Can my unbaptized friend receive the Eucharist and can I baptize him?

[Doodlebug02]

Hello everyone. My best friend is a Christian but he has not yet been baptized. Can he receive the Eucharist? Also, can I baptize him? Also, does he have to believe that the Eucharist is literally the body and blood of Jesus as he has a very hard time believing this. He believes that Jesus is spiritually present but not physically present.

 

[Dunemeister]

Hello everyone. My best friend is a Christian but he has not yet been baptized. Can he receive the Eucharist?

No.

Also, can I baptize him?

If there's no priest available to do the job, then yes. Otherwise no. It would also not be proper to baptize him before his catechesis.

Also, does he have to believe that the Eucharist is literally the body and blood of Jesus as he has a very hard time believing this. He believes that Jesus is spiritually present but not physically present.

His beliefs are fine for Anglicanism but not for Roman Catholicism.

 

[Doodlebug02]

No.

If there's no priest available to do the job, then yes. Otherwise no. It would also not be proper to baptize him before his catechesis.

His beliefs are fine for Anglicanism but not for Roman Catholicism.

Ok thank you Dunemeister.

 

[Jeremy Mason]

Hello everyone. My best friend is a Christian but he has not yet been baptized. Can he receive the Eucharist? Also, can I baptize him? Also, does he have to believe that the Eucharist is literally the body and blood of Jesus as he has a very hard time believing this. He believes that Jesus is spiritually present but not physically present.

I would have a priest or a minister perform the baptism. However, it was Jesus who did the hard part of his or her salvation. The important thing that a person must confess is that Jesus is their Lord and Savior, that he died for their sins and was resurrected after the third day.

But before all this, the person needs to realize the gravity and seriousness of he or she is about to do. That repentance is a part of this walk with Christ and it will be difficult at times.

As for the Lord's Supper, I think it would be appropriate to commit to Christ before taking part of such a sacred event. Sounds like your friend has a good grasp of the symbology regarding the Eucharist.

As a friend, I would spend a lot of time with you new brother or sister in Christ and develop that Christian relationship.

 

[Doodlebug02]

I would have a priest or a minister perform the baptism. However, it was Jesus who did the hard part of his or her salvation. The important thing that a person must confess is that Jesus is their Lord and Savior, that he died for their sins and was resurrected after the third day.

But before all this, the person needs to realize the gravity and seriousness of he or she is about to do. That repentance is a part of this walk with Christ and it will be difficult at times.

As for the Lord's Supper, I think it would be appropriate to commit to Christ before taking part of such a sacred event. Sounds like your friend has a good grasp of the symbology regarding the Eucharist.

As a friend, I would spend a lot of time with you new brother or sister in Christ and develop that Christian relationship.

Ok thank you for this advice Jeremy. I will definitely put this advice to good use.

 

[Katzpur]

Hello everyone. My best friend is a Christian but he has not yet been baptized. Can he receive the Eucharist? Also, can I baptize him? Also, does he have to believe that the Eucharist is literally the body and blood of Jesus as he has a very hard time believing this. He believes that Jesus is spiritually present but not physically present.

Why don't you just become a Christian again, Holly, just long enough to baptize him. Then you can go back to being an Eclectic Wiccan. Unless I'm mistaken, you've been a Christian enough times so far to already know the answers to those questions.

 

[Jeremy Mason]

Why don't you just become a Christian again, Holly, just long enough to baptize him. Then you can go back to being an Eclectic Wiccan. Unless I'm mistaken, you've been a Christian enough times so far to already know the answers to those questions.

Awe, the Pragmatic's Charleston. I heard Jesus doesn't dance that way and has suspended their Frequent Flier Miles.

 

[Doodlebug02]

Why don't you just become a Christian again, Holly, just long enough to baptize him. Then you can go back to being an Eclectic Wiccan. Unless I'm mistaken, you've been a Christian enough times so far to already know the answers to those questions.

