Book of Daniel fulfilled.

[Brian Schuh]

This is all news to me. Do you have any links?

I cited the chapters and verses above. Unsure if it is on internet. I have an unpublished manuscript here with endnotes and bibliography citing these quotes.

 

[Quagmire]

I cited the chapters and verses above. Unsure if it is on internet. I have an unpublished manuscript here with endnotes and bibliography citing these quotes.

Well, I appreciate the effort but that doesn't really help: the chances of finding the material you cite, on the internet, formatted in such a way that anyone can actually pin-point specific passages is almost nill.

Not your fault.

 

[Brian Schuh]

Well, I appreciate the effort but that doesn't really help: the chances of finding the material you cite, on the internet, formatted in such a way that anyone can actually pin-point specific passages is almost nill.

Not your fault.

I'm sure you can go to a library. Ya know there are things called books, people used to read these things we call books before there was an internet. No matter how much one denies it, people in 66 C.E. saw many "phantoms" come out of the earth and armies in the clouds. And it is recorded by legitimate historians who didn't expect to be believed and it happened at a time pointed to by not only Mathew 24, but also Daniel 12.

 

[Quagmire]

I'm sure you can go to a library. Ya know there are things called books,

I've heard of those. In fact, I happen to be sitting in a library right now (and thank you: now I know what all those rectangular things with titles ruining down their sides are for).

If I knew you better I might actually stand up and go looking for some of the books you're talking about, but here's the problem: for all I know I may spend the next hour digging through various tomes until I finally locate some of the things your talking about only to find that it's all been taken out of context, mis-translated by whatever version you're using, or, worst of all, that the passages say something completely unrelated to what you're claiming.

In other words, it could well turn out to be an entirely wasted hour, and experience suggests to me that it most probably would be.

In any case, since we're communicating via the internet, it's just considered common courtesy to supply links when making claims.

Telling someone "You can go" is bound to get you a reply suggesting where you can go. And rightly so.

people used to read these things we call books before there was an internet. No matter how much one denies it, people in 66 C.E. saw many "phantoms" come out of the earth and armies in the clouds.

Or so a few people say.

And it is recorded by legitimate historians who didn't expect to be believed and it happened at a time pointed to by not only Mathew 24, but also Daniel 12.

According to a few mostly self-serving interpretations.

 

[fantome profane]

What does he mean by "inkblot" theology?

Maybe you should address that question to him @Jayhawker Soule . You might start an interesting conversation.

 

[Brian Schuh]

I've heard of those. In fact, I happen to be sitting in a library right now (and thank you: now I know what all those rectangular things with titles ruining down their sides are for).

If I knew you better I might actually stand up and go looking for some of the books you're talking about, but here's the problem: for all I know I may spend the next hour digging through various tomes until I finally locate some of the things your talking about only to find that it's all been taken out of context, mis-translated by whatever version you're using, or, worst of all, that the passages say something completely unrelated to what you're claiming.

In other words, it could well turn out to be an entirely wasted hour, and experience suggests to me that it most probably would be.

In any case, since we're communicating via the internet, it's just considered common courtesy to supply links when making claims.

Telling someone "You can go" is bound to get you a reply suggesting where you can go. And rightly so.



Or so a few people say.



According to a few mostly self-serving interpretations.

Josephus was Jewish, it wasn't self serving to record a son of man with an army in the sky, although subsequently he became a believer, and Tacitus was a pagan, he didn't care either way.

Although you don't know me, it is worth investigating. Daniel D. Morais wrote the unpublished manuscript I have here. He has a website explaining some of this. He calls himself a preterist. Try Google searching his name and the words preterism and Revelation, you might find his website.

 

[Quagmire]

Josephus was Jewish, it wasn't self serving to record a son of man with an army in the sky, although subsequently he became a believer, and Tacitus was a pagan, he didn't care either way.

