Cussing

[kmkemp]

Okay, so I am wondering who here cusses. Of course, it's not really that simple. What exactly is a cuss word? How many times do I have to cuss to be considered someone that cusses? Fair enough. Let's make it a list of questions to account for everything.

1) What do you consider to be a cuss word?
2) Do you believe it is wrong?
3) If so, on what grounds?
4) Are there grounds in which cussing is okay?
5) Do you cuss?

Here are some Bible verses concerning cussing (arguably):

Mark 7:
10Jesus called the crowd together and said, "Pay attention and try to understand what I mean. 11The food that you put into your mouth doesn't make you unclean and unfit to worship God. The bad words that come out of your mouth are what make you unclean."
12Then his disciples came over to him and asked, "Do you know that you insulted the Pharisees by what you said?"
13Jesus answered, "Every plant that my Father in heaven did not plant will be pulled up by the roots. 14Stay away from those Pharisees! They are like blind people leading other blind people, and all of them will fall into a ditch."
15Peter replied, "What did you mean when you talked about the things that make people unclean?"
16Jesus then said:
Don't any of you know what I am talking about by now? 17Don't you know that the food you put into your mouth goes into your stomach and then out of your body? 18But the words that come out of your mouth come from your heart. And they are what make you unfit to worship God. 19Out of your heart come evil thoughts, murder, unfaithfulness in marriage, vulgar deeds, stealing, telling lies, and insulting others. 20These are what make you unclean. Eating without washing your hands will not make you unfit to worship God.

Ephesians 4:
29Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen. 30And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. 31Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice.

Colossians 3:8
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.[/FONT]

Of course, the cuss words that we have today in any given culture are not going to be the same as the ones back when these verses were written. How do we determine what a cuss word is? Is it a concept that is totally defined by the culture/language?


I have also noticed that some Christians on this site have used words like "hell" not referring to a place. Do you consider that to be not cussing since the word "hell" is used in the Bible or is it just that you don't think cussing is un-Biblical?

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[Shadow Wolf]

"Cuss" words are just words. It is the power that people give them. Words like fudge, crap, gosh, darn, heck, and so on, mean the exact same thing, use the exact same implications, thus are cuss words as well. But for some reason, whoever decided it was inappropriate to say certain words.
Myself, I do swear frequently. Not so much that I sound like a verbally challegned idiot with the IQ and education of a 10 year old who must say the f word as every other word, but enough to really offend people. I especially swear alot, enough to make a sailor's mouth seem clean, when I'm drunk.

 

[FatMan]

I swear so much that when I'm in a court of law, they don't even give me a Bible. They just tell me to put my right hand up.

 

[FatMan]

I forgot to add - cussing for emphasis can really add some zest to a conversation. And just think how versatile most cuss words are. When you can use some as verbs, adjectives, nouns, or even pronouns, it's like having a wild card in poker.

 

[Mike182]

it's quite hard to define profanity and innuendo without giving examples, and i certainly can't post those on the forum but yes, i use them a lot in real life.

i don't think they are bad, i think they express emotion.

 

[Aqualung]

I agree with Luke Wolf. A word is a word. There's no such thing as a bad word. Unlike Luke Wolf, however, I try to follow what is written in the Bible where it says on numerous occaisions to not offend your fellow man. Some people do get offended by words, so I try to watch my mouth around others for their sake, not mine.

 

[JayHawes]

Let me start by saying that God wants us to be pure, and our tonge affects whether or not we are pure, our words show whats on the inside.


Jas 3:8 -But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.

Jas 3:6 -And the tongue is a fire; it is the power of evil placed in our bodies, making all the body unclean, putting the wheel of life on fire, and getting its fire from hell.


1) What do you consider to be a cuss word?
A cuss word is anything that defiles something or someone.

2) Do you believe it is wrong?
Yes i do becuase our words should be beneficial to the hearer, insulting someone or using defiling words are of no use.

3) If so, on what grounds?
In all cases whether mad or not.