If you understood the reasoning behind my constant flip flopping, you probably wouldn't be making fun of me. The reason is that I have a disorder known as borderline personality disorder. It causes instability in the way I view myself. That is a major reason why I am constantly flip flopping. So please, do not make fun of me or harass me because of my constant flip flopping.

 

[Katzpur]

If you understood the reasoning behind my constant flip flopping, you probably wouldn't be making fun of me. The reason is that I have a disorder known as borderline personality disorder. It causes instability in the way I view myself. That is a major reason why I am constantly flip flopping. So please, do not make fun of me or harass me because of my constant flip flopping.

As long as you leave Mormonism out of the equation, I'm fine with your flip-flopping. One does not flip-flop in and out of the LDS Church on a whim. That's not how it works. I don't believe I've harrassed you, but if I have, I apologize. I just hope I don't see you posting as a Mormon again. I would consider it pretty disingenuous.

 

[ayani]

Hello everyone. My best friend is a Christian but he has not yet been baptized. Can he receive the Eucharist? Also, can I baptize him? Also, does he have to believe that the Eucharist is literally the body and blood of Jesus as he has a very hard time believing this. He believes that Jesus is spiritually present but not physically present.

there are likely going to be a variety of answers on this one...

here's mine : yes, your friend can take eucharist. the eucharist is essentially a symbol of God's love for us, made incarnate in Jesus. when we eat and drink, we remember His sacrifice, which has reconciled us to God. one need not believe that the bread and wine "become" Jesus' literal flesh and blood. one need only recognize them as symbols of Jesus' love and sacrifice and, as a believer, partake of them.

as for baptism, Biblically, the apostles baptized- they were not ordained ministers or priests in the sense that we would understand today. the trouble is, that some denominations don't recognize one another's baptisms.

i would, though, to be safe, have the baptism done by a minister or pastor- someone who shepherds and teaches fellow Christians, and baptizes them into Christ. could be in a church, in a river, that wouldn't matter for me.

 

[Doodlebug02]

As long as you leave Mormonism out of the equation, I'm fine with your flip-flopping. One does not flip-flop in and out of the LDS Church on a whim. That's not how it works. I don't believe I've harrassed you, but if I have, I apologize. I just hope I don't see you posting as a Mormon again. I would consider it pretty disingenuous.

Ok. Don't worry about me posting as a Mormon again. I had my name removed from the membership records of the Mormon church earlier this year and I don't plan on going back to the Mormon church either. I have nothing against the Mormon church, it's just that I don't agree with their doctrine which most mainstream Christian churches would call unorthodox.

there are likely going to be a variety of answers on this one...

here's mine : yes, your friend can take eucharist. the eucharist is essentially a symbol of God's love for us, made incarnate in Jesus. when we eat and drink, we remember His sacrifice, which has reconciled us to God. one need not believe that the bread and wine "become" Jesus' literal flesh and blood. one need only recognize them as symbols of Jesus' love and sacrifice and, as a believer, partake of them.

as for baptism, Biblically, the apostles baptized- they were not ordained ministers or priests in the sense that we would understand today. the trouble is, that some denominations don't recognize one another's baptisms.

i would, though, to be safe, have the baptism done by a minister or pastor- someone who shepherds and teaches fellow Christians, and baptizes them into Christ. could be in a church, in a river, that wouldn't matter for me.

Thank you for this post Ayani. It is quite informative. I took my best friend to an Episcopal Church service a few weeks ago but he did not like it so I doubt he'll be coming back any time soon. He felt that the church felt like a dungeon and he felt that the service was too somber or something. But anyway, if by some miracle he does go back, I will probably make sure that he is baptized before he receives the Eucharist since most people I have talked to seem to tell me that he needs to be baptized before receiving the Eucharist.