Although you don't know me, it is worth investigating. Daniel D. Morais wrote the unpublished manuscript I have here. He has a website explaining some of this. He calls himself a preterist. Try Google searching his name and the words preterism and Revelation, you might find his website.

OK thanks.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Much of this passage was not only written after Alexander the Great, but written after the fall of Masada in the year 74 C.E. considering how accurately it described history no matter how brief.

From Wikipedia: Daniel#Dating

Daniel's exclusion from the Hebrew Bible's canon of the prophets, which was closed around 200 BC, suggests it was not known at that time, and the Wisdom of Sirach, from around 180 BC, draws on almost every book of the Old Testament except Daniel, leading scholars to suppose that its author was unaware of it. Daniel is, however, quoted by the author of a section of the Sibylline Oracles commonly dated to the middle of the 2nd century BC, and was popular at Qumran beginning at much the same time, suggesting that it was known and revered from the middle of that century.[40]​

The prophecies contained in the book are accurate down to the career of Antiochus IV Epiphanes, king of Syria and oppressor of the Jews, but not in its prediction of his death: the author seems to know about Antiochus' two campaigns in Egypt (169 and 167 BC), the desecration of the Temple (the "abomination of desolation"), and the fortification of the Akra (a fortress built inside Jerusalem), but he seems to know nothing about the reconstruction of the Temple or about the actual circumstances of Antiochus' death in late 164. Chapters 10–12 must therefore have been written between 167 and 164 BC. There is no evidence of a significant time lapse between those chapters and chapters 8 and 9, and chapter 7 may have been written just a few months earlier again.[41]

Jesus said that his generation would not pass till they saw the sign of the son of man with his angels in the sky. Daniel 12 said many that sleep in the earth would rise. These were seen in 66 C.E. the historians Josephus, Tacitus and Suetonius and Cassius Dio wrote about it.

References?

 

[Flankerl]

I once fulfilled my hunger for food.

Thus I never again had to fulfil it.


At least according to some people.

 

[Brian Schuh]

From Wikipedia: Daniel#Dating

Daniel's exclusion from the Hebrew Bible's canon of the prophets, which was closed around 200 BC, suggests it was not known at that time, and the Wisdom of Sirach, from around 180 BC, draws on almost every book of the Old Testament except Daniel, leading scholars to suppose that its author was unaware of it. Daniel is, however, quoted by the author of a section of the Sibylline Oracles commonly dated to the middle of the 2nd century BC, and was popular at Qumran beginning at much the same time, suggesting that it was known and revered from the middle of that century.[40]​

The prophecies contained in the book are accurate down to the career of Antiochus IV Epiphanes, king of Syria and oppressor of the Jews, but not in its prediction of his death: the author seems to know about Antiochus' two campaigns in Egypt (169 and 167 BC), the desecration of the Temple (the "abomination of desolation"), and the fortification of the Akra (a fortress built inside Jerusalem), but he seems to know nothing about the reconstruction of the Temple or about the actual circumstances of Antiochus' death in late 164. Chapters 10–12 must therefore have been written between 167 and 164 BC. There is no evidence of a significant time lapse between those chapters and chapters 8 and 9, and chapter 7 may have been written just a few months earlier again.[41]



References?

I cited chapter and passage numbers above earlier in thread.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I cited chapter and passage numbers above earlier in thread.

So?

Please site which passage of Daniel was penned "after the fall of Masada in the year 74 C.E." given:

The Book of Daniel is preserved in the twelve-chapter Masoretic Text and in two longer Greek versions, the original Septuagint version, c. 100 BC, and the later Theodotion version from c. 2nd century AD. [ibid]

It really helps to know what one is talking about before presuming to teach others.

 

[Brian Schuh]

So?

Please site which passage of Daniel was penned "after the fall of Masada in the year 74 C.E." given:



It really helps to know what one is talking about before presuming to teach others.

Daniel 11 describes history so well, I thought it might be an after the fact report, if you prove that wrong, it had to be a prophecy.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Daniel 11 describes history so well, I thought it might be an after the fact report, if you prove that wrong, it had to be a prophecy.

