Buddhism

[firedragon]

This thread is based on my anecdotal experience in this forum purely with different types of Buddhists and there are some clarifications that I believe needs clarified.

Even some other religions other than Buddhism use Buddhist scripture for their religion. In Islam, some very modern apologists use some Buddhist scripture for their benefit, but I have never encountered Islamic theology that bases itself in the Buddhist background claiming Maithreya was the prophet Muhammed for example. But the Bahai's directly make it a big deal to claim Bahaullah was the Maithreya as cited in the Tipitaka, specifically chakkavatti Sutta, in the Dheega Nikaaya. Thats just a prelude.

There is a 550 Jathaka Katha, or the 550 stories of being born as a direct translation in Therawadha Buddhism. There are some here who were ex, therawadha priests who are highly educated in the Therawadha tradition so I am sure they can provide a lot of insight.

Anyway, though this book is called 550 life stories, it actually contains 547 which is obviously rounded to 550 which is justified as a title.

Do all sects of Buddhism follow this tradition of the Jathaka stories? Do the Bahai's follow these stories? How do you explain some of the Nidhana stories of the Dhammapadha without these stories?

Would anyone care to give a penny for this thought?

Thank you very much in advance.

 

[Twilight Hue]

This thread is based on my anecdotal experience in this forum purely with different types of Buddhists and there are some clarifications that I believe needs clarified.

Even some other religions other than Buddhism use Buddhist scripture for their religion. In Islam, some very modern apologists use some Buddhist scripture for their benefit, but I have never encountered Islamic theology that bases itself in the Buddhist background claiming Maithreya was the prophet Muhammed for example. But the Bahai's directly make it a big deal to claim Bahaullah was the Maithreya as cited in the Tipitaka, specifically chakkavatti Sutta, in the Dheega Nikaaya. Thats just a prelude.

There is a 550 Jathaka Katha, or the 550 stories of being born as a direct translation in Therawadha Buddhism. There are some here who were ex, therawadha priests who are highly educated in the Therawadha tradition so I am sure they can provide a lot of insight.

Anyway, though this book is called 550 life stories, it actually contains 547 which is obviously rounded to 550 which is justified as a title.

Do all sects of Buddhism follow this tradition of the Jathaka stories? Do the Bahai's follow these stories? How do you explain some of the Nidhana stories of the Dhammapadha without these stories?

Would anyone care to give a penny for this thought?

Thank you very much in advance.

Just to help.


Theravada.

Not Therawadha, although that has a nice native ring to it. ;0]

 

[firedragon]

Just to help.


Theravada.

Not Therawadha, although that has a nice native ring to it. ;0]

Is that the correct transliteration? Wow. Thanks for the enlightenment.

But that's irrelevant. I am just writing as it sounds as much as possible. D is non existent in the Pali word Therawadha. Its only Dh that's existent.

So if you wish to have ao linguistic discussion about how it should be spelled to depict the original Pali language, we can have that discussion which is irrelevant to this thread, in another thread. I will look forward to that discussion.

Thanks.

 

[sun rise]

Hopefully some Buddhists can answer your questions in the OP with some detail but I have a few anecdotes.

One is a book "That's Funny, You Don't Look Buddhist: On Being a Faithful Jew and a Passionate Buddhist" that explores how the author reconciled the two religions in her own life.

The other two incidents are related to my exploration of Buddhism years ago, specifically Zen and Tibetan. In my reading and visiting a Zen and a Tibetan center, the focus was on meditation and the 8 fold way. In the Zen center, members picked up litter on the highway instead of begging because begging was an Eastern tradition not applicable in the West. In the Tibetan center, there were work hours when people worked what they were drawn to or repelled by: bothered by dirt, then you cleaned during the work period.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Is that the correct transliteration? Wow. Thanks for the enlightenment.

But that's irrelevant. I am just writing as it sounds as much as possible. D is non existent in the Pali word Therawadha. Its only Dh that's existent.

So if you wish to have ao linguistic discussion about how it should be spelled to depict the original Pali language, we can have that discussion which is irrelevant to this thread, in another thread. I will look forward to that discussion.

Thanks.

I figured you came across Therawadha monastery in Sri Lanka somewhere, but they follow Pureland Buddhism.