4) Are there grounds in which cussing is okay?
No, though it may slip sometimes unless you are speaking of your as*, you child's as* or a real as* (donkey), then it is cursing. The same for sh*t, it depends on the context it is used. (- add another s to the as*)

5) Do you cuss?
Not aloud or atleast i try my best not to. If anyone hears me curse they would be very surprised. Anger overcomes the best of us.

 

[Gentoo]

I usually tend not to swear a lot, if I do in daily language it's mainly for emphasis. And then there... THOSE days... where every other word is magically transofrmed into symbols in the chat room... I don't have those days very often, but when I do people usually notice

 

[kmkemp]

I agree with Luke Wolf. A word is a word. There's no such thing as a bad word. Unlike Luke Wolf, however, I try to follow what is written in the Bible where it says on numerous occaisions to not offend your fellow man. Some people do get offended by words, so I try to watch my mouth around others for their sake, not mine.

What about taking they Lord's name in vain?

The Bible says that it makes us unclean. As in the person that said the words. So why then, do you think that watching your tongue is only for the benefit of others?

There is always an alternate way to express yourselves without being labeled as having a filthy mouth from others. Since we are called to stand out as Christians, do you not think that is reason enough to try to stay away from what society deems cuss words?

 

[FatMan]

Let me start by saying that God wants us to be pure, and our tonge affects whether or not we are pure, our words show whats on the inside.

Who gets to decide which words are pure and which aren't??

Our words are a method of conversation, and sometimes nothing else. If words showed what was on the inside, all actors in a villianous role would go to hell.

What I use as a curse word may just sound like gibberish to a Zulu tribesman and vice versa. It is how we interpret curse words that cause conflict. It is how we perceive the intent of the speaker to determine if curse words are hurtful. Sometimes, curse words can express astonishment or bewilderment - does that mean people are impure during those times?

I learned something a long time ago - Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me.

That was apparently written before we became a society hell-bent on becoming offended at the drop of a pin.

 

[Aqualung]

What about taking they Lord's name in vain?

What about it?

The Bible says that it makes us unclean. As in the person that said the words. So why then, do you think that watching your tongue is only for the benefit of others?]

Yeah, I agree that it would make me unclean to do something that I thought was a sin. The Bible also deals with that in one of my favourite parts, where Paul is talking about the sinful nature of eating meat sacrificed to idols. He said it was sinful under two conditions:

Number one - if I thought it was a sin and ate it anyway.
Number two - if somebody in the room thought it was a sin and, seeing me eating it, was pressured into thinking he could eat it, too.

Since the Bible does not specify what a cuss word is, I think it's up to the individual to decide. If I decide that "tree" is a cuss word and I use it anyway, I would be making myself unclean. If I knew that you thought the so called f word was bad, and I used it around you, making you uncomfortable, then I would be making myself unclean.

There is always an alternate way to express yourselves without being labeled as having a filthy mouth from others. Since we are called to stand out as Christians, do you not think that is reason enough to try to stay away from what society deems cuss words?

Yeah. I also just said that I did for basically those exact same reasons, so why are you addressing this question at me?

 

[kmkemp]

What about it?


Yeah, I agree that it would make me unclean to do something that I thought was a sin. The Bible also deals with that in one of my favourite parts, where Paul is talking about the sinful nature of eating meat sacrificed to idols. He said it was sinful under two conditions:

Number one - if I thought it was a sin and ate it anyway.
Number two - if somebody in the room thought it was a sin and, seeing me eating it, was pressured into thinking he could eat it, too.

Since the Bible does not specify what a cuss word is, I think it's up to the individual to decide. If I decide that "tree" is a cuss word and I use it anyway, I would be making myself unclean. If I knew that you thought the so called f word was bad, and I used it around you, making you uncomfortable, then I would be making myself unclean.



Yeah. I also just said that I did for basically those exact same reasons, so why are you addressing this question at me?

