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Can Christians go Naked?

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
To answer your first question above,
It's quite easy, seeing that Adam and Eve were naked when God created them, then why didn't God clothed them then.
But it was only after Adam and Eve sinned then God clothed them.
But this isn't an empirical finding. It's folklore.

If I promoted a theology based on The Chronicles of Narnia or The Silmarillion I'm sure you wouldn't take me seriously -- because they have no empirical support.
Before you can quote The Bible as an authoritative historical or metaphysical work you need to provide evidence that it's true and reliable.
So it wasn't because Adam and Eve were naked, But rather because of their sin.
I Don't see how this follows. How did you come to that conclusion?
Here's what your asking me a Christian, to step outside of what God has revealed to me in his word.
No. I'm asking you to use the intelligence Nature gave you. To believe what is well evidenced, and to hold what isn't as undeternined -- pending evidence.
You are squandering God's gift of intelligence.
How do you suppose Albert Einstein came by the atomic bomb, by digging, researching, reasoning.
What about testing and peer review?

People speculate all the time, and come up with all kinds of theorems, educated guesses, and pure speculations. It's how these ideas are processed that make or break them.

Einstein's theories began as theorems. It was only after they were peer reviewed, and tested that they were found to be accurate and predictive.

Most theology isn't even testable, it's not based on reliable observation, it's not predictive or even falsifiable.

The Bible isn't a textbook, it's not a book of facts. Beliefs derived from it are faith based, not fact based.
As for your forth question above as you said
( So why did God make so few of us
civilized)
From a Christian stand point, to be civilized
means you don't take babies and abort them or kill them just hours before they are born or just after they are born.
We're using the term civilized in completely different senses. You're using it colloquially, to mean proper behavior according to your personal, Christian standpoint. I'm using it as a technical, anthropological term for a major cultural strategy.
Unto which will take us backwards to the days when people would sacrifice their children. Isn't that in some way that abortions are doing to babies.sacrificing them.
And people want to call that being civilized.
It's you who want to take us backward, into a theocratic, authoritarian Christian Republic.

Aren't we still "sacrificing" our children on battlefields all over the world? Aren't we essentially indifferent to the welfare of children -- and adults, for that matter -- after they're born? Aren't many Christian denominations strong supporters of legislation to cut back on social safety nets, welfare and training programs, maternal leave programs, &c?
This love of foetuses and indifference to people strikes me as somewhat schizophrenic and hypocritical.

There are a lot of animals that do a better job of taking care of their babies before their born and after their born, than human beings does, and people want to refer themselves as being civilized.
True. And a lot will also kill, abandon or eat their babies if they're inconvenient to maternal or group welfare.
So i guess were to return to the stone age.
And that's civilized.
FYI: Civilization is a culture type. A culture is a broad, learned, survival strategy. There are different major types: Hunter-gatherering, horticulturalist, pastoralist, agricutural, civilized, &c. A civilization has certain, definitive features: permanent towns/habitations, surplusses, a division of labor, with specialization -- including 'religious' specialists; a social hierarchy, a writing system, monumental architecture.
Child-care practices are not definitive of "Civilization."
In the way humans are going that's exactly where the human race is heading, right backwards to the stone age of not being civilized human beings.
Frankly, back to the stone age" is beginning to sound like a good idea, considering that our present 'civilization' seems unsustainable. Didn't stone age people have rich, happy lives?
 

Faithofchristian

Well-Known Member
But this isn't an empirical finding. It's folklore.

If I promoted a theology based on The Chronicles of Narnia or The Silmarillion I'm sure you wouldn't take me seriously -- because they have no empirical support.
Before you can quote The Bible as an authoritative historical or metaphysical work you need to provide evidence that it's true and reliable.
I Don't see how this follows. How did you come to that conclusion?
No. I'm asking you to use the intelligence Nature gave you. To believe what is well evidenced, and to hold what isn't as undeternined -- pending evidence.
You are squandering God's gift of intelligence.
What about testing and peer review?

People speculate all the time, and come up with all kinds of theorems, educated guesses, and pure speculations. It's how these ideas are processed that make or break them.

Einstein's theories began as theorems. It was only after they were peer reviewed, and tested that they were found to be accurate and predictive.

Most theology isn't even testable, it's not based on reliable observation, it's not predictive or even falsifiable.

The Bible isn't a textbook, it's not a book of facts. Beliefs derived from it are faith based, not fact based.
We're using the term civilized in completely different senses. You're using it colloquially, to mean proper behavior according to your personal, Christian standpoint. I'm using it as a technical, anthropological term for a major cultural strategy.
It's you who want to take us backward, into a theocratic, authoritarian Christian Republic.

Aren't we still "sacrificing" our children on battlefields all over the world? Aren't we essentially indifferent to the welfare of children -- and adults, for that matter -- after they're born? Aren't many Christian denominations strong supporters of legislation to cut back on social safety nets, welfare and training programs, maternal leave programs, &c?
This love of foetuses and indifference to people strikes me as somewhat schizophrenic and hypocritical.

True. And a lot will also kill, abandon or eat their babies if they're inconvenient to maternal or group welfare.
FYI: Civilization is a culture type. A culture is a broad, learned, survival strategy. There are different major types: Hunter-gatherering, horticulturalist, pastoralist, agricutural, civilized, &c. A civilization has certain, definitive features: permanent towns/habitations, surplusses, a division of labor, with specialization -- including 'religious' specialists; a social hierarchy, a writing system, monumental architecture.
Child-care practices are not definitive of "Civilization."
Frankly, back to the stone age" is beginning to sound like a good idea, considering that our present 'civilization' seems unsustainable. Didn't stone age people have rich, happy lives?