 

[firedragon]

I figured you came across Therawadha monastery in Sri Lanka somewhere, but they follow Pureland Buddhism.

Thats irrelevant. I was speaking of principles in Buddhism, not some monastery somewhere.

 

[firedragon]

Hopefully some Buddhists can answer your questions in the OP with some detail but I have a few anecdotes.

One is a book "That's Funny, You Don't Look Buddhist: On Being a Faithful Jew and a Passionate Buddhist" that explores how the author reconciled the two religions in her own life.

The other two incidents are related to my exploration of Buddhism years ago, specifically Zen and Tibetan. In my reading and visiting a Zen and a Tibetan center, the focus was on meditation and the 8 fold way. In the Zen center, members picked up litter on the highway instead of begging because begging was an Eastern tradition not applicable in the West. In the Tibetan center, there were work hours when people worked what they were drawn to or repelled by: bothered by dirt, then you cleaned during the work period.

Interesting.

Begging in Buddhism was called pindapatha. In one of the Jathaka, Rajjumala was in a lofty tower being tortured by her husband and the Bodhisattva notices it when he was out begging. This had become a Buddhist tradition to go begging for sustenance.

So I cant understand really how picking litter is a replacement of this tradition. Or was it meant as a replacement?

 

[sun rise]

So I cant understand really how picking litter is a replacement of this tradition. Or was it meant as a replacement?

It's been quite a while but I found something that tickled my memory:

As a monastic living at Sravasti Abbey, I find the practice of accepting alms very helpful for developing positive qualities, such as humility (as you mentioned in your question), contentment (we are not supposed to be choosy, but accept whatever is offered), and non-greed (not constantly wanting more and better things).

In the particular center I visited, I think it's fair to say that they substituted picking up litter as a means to help develop the positive quality of humility as accepting alms are designed to do. And removing litter helps others as well which is another goal.

There's another article I found that discusses this Zen and the Art of Begging which speaks directly to what I experienced a long time ago:

Why is it that Americans have embraced zazen meditation and yet do not incorporate takuhatsu in their practice? Even many Japanese teachers say, “Takuhatsu is impossible for Americans.” They may have been reticent to transmit the practice in America for several reasons. We are a violent nation; Americans are outspoken and don’t hesitate to belittle or ridicule what we don’t understand. In takuhatsu, there is no cover from the dangerous, the rude or obscene. Japanese teachers may have seen the practice as too controversial, too problematic outside their own culture, and felt that to establish it at all, takuhatsu had to be acceptable to society.

 

[firedragon]

It's been quite a while but I found something that tickled my memory:

As a monastic living at Sravasti Abbey, I find the practice of accepting alms very helpful for developing positive qualities, such as humility (as you mentioned in your question), contentment (we are not supposed to be choosy, but accept whatever is offered), and non-greed (not constantly wanting more and better things).

In the particular center I visited, I think it's fair to say that they substituted picking up litter as a means to help develop the positive quality of humility as accepting alms are designed to do. And removing litter helps others as well which is another goal.

There's another article I found that discusses this Zen and the Art of Begging which speaks directly to what I experienced a long time ago:

Why is it that Americans have embraced zazen meditation and yet do not incorporate takuhatsu in their practice? Even many Japanese teachers say, “Takuhatsu is impossible for Americans.” They may have been reticent to transmit the practice in America for several reasons. We are a violent nation; Americans are outspoken and don’t hesitate to belittle or ridicule what we don’t understand. In takuhatsu, there is no cover from the dangerous, the rude or obscene. Japanese teachers may have seen the practice as too controversial, too problematic outside their own culture, and felt that to establish it at all, takuhatsu had to be acceptable to society.

Very interesting. Thanks a lot.

I am not very astute in the Mahayana Buddhism. It has spread thin and grown into where ever it spread, in my opinion. So its very hard to really study it well. And its a case study for sociology of religion students. Interesting.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

This thread is based on my anecdotal experience in this forum purely with different types of Buddhists and there are some clarifications that I believe needs clarified.