My next question, then, is when exactly can you avoid all of these circumstances? Practically, you can't really know if it offends someone or not unless they are a close personal friend that you've talked with them about it and they also agree and have the same views as you do. Even still, habits are habits. If you cuss around some people, it becomes harder to not cuss around others. Anyone who cussed as a child and had parents that punished them for it can attest to this. It seems that, even if cussing in and of itself is not a sin, you are towing the line here. The Bible says "flee from sin". It makes no mention of you can do this, this, and this, so long as you don't do this.

Another problem I have with all of this is that you are taking what you believe to be a sin as the standard for sin. God is the standard for sin. It seems like you think this is a relative concept. I would disagree with that. The example with Paul is a great one because he went above what was actually not considered a sin just so that other people would see him stand out. Still, I don't think it applies here because eating meat can't "slip out" like a cuss word can. You don't make a habit of a thing like that.

Don't think that I am pointing you out. These are points that I wanted to make in this thread, but I had already asked enough questions in the OP I think. You just happened to be the first person to raise the viewpoint I was looking for.

 

[Aqualung]

My next question, then, is when exactly can you avoid all of these circumstances? Practically, you can't really know if it offends someone or not unless they are a close personal friend that you've talked with them about it and they also agree and have the same views as you do.

That's true. The Bible says you can't sin in ignorance. So, ifyou don't know, how could you sin by offense? But, once you know, greater knowledge has greater responsibility, so you'd have to change your ways.

Even still, habits are habits. If you cuss around some people, it becomes harder to not cuss around others.

Yeah, sin is hard like that.

It seems that, even if cussing in and of itself is not a sin, you are towing the line here. The Bible says "flee from sin". It makes no mention of you can do this, this, and this, so long as you don't do this.

I don't really understand what you're saying here. Can you rephrase your point?

Another problem I have with all of this is that you are taking what you believe to be a sin as the standard for sin. God is the standard for sin.

I agree with that, too, but he has put a lot of it on all shoulders. Yes, there are some very strict rules, but those are spelled out. He doesn't require something great from us without telling us what that is. But, I haven't seen anywhere a list of words that God has specifically said are bad, so how can he expect us to follow a list? That list would necessarily be man-made, which makes man the standard for sin, not God. Since he has not given us a list, we must decide for ourselves (like the Pauline example).

The example with Paul is a great one because he went above what was actually not considered a sin just so that other people would see him stand out. Still, I don't think it applies here because eating meat can't "slip out" like a cuss word can. You don't make a habit of a thing like that.

I would hope nobody would ever make a habit out of anything they consider a sin, and then use the word "habit" to excuse themselves to the point where they don't feel like they need to change.

Don't think that I am pointing you out. These are points that I wanted to make in this thread, but I had already asked enough questions in the OP I think. You just happened to be the first person to raise the viewpoint I was looking for.

You're a civil debater, as far as I know. I like this discussion. You haven't offended me yet.

 

[JayHawes]

Who gets to decide which words are pure and which aren't??

Our words are a method of conversation, and sometimes nothing else. If words showed what was on the inside, all actors in a villianous role would go to hell.

What I use as a curse word may just sound like gibberish to a Zulu tribesman and vice versa. It is how we interpret curse words that cause conflict. It is how we perceive the intent of the speaker to determine if curse words are hurtful. Sometimes, curse words can express astonishment or bewilderment - does that mean people are impure during those times?

I learned something a long time ago - Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me.

That was apparently written before we became a society hell-bent on becoming offended at the drop of a pin.

We know what words are pure or not, the Spirit of God should show us. People's words should hold meaning. Acting is a field in the film industry. Their words are for entertainment. When they are off screen theirwords should be pure.

I think its funny when some people curse :biglaugh: Other times it is just non-sense and un-needed. It just depends on the tone of voice, and the meaning implied. I think its funny. I just prefer myself to just accpet God's truth without making up excuses as to why or why not i should or should not curse- i fully realise alot of people will make excuses as to what is or is not wrong. I still think some people's cursing is just funny

 

[kmkemp]

I don't really understand what you're saying here. Can you rephrase your point?