Have you any clue or idea what folklore is..

At lease stone age people can claim ignorance, where people of to day who claim to be civilized are more ignorance than those people of stone age people,
just how civilized and intelligent are people
to day
compared to those people of the stone age

May have to agree with you, to haved lived during the stone age

Where as people to day claim to have intelligence and to be civilized but yet live far worse than those people in the stone age.

Where as the stone age people, might not have been civilized or had intelligence,

Where as people of to day claim to be civilized and intelligence, but live far worse than the people of the stone age.
 
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Scarecrow613

New Member
They sure can. There is no actual prohibition against nudity in the Bible. Many will point to Genesis and how God clothed Adam and Eve, but he only did so after they already tried to hide from him because of the shame they had felt over their naked bodies. But who gave them this shame? It wasn't God, it was the serpent.
 

Salvador

RF's Swedenborgian
They sure can. There is no actual prohibition against nudity in the Bible. Many will point to Genesis and how God clothed Adam and Eve, but he only did so after they already tried to hide from him because of the shame they had felt over their naked bodies. But who gave them this shame? It wasn't God, it was the serpent.

I wouldn't like to see anybody's sunburned or frostbitten serpent, I humbly think it best to be covered up.
 

Skwim

Veteran Member
They sure can. There is no actual prohibition against nudity in the Bible. Many will point to Genesis and how God clothed Adam and Eve, but he only did so after they already tried to hide from him because of the shame they had felt over their naked bodies. But who gave them this shame? It wasn't God, it was the serpent.
Chapter and verse please, plus the Bible version you're using.

.
 
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columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
I wouldn't like to see anybody's sunburned or frostbitten serpent, I humbly think it best to be covered up.
What about just an ordinary old penis, like all guys have?
Why would you even notice, much less care?

Have you been brainwashed into thinking that normal human anatomy is inherently a problem?
Tom
 

1213

Well-Known Member
...
AND is such a lifestyle Biblically based sinning? Are they sinning in the eyes of God?

I have understood sin means that one rejects God, or lives without God. If they don’t reject God, I don’t think they have sin. However, there is this guide:

”All things are lawful for me," but not all things are expedient. "All things are lawful for me," but I will not be brought under the power of anything.
1 Corinthians 6:12

"All things are lawful for me," but not all things are profitable. "All things are lawful for me," but not all things build up."
1 Corinthians 10:23

I think in all cases it would be good to think, is this good, or harmful, not only to you, but to other people. I think the lifestyle is not a problem, if they don’t disturb others.
 

Salvador

RF's Swedenborgian
What about just an ordinary old penis, like all guys have?
Why would you even notice, much less care?

Have you been brainwashed into thinking that normal human anatomy is inherently a problem?
Tom

Let's just please agree there's good reason why nudist colonies don't exist in Illinois.
 

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
I bet they're not outdoors this time of year. ...:cool:
Not outdoors.
Not mostly. It's sunny and 30F here at the moment. You'd be surprised at how hardy some nudists are.

But so what? They're mostly indoors in January.
What about July? What's your problem with nudism in Illinois in the summer?
Tom
 

Salvador

RF's Swedenborgian
Not outdoors.
Not mostly. It's sunny and 30F here at the moment. You'd be surprised at how hardy some nudists are.

But so what? They're mostly indoors in January.
What about July? What's your problem with nudism in Illinois in the summer?
Tom

I used to have a nearly perfect physique, but that's back when I wore a younger man's clothes. I have no qualms with nudism in a mild environment for most anybody under the age of 40. ....:)
 

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
I used to have a nearly perfect physique, but that's back when I wore a younger man's clothes. I have no qualms with nudism in a mild environment for most anybody under the age of 40. ....:)
And why are you such an age bigot?
What difference does it make, what you think is a perfect physique?

We nudists aren't so exclusive. We don't care if you're a skinny 10y/o or a saggy 80 y/o or whatever. Just doesn't matter what you look like.
Tom
 

Salvador

RF's Swedenborgian
And why are you such an age bigot?
What difference does it make, what you think is a perfect physique?

We nudists aren't so exclusive. We don't care if you're a skinny 10y/o or a saggy 80 y/o or whatever. Just doesn't matter what you look like.
Tom

I don't expect anybody to have a perfect physique, but I'd like young healthy people having a nearly perfect healthy physique if they'd dare strut their stuff around me.
 

Scarecrow613

New Member
I am using NIV but you can use any of the standard translations, KJV, ESV, what have you. Let's start with Genesis 3:7. Their eyes were open and they realize they were naked and they sewed fig leaves together. This occurred immediately after eating the fruit.
Verse 8.
Verse 10, Adam said he was afraid because he was naked.
Verse 11 "Who told you, you were naked?" So we know it certainly wasn't God.
12-20. Their version of the story and the curse.
So let's put it all together. Adam and Eve were innocent before they ate the fruit. The serpent deceived them and they ate the fruit. At that moment they were ashamed because they were naked, but why feel ashamed? Didn't God just say "it was good?" What changed about their condition? They disobeyed God and now had knowledge of evil. What hadn't changed was their state of dress, not until they sewed fig leaves for themselves. Adam admits to being ashamed. God later makes them better clothes after the curse changed the environment making it more harsh.
 
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