Even some other religions other than Buddhism use Buddhist scripture for their religion. In Islam, some very modern apologists use some Buddhist scripture for their benefit, but I have never encountered Islamic theology that bases itself in the Buddhist background claiming Maithreya was the prophet Muhammed for example. But the Bahai's directly make it a big deal to claim Bahaullah was the Maithreya as cited in the Tipitaka, specifically chakkavatti Sutta, in the Dheega Nikaaya. Thats just a prelude.

There is a 550 Jathaka Katha, or the 550 stories of being born as a direct translation in Therawadha Buddhism. There are some here who were ex, therawadha priests who are highly educated in the Therawadha tradition so I am sure they can provide a lot of insight.

Anyway, though this book is called 550 life stories, it actually contains 547 which is obviously rounded to 550 which is justified as a title.

Do all sects of Buddhism follow this tradition of the Jathaka stories? Do the Bahai's follow these stories? How do you explain some of the Nidhana stories of the Dhammapadha without these stories?

Would anyone care to give a penny for this thought?

Thank you very much in advance.

The theology for this comes from the Kitab-i-iqan. In the Kitab-i-iqan Baha'u'llah has explained how the Messengers are all Connected, that they are all the reflection of the One same Holy Spirit.

No need to expand on that here.

No a Baha'i would not have even necessarily read all these stories, maybe a few only.

That is the bounty of the 'Hidden Words', as that book is offered as the Essence of 547 life stories.

This is why a Baha'i will comment on other scriptures, as the more we read the Hidden Words and try to understand them, the more we can consider the Essence of the meaning of the Words given in past scriptures.

"HE IS THE GLORY OF GLORIES

THIS is that which hath descended from the realm of glory, uttered by the tongue of power and might, and revealed unto the Prophets of old. We have taken the inner essence thereof and clothed it in the garment of brevity, as a token of grace unto the righteous, that they may stand faithful unto the Covenant of God, may fulfill in their lives His trust, and in the realm of spirit obtain the gem of divine virtue."

The Hidden Words | Bahá’í Reference Library

Regards Tony

 

[firedragon]

The theology for this comes from the Kitab-i-iqan. In the Kitab-i-iqan Baha'u'llah has explained how the Messengers are all Connected, that they are all the reflection of the One same Holy Spirit.

Yeah. Kithab I iqan is not a Buddhist source and is just concocting things if that is your theology.

No a Baha'i would not have even necessarily read all these stories, maybe a few only.

What are the stories you have read?

That is the bounty of the 'Hidden Words', as that book is offered as the Essence of 547 life stories.

No its not.

I am not gonna respond to the rest of the post because its just preaching.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Yeah. Kithab I iqan is not a Buddhist source and is just concocting things if that is your theology.

What are the stories you have read?

No its not.

I am not gonna respond to the rest of the post because its just preaching.

OK

Regards Tony

 

[firedragon]

OK

Regards Tony

Sorry to say this Tony, but I have asked every single Bahai gentleman and lady in this forum, and no one has ever read a single story you claimed the Bahai's read. Maybe other Bahais outside this forum do read and have read. I personally have read Bahai scholars' books, and some like Juan Cole (though he has left the faith now) are some of the most highly acclaimed scholars. But the layman propagandists in this forum have not even studied their own scripture, leaving Buddhist scripture aside.

You didnt tell me what are the stories from the Jathaka Katha Vattu you have read. I asked you.

 

[firedragon]

The theology for this comes from the Kitab-i-iqan. In the Kitab-i-iqan Baha'u'llah has explained how the Messengers are all Connected, that they are all the reflection of the One same Holy Spirit.

Can you quote the verse in the Kithab I iqan that mentions the Buddha, Buddhism, or Buddhist scripture? Chapter verse of your book, and chapter verse of the Buddhist scripture please.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

But the layman propagandists in this forum have not even studied their own scripture, leaving Buddhist scripture aside.

I will leave you with those thoughts.

RegardsTony

 

[firedragon]

I will leave you with those thoughts.

RegardsTony

Sorry to say this Tony, but that's all one could do. Because, let me tell you directly, most of your claims in this thread, within the posts you replied with to my questions, were all false, and just made up.

The problem seems to be you think everyone is illiterate in the Bahai scripture.

Cheers.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

The problem seems to be you think everyone is illiterate in the Bahai scripture.

I am happy for others to search for themselves and make up their own minds.

Regards Tony