 

[ayani]

Holly -

i can relate to his impression of the more grand and baroque churches.

they are beautiful, and impressive- yet i've found that the formal liturgy itself can often damper emphasis on the personal, daily prayer so needed in Christian life. as a Lutheran kid, i went to a church service where the entire liturgy was chanted in English. beautiful service, beautifully sung, and many dear people there. yet at age twelve i had no idea what the "Lamb of God" was, and no understanding of how Jesus was any different from any other religious figure. i had no prayer life, no inkling to read the Bible, no idea what was in there, and no real, personal faith in Christ.

does he have any prefences as far as denomination go? at the risk of sounding like an anxious hen, it's vital for him to, whether he is able to go to church or not, read the Bible, talk to God personally and daily, and grow in Christ. if he's intimidated by one church or another, one can always take a half hour in the early morning to simply talk with one's Father, read His word, pray for others, and ask Him to give one the strength and Holy Spirit to get through the day, an ambassador for Christ.

 

[ayani]

another question- is there an Anglican / Episcopal church nearby that he might like better? was it the architecture or the service of worship that he disliked?

perhaps he can still atend Bible study or prayer services there?

 

[Doodlebug02]

Holly -

i can relate to his impression of the more grand and baroque churches.

they are beautiful, and impressive- yet i've found that the formal liturgy itself can often damper emphasis on the personal, daily prayer so needed in Christian life. as a Lutheran kid, i went to a church service where the entire liturgy was chanted in English. beautiful service, beautifully sung, and many dear people there. yet at age twelve i had no idea what the "Lamb of God" was, and no understanding of how Jesus was any different from any other religious figure. i had no prayer life, no inkling to read the Bible, no idea what was in there, and no real, personal faith in Christ.

does he have any prefences as far as denomination go? at the risk of sounding like an anxious hen, it's vital for him to, whether he is able to go to church or not, read the Bible, talk to God personally and daily, and grow in Christ. if he's intimidated by one church or another, one can always take a half hour in the early morning to simply talk with one's Father, read His word, pray for others, and ask Him to give one the strength and Holy Spirit to get through the day, an ambassador for Christ.

I'm not sure if he has any preferences as far as denominations go or not.

another question- is there an Anglican / Episcopal church nearby that he might like better? was it the architecture or the service of worship that he disliked?

perhaps he can still atend Bible study or prayer services there?

I don't know if it was the architecture or the actual liturgy itself that made him not like it to be honest.

 

[sojourner]

Hello everyone. My best friend is a Christian but he has not yet been baptized. Can he receive the Eucharist? Also, can I baptize him? Also, does he have to believe that the Eucharist is literally the body and blood of Jesus as he has a very hard time believing this. He believes that Jesus is spiritually present but not physically present.

Since this question is asked in the Anglican forum, we can assume that you want to know the answers according to Anglicanism.
The ECUSA states that all Christians who have been baptized in the Name of the Trinity may receive Holy Communion. It also states that you may baptize him in the event of emergency, where no clergy are present.
The Anglican stance on the presence of Christ in the Eucharist is one of consubstantiation, not transubstantiation. Christ is physically and spiritually present, but in the form of bread of wine.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Since this question is asked in the Anglican forum, we can assume that you want to know the answers according to Anglicanism.
The ECUSA states that all Christians who have been baptized in the Name of the Trinity may receive Holy Communion. It also states that you may baptize him in the event of emergency, where no clergy are present.
The Anglican stance on the presence of Christ in the Eucharist is one of consubstantiation, not transubstantiation. Christ is physically and spiritually present, but in the form of bread of wine.

Anglicans Priests will offer Communion to those who have been baptised and received the Holy Ghost in any Trinitarian church. (Not only Anglican ones)

It is only permitted for non-ordained people to Baptise in an extreme life threatening emergency.

Most Anglicans Believe that Christ is present during the Eucharist, though it is true that some believe as the Catholics do, especially amongst High Church members.

 

[Doodlebug02]

Since this question is asked in the Anglican forum, we can assume that you want to know the answers according to Anglicanism.
The ECUSA states that all Christians who have been baptized in the Name of the Trinity may receive Holy Communion. It also states that you may baptize him in the event of emergency, where no clergy are present.
The Anglican stance on the presence of Christ in the Eucharist is one of consubstantiation, not transubstantiation. Christ is physically and spiritually present, but in the form of bread of wine.

