualistic mindset of those who set up the Gods and the Jötnar against each other is a foreign mindset that comes from Christianity. Both sides win and both sides lose at different parts in the eternal cycle. Everything is part of a whole and works together. Just as the present form and order of the universe won't last forever, neither will the chaos and destruction that ends it. Every ending is a door to a new beginning. Maybe trillions of years from now in a future universe, we'll be having this discussion again.

 

[Jainarayan]

I'm glad you resurrected a couple of these threads. This is good for us newbies to explore. Indeed, not all the jotunns were evil, nor were they all of gigantic proportions. Some of them passed for Aesir. Jord was (is) also the mother of Thor. Jarnsaxa, a jotunn, is Thor's lover and the mother of their son Magni, whose strength at 3 years old rivaled that of his father. Goddess Skadi is a jotunn.

 

[EyeofOdin]

So I'm posting this in the Asatru forum, but in reality, Dark Germanic Heathenism is the total opposite of Asatru.

I just stumbled upon this through music (I listen to some Black Metal, and while looking for some Pagan Black Metal bands, one of them had Dark Germanic Heathenism in its lyrical themes, so I looked it up) and basically it is a "cultic practice" in which a person worships the "dark" side of Germanic Paganism. This means they worship the Giants, trolls, and other "forces of darkness". They say that even though we were created by the Gods, it was from a Giant's body that we were made (Ymir) and so we have that force of darkness in us. They say that total destruction will lead to ultimate knowledge, so basically they are siding with the enemies of the Aesir and Vanir, and trying to give them more power so that when Ragnarok comes, they can have the ultimate knowledge.


What do you all think of it?


Personally, I think that it is for people who don't want to be Satanic but still want to be "dark". I don't see a point in worshipping darkness and destruction.

The other thing the people could be are the Heathens who view the world through an objective lens. We need chaos, coldness, darkness, destruction and death. Without them, fertility would never come. Most, if you experience and honor them, of these "darker deities" or "Rokkr" use their more chaotic aspects to teach you through negativity. "I lost my keys... I was late for work! Thanks for nothing Loki!" should really be "At least I wasn't fire. I need to get a place to hang my keys". We don't like it, but there's no way around it, so we accept it as a Universal reality and see how we can use the necessity in the circle of life of these abstractions for our own daily lives. Maybe I loose a dollar, I look in a hidden place, still don't find it but I find a five dollar bill and I'm more cautious about where I put my money?

Most of Loki's teachings are somewhat playful, benign and don't result badly (immediately at least). This is from UPG and Lore. If you look through the myths, Loki does things like play a mean joke on Thor then get him a lightning=warhammer and her a wig, offer Freyja to a random jotun construction worker, but then will give Odin an eight legged horse and say the gods can keep Freyja. There's a give and take relationship. Loki does things that'll effect your life, keeps everything together in the end, and makes up for it. In life, he will communicate through negative experiences but he is making sure that everything won't fall apart in the end and we learn how to avoid such situation, in which case everything might fall apart, if that makes sense. Loki points out where we're dangerously vulnerable, so we can protect ourselves.

Which is ironic because Loki is also the "breaker of worlds", whom I've never felt in my UPG. I suppose it was a Christian influence (assuming the story of Ragnarok isn't authentic) but others disagree.

Along with Loki's brief stressful moments followed by a lesson or a gift along with it too.

Another one of his aspects is just one which I find curious. There's some deep wisdom in The Father of Lies being bound and tormented because he pointed out the truth to the gods.

There are other examples. These deities cause destruction, yes, but also they are like the decomposition of leaves to give nutrients for the seedlings, environmental pressures, taking away individuals for the better gene pool and less disease and birth defects, and have been likened to many other things.

I would like to point out that I didn't think to myself "hmm, I wanna be something dark and emo, but I don't wanna be too emo, so Rokkatru!" I was a person with the certain mind-set in not discriminating because of offense to personal sensibilities, so all deities are welcome to my altar, and demonstrate the hospitality a real Heathen gives.

 

[EyeofOdin]

I guess in that sense you're right, but the Gods who win are on the "good" side, and from that a new Earth is made. So I would rather help continue humanity and the World by taking the Aesir/Vanir side. The Jotuns and Loki are doomed from the start.

Doesn't anyone think it's suspicious that literally every depiction of Ragnarok has a big fat cross in the middle?