What I mean is that it seems that you cuss around certain people but try not to cuss around others who might be offended. That is towing the line of sin. That is, you are getting as close as you can to it without actually committing it. The Bible warns us not to do this. We are told to flee from sin. I would argue that trying to be as close to sin as possible without actually sinning is a form of legalism, a sin all to itself.

I agree with that, too, but he has put a lot of it on all shoulders. Yes, there are some very strict rules, but those are spelled out. He doesn't require something great from us without telling us what that is. But, I haven't seen anywhere a list of words that God has specifically said are bad, so how can he expect us to follow a list? That list would necessarily be man-made, which makes man the standard for sin, not God. Since he has not given us a list, we must decide for ourselves (like the Pauline example).

Yes, we must. We can't expect God to spell out a list. In fact, that again, would be legalism. Exactly the reason that Jesus rebuked the Pharisees so often. So how are we to come up with a list? Again, I think the guide is to "flee from sin". If you think it might be a sin, then you probably shouldn't do it. Additionally, Paul gives us good reason (meat example) to not do anything close to sin just so that we can be an example for others. They will pay more attention to what you say if they think you're the real thing (Christian) so how they think a Christian should behave should be important to us as well.

I would hope nobody would ever make a habit out of anything they consider a sin, and then use the word "habit" to excuse themselves to the point where they don't feel like they need to change.

/nod
But I don't quite follow in that you said that you cussed around people that felt like-minded with you, that there was nothing wrong with it in and of itself?

You're a civil debater, as far as I know. I like this discussion. You haven't offended me yet.

/cheer

 

[Aqualung]

What I mean is that it seems that you cuss around certain people but try not to cuss around others who might be offended.

No, I don't cuss around anyone, because I realise that there is probably somebody in my company who is offended by cussing or who would feel uncomfortable hearing me cuss. But, I don't not cuss because of any inherent badness within the words themselves (just like paul didn't warn people to not eat meat sacrificed to idols because of any inherent badness in the meat itself). I don't cuss because of the effect it might have on others (if meat makes my brother to offend, I shall eat no meat).

That is towing the line of sin. That is, you are getting as close as you can to it without actually committing it.

Well, even taking into account the fictitious claim that I cuss, so what if it's towing the line? You just said yourself, I'm getting close but not actually committing it. Sin is pretty black and white. You're either sinning or you're not. If I'm not, who cares?

The Bible warns us not to do this. We are told to flee from sin. I would argue that trying to be as close to sin as possible without actually sinning is a form of legalism, a sin all to itself.

Why would you argue that? If I'm not sinning, I can't very well be fleeing TOWARDS sin, can I? Where is the sin of legalism condemned? I remember Jesus condemning the Pharisees for following the letter of the law rather than the spirit, but I think if I don't cuss because I don't want to offend somebody (which is a HUGE sin, since those who offend others it would be better if they had a millstone tied around their neck than they had been born), that's following the spirit of the law, not the letter. Although, at this junction, I would have to emphasise that there is no letter of the law on this. Again, there is no list of bad words which we cannot say. So, how is it even possible to be legalistic?

Yes, we must. We can't expect God to spell out a list. In fact, that again, would be legalism.

Exactly. So, we must develop our own lists. Since we are going to develop our own lists, this will necessarily have to be based on what offends us and what offends others (vis a vis Paul's condemnation against meat sacrificed to idols).

Exactly the reason that Jesus rebuked the Pharisees so often.

This is cool. We're using the same examples to argue opposite points.

So how are we to come up with a list? Again, I think the guide is to "flee from sin". If you think it might be a sin, then you probably shouldn't do it.

Exactly what I have said. I said it in one of my first posts with you, actually. Where I quotes Paul and said there were two ways of sinning by eating meat - the first was if we thought it was sin and we still did it. I don't think saying the f word is a sin, and nowhere is it spelled out that it is. So, it's not a sin if I say it. Unless (number two), there is somebody in my presence who DOES think it is, and it offends them in such a way that it causes them to sin in some manner. So, I don't cuss around people because it could offend them.