I thought that the Episcopal Church didn't really have a definitive doctrine concerning the Eucharist? I thought that an Episcopalian was able to believe pretty much what they wanted to believe concerning the Eucharist so long as they believe in the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist?

 

[sojourner]

I would have a priest or a minister perform the baptism. However, it was Jesus who did the hard part of his or her salvation. The important thing that a person must confess is that Jesus is their Lord and Savior, that he died for their sins and was resurrected after the third day.

But before all this, the person needs to realize the gravity and seriousness of he or she is about to do. That repentance is a part of this walk with Christ and it will be difficult at times.

As for the Lord's Supper, I think it would be appropriate to commit to Christ before taking part of such a sacred event. Sounds like your friend has a good grasp of the symbology regarding the Eucharist.

As a friend, I would spend a lot of time with you new brother or sister in Christ and develop that Christian relationship.

There are several problems with your response, from a specifically Anglican POV. First, in the rite of Holy Baptism, while there is the question, "Do you turn to Jesus Christ and accept him as your Savior?" There is nothing alluding to Jesus dying for our sins and being resurrected after the third day. Therefore, for Episcopalians, those two statements are not necessary.

Secondly, since infants and small children may be baptized, they need not personally "realize the gravity and seriousness of he or she is about to do. That repentance is a part of this walk with Christ and it will be difficult at times." The parents and sponsors, who answer for them, should.

Third, for Episcopalians, it is necessary to be a baptized Christian before receiving Holy Communion.

fourth, it's not symbology. It's Presence. There's a difference. The bread and wine are not symbols of Christ. They are Christ, in some significant way.

 

[sojourner]

there are likely going to be a variety of answers on this one...

here's mine : yes, your friend can take eucharist. the eucharist is essentially a symbol of God's love for us, made incarnate in Jesus. when we eat and drink, we remember His sacrifice, which has reconciled us to God. one need not believe that the bread and wine "become" Jesus' literal flesh and blood. one need only recognize them as symbols of Jesus' love and sacrifice and, as a believer, partake of them.

as for baptism, Biblically, the apostles baptized- they were not ordained ministers or priests in the sense that we would understand today. the trouble is, that some denominations don't recognize one another's baptisms.

i would, though, to be safe, have the baptism done by a minister or pastor- someone who shepherds and teaches fellow Christians, and baptizes them into Christ. could be in a church, in a river, that wouldn't matter for me.

Problem is, the question was asked, desiring a specifically Anglican POV. Your POV is definitely not Anglican.

An unbaptized person may not receive Holy Communion.
the Eucharist is not "essentially a symbol of God's love for us." It is a participation in the Body and Blood of Christ. It is a sacrament, which is essentially different from a symbol. A symbol alludes to something. A sacrament is something. when we eat and drink, we do more than just remember. The term you're looking for is anamnesis, which means to bring the action into the present. We don't just remember what Jesus did in anamnesis. We participate with him in those actions.
Actually, since we believe what we believe about the nature of the Eucharist, recognizing the real Presence, in some way, is essential. We need to do much more than simply "recognize them as symbols..."

Actually, we believe that the Apostles were ordained and given authority by Jesus to do what they did. Since the body of the faithful have always ordered their ministry around specific offices of leadership, the "job" of baptizing has always historically been the privilege of those ordained to do so, except in cases of emergency, when an ordained person cannot be had.

 

[Al Bundy]

As long as you leave Mormonism out of the equation, I'm fine with your flip-flopping. One does not flip-flop in and out of the LDS Church on a whim. That's not how it works.

That is a silly comment and quite out of character from what I have seen of you, Katzpur. Why is it worse for her to post as a Mormon that any other religion? Worse for you maybe but not really worse than her posting as wiccan or Baptist or whatever if she doesn't believe in it.

People flip-flop out of all organized religions including LDS. What are you going to do, declare jihad on her?

(Yeah, I know that's offensive but that is how you came off.)