Communicating with Devils

[Infinitum]

There now guys. Most of us in the DIR have some kind of metaphysical experiences (if that's the right word for them) and that's one of the things that connect us to each other. Where we differ is on the explanations why and how these happen: some say it comes from outside, others say it comes from inside. What we're discussing in the end are subjective experiences and I think we owe each other at least that much respect as to accept the other's experience as significant to them - whether we think they had a rendezvous with a "real" demon or not. This is exactly what I was getting at when I talked about something being subjectively real. When we're doing magic(k), we focus on getting things done, learning more about ourselves, gaining power over our universe, be it inwards or outwards. When we summon the demon we don't sit there thinking "I summon you, even if I know you're not real". At least I hope you don't, because you're missing out on a very special experience if you do. We agree to suspend our disbelief, if only for the time of the ritual. That's part of why we spend so much time and effort to meditate and gather ritual equipment: to immerse ourselves in the otherworldly and have a taste of what's beyond the mundane. If the person next to you is able to inspire you in your own magical work, does it really matter to you what differences you have about the underlying mechanics?

And to comment on the sub-DIR part: We have separate DIRs for a number of groups for a reason. If you feel uncomfortable sharing your ideas with someone who might disagree with you, the main DIR might not be your place of choice. However I'd be very disappointed in you guys - all of you - if you aren't capable of sharing the metaphorical sandpit with anyone else than your closest friends.

Ugh. Now let's get back to the subject.

 

[Father Heathen]

To the OP, I would pose your question in the paranormal DIR as well.

 

[Adramelek]

"Another implication of the operational principle of Greater Black Magic (GBM) is that there is a large amount of it "loose" in the objective universe by individuals who are generating it without calling it by that name and without even realizing what they are doing. Every time we have an "objective impression" of something possessing a quality which its physical characteristics do not substantiate, we are sampling the results of a GBM operation on the objective universe.
To take a few common examples: Snakes and rats are usually thought to be sneaky and evil, birds and cats beautiful; smog and sludge unnatural, trees and flowers natural. Many subjective universes agree upon and reinforce such interpretations, and in the OU it becomes increasingly difficult to identify the phenomenon in question without the subjectively-imposed "overlay". [Such overlays may also be called "biases", "prejudices", or "points of perspective".]
We are thus the victims of a world-wide GBM epidemic which has manifest itself as political ideologies, artistic aesthetics, advertising, social morality, etc. We cannot honestly say that we "live" in the OU, but rather in a crazy-quilt of SU overlays on the OU. The first thing the magician must do is realize this; the second thing he must do is attempt to see and understand the actual OU through all the layers. The third thing he must do is attempt to change parts of the OU carefully and precisely through his own magical workings, both LBM and GBM." - Dr. Michael A. Aquino, Black Magic In Theory and Practice.

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

P.S. I feel so guilty for quoting a sorcerer who has been studying and practicing the Black Arts for more than 40 years.

 

[ScottySatan]

This implies a harsh accusation. Do you mean it?

 

[1137]

This implies a harsh accusation. Do you mean it?

Which implication is that?

 

[1137]

"Another implication of the operational principle of Greater Black Magic (GBM) is that there is a large amount of it "loose" in the objective universe by individuals who are generating it without calling it by that name and without even realizing what they are doing. Every time we have an "objective impression" of something possessing a quality which its physical characteristics do not substantiate, we are sampling the results of a GBM operation on the objective universe.
To take a few common examples: Snakes and rats are usually thought to be sneaky and evil, birds and cats beautiful; smog and sludge unnatural, trees and flowers natural. Many subjective universes agree upon and reinforce such interpretations, and in the OU it becomes increasingly difficult to identify the phenomenon in question without the subjectively-imposed "overlay". [Such overlays may also be called "biases", "prejudices", or "points of perspective".]
We are thus the victims of a world-wide GBM epidemic which has manifest itself as political ideologies, artistic aesthetics, advertising, social morality, etc. We cannot honestly say that we "live" in the OU, but rather in a crazy-quilt of SU overlays on the OU. The first thing the magician must do is realize this; the second thing he must do is attempt to see and understand the actual OU through all the layers. The third thing he must do is attempt to change parts of the OU carefully and precisely through his own magical workings, both LBM and GBM." - Dr. Michael A. Aquino, Black Magic In Theory and Practice.

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

P.S. I feel so guilty for quoting a sorcerer who has been studying and practicing the Black Arts for more than 40 years.

Quoting is no issue, it's your embarrising level of dogmatism and your denial of it. Obviously it's beyond you though. You must realize I have nothing against your religion and your enthusiastic loyalty to Aquino and friends, only your insistence of pretending you're LHP.

 

[1137]

If we can get back on topic, I'd say the distinction between an objective entity and a psychological archetype IS important. If we understand how these things are working we can manipulate them and make them more potent. Believing in external demons is cool and all, but then you become reliant on outside forces, irrelevant of their nature.

 

[Orias]

Do any of you have experience or know any techniques in communicating with Devils
that work? Not a Hasbro Ouija board, more occult end of things involving inter-dimensional
communication. It would be fascinating if methods that old worked. Communicating with another
dimension that may be accomplished in science in the future.

Do any of those practices work?

Try not to lie. If you troll make it funny. People that practice this usually get made
fun of and they're trying to communicate with another dimension, that's pretty
scientific. In fact, most of religion would be more scientific if the Seiðr/witchcraft
practices weren't all abolished or put into 'occultism'.

This could go in paganism but I assume it's more established in Satanism/Devil
worship.

Inter dimensional communication...you mean like this?

 

[1137]

Inter dimensional communication...you mean like this?

I owe you a frubal.

 

[Adramelek]

You must realize I have nothing against your religion and your enthusiastic loyalty to Aquino and friends, only your insistence of pretending you're LHP.

Doors you have wounded my fragile sensibilities, I am deeply offended and hurt. :sarcastic

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

 

[Adramelek]

I think that any Self-willed change in your Self and in your environment is magick.

Exactly! Black Magic isn't just about doing rituals, I never said it was.

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

*post moderated-deleted*

I wouldn't recommend those old grimoires. They tend to be very disrespectful to the spirits you're invoking. I recommend looking into Demonolatry.

Summoning Demons – Invocation | Satan's Den

Blood isn't a requirement unless the Daimon or Deity you're trying to make contact with is known to have a liking for blood.

 

[Quintessence]

*cough* Back to the OP...

Working with the otherworlds is a fairly significant part of my path, though I'll say up front that I have what is perhaps a somewhat unconventional view of them. If I wanted to, sure, I could contact devils. Journeywork is extremely easy, but is obfuscated and made stupidly complicated by folks who like to dress it up in woo-woo terminology.

Use your imagination.

Only unlike most of the population in our culture, you recognize that imaginary things are otherworldly things, and that otherworldly things are as much a facet of reality as the chair you're sitting in. Take your imagination seriously and use it. The places it can take you - and reliably - are pretty darned awesome.

 

[1137]

Mass hysteria, false memory, practical joke, misunderstood phenomena... you didn't get attacked by demons.