Additionally, Paul gives us good reason (meat example) to not do anything close to sin just so that we can be an example for others.

Exactly. HIs reasons have nothing to do with any inherent sinfulness of meat itself. Just like I don't not cuss due to any inherent sinfulness of words. I do it for the sake of others.

/nod
But I don't quite follow in that you said that you cussed around people that felt like-minded with you, that there was nothing wrong with it in and of itself?

I don't think I said anywhere that I cussed. I'm pretty sure that I said I don't cuss at all. If I did, I missed a word or something, because I don't cuss at all. Ever, really. Well, I throw in a bollocks every once in a while, but that's it.

 

[kadzbiz]

Oh boy, you should spend some time with my fellow cop buddies.

Let me start by saying that God wants us to be pure, and our tonge affects whether or not we are pure, our words show whats on the inside. ......

A tongue can be more lethal than a gun at times, then again, it can be more pleasureable than a piece of fruit.

..... Ever, really. Well, I throw in a bollocks every once in a while, but that's it.

Sometimes, when I'm all alone and nobody is around, and I am having a bad day, and the last straw has been added, I cuss my guts out. It's such a relief and I feel so liberated. I try not to cuss, but still do it to often. Funnily enough though, when I'm in the presence of my mother-in-law or people I don't know, my cussing just unconsciously stops.

 

[kmkemp]

No, I don't cuss around anyone, because I realise that there is probably somebody in my company who is offended by cussing or who would feel uncomfortable hearing me cuss. But, I don't not cuss because of any inherent badness within the words themselves (just like paul didn't warn people to not eat meat sacrificed to idols because of any inherent badness in the meat itself). I don't cuss because of the effect it might have on others (if meat makes my brother to offend, I shall eat no meat).


Well, even taking into account the fictitious claim that I cuss, so what if it's towing the line? You just said yourself, I'm getting close but not actually committing it. Sin is pretty black and white. You're either sinning or you're not. If I'm not, who cares?


Why would you argue that? If I'm not sinning, I can't very well be fleeing TOWARDS sin, can I? Where is the sin of legalism condemned? I remember Jesus condemning the Pharisees for following the letter of the law rather than the spirit, but I think if I don't cuss because I don't want to offend somebody (which is a HUGE sin, since those who offend others it would be better if they had a millstone tied around their neck than they had been born), that's following the spirit of the law, not the letter. Although, at this junction, I would have to emphasise that there is no letter of the law on this. Again, there is no list of bad words which we cannot say. So, how is it even possible to be legalistic?


Exactly. So, we must develop our own lists. Since we are going to develop our own lists, this will necessarily have to be based on what offends us and what offends others (vis a vis Paul's condemnation against meat sacrificed to idols).


This is cool. We're using the same examples to argue opposite points.


Exactly what I have said. I said it in one of my first posts with you, actually. Where I quotes Paul and said there were two ways of sinning by eating meat - the first was if we thought it was sin and we still did it. I don't think saying the f word is a sin, and nowhere is it spelled out that it is. So, it's not a sin if I say it. Unless (number two), there is somebody in my presence who DOES think it is, and it offends them in such a way that it causes them to sin in some manner. So, I don't cuss around people because it could offend them.


Exactly. HIs reasons have nothing to do with any inherent sinfulness of meat itself. Just like I don't not cuss due to any inherent sinfulness of words. I do it for the sake of others.


I don't think I said anywhere that I cussed. I'm pretty sure that I said I don't cuss at all. If I did, I missed a word or something, because I don't cuss at all. Ever, really. Well, I throw in a bollocks every once in a while, but that's it.

OK, clearly I misinterpreted what you said lol.

 

[Aqualung]

Haha, so actually we spent this whole time agreeing?

 

[kmkemp]

In a round about way.