Rubbish.

Again:

The prophecies contained in the book are accurate down to the career of Antiochus IV Epiphanes, king of Syria and oppressor of the Jews, but not in its prediction of his death: the author seems to know about Antiochus' two campaigns in Egypt (169 and 167 BC), the desecration of the Temple (the "abomination of desolation"), and the fortification of the Akra (a fortress built inside Jerusalem), but he seems to know nothing about the reconstruction of the Temple or about the actual circumstances of Antiochus' death in late 164. Chapters 10–12 must therefore have been written between 167 and 164 BC. There is no evidence of a significant time lapse between those chapters and chapters 8 and 9, and chapter 7 may have been written just a few months earlier again. [ibid]

You evidence little or no knowledge of Israel or Daniel. I suggest that you stop embarrassing yourself.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

From The Jewish Study Bible:

Because of the detailed nature of apocalyptic timetables, the dating of at least the last chs [sic] of Daniel can be established precisely. Scholars consider the predictions in this book, as in other apocalypses, to be prophecies after the fact, purportedly written down cenruries earlier and kept sectret in order to give credence to other predictions about the end of history. The recounting of history, then, though symbolic, can be matched quite easily with the history of the ancient Near East in the Greek period, The predictions are detailed and accurate until the end of the Maccabean revolt in 164. At that point, however, they veer dramatically from what we know of the actions of the Seleucid kink (see annotations to ch 11), and scholars assume that the author lived and wrote at that precise time when the predictions become inaccurate. [pg. 1641,2]

So we have @Brian Schuh on the one hand and relevant scholarship on the other. Such a difficult choice!

 

[Brian Schuh]

Look at www.revelationrevolution.org. I am amused that one would cite Wikipedia to "prove" anything. Didn't Jesus say something once about pearls and swine? While I don't agree with everything Daniel D. Morais put on above website, it is on the right track. Check it out.

 

[Brian Schuh]

I once fulfilled my hunger for food.

Thus I never again had to fulfil it.


At least according to some people.

I once fulfilled my hunger for food.

Thus I never again had to fulfil it.


At least according to some people.

Kind of like Jesus fulfilled the law by keeping it perfectly. Does that mean we don't need to fulfill it again in our lives? Of course, we all need to fulfill the law. As for prophecy, there are often multiple fulfillments of same prophecy.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Look at www.revelationrevolution.org. I am amused that one would cite Wikipedia to "prove" anything. Didn't Jesus say something once about pearls and swine? While I don't agree with everything Daniel D. Morais put on above website, it is on the right track. Check it out.

No doubt you are also 'amused' by the scholarship to be found in the Jewish Study Bible. As I said before:

So we have @Brian Schuh on the one hand and relevant scholarship on the other. Such a difficult choice!

 

[Brian Schuh]

No doubt you are also 'amused' by the scholarship to be found in the Jewish Study Bible. As I said before:

​

I am quite familiar with the traditional interpretation of the book of Daniel being written to give hope to those during the crisis of Antiochus Epiphanies desecrating the Temple. One cannot be such a learned man such as myself without this "Daniel 101."

With that being said, my teacher Dr. Schulman, a physicist and Torah scholar admits some strange things were reported in 66 C.E. including phantoms coming out of the earth and armies in the sky in fulfillment of Daniel 12. Daniel 11:36 to the end of book coincide with history beginning with Augustus Caesar who was exalted above everything to the fall of Masada 1335 days after Temple was destroyed.

Not all Judaism is created equal. I would not doubt that your "Jewish" study Bible is probably from Reform Judaism.

 

[Brian Schuh]

From Wikipedia: Daniel#Dating

Daniel's exclusion from the Hebrew Bible's canon of the prophets, which was closed around 200 BC, suggests it was not known at that time, and the Wisdom of Sirach, from around 180 BC, draws on almost every book of the Old Testament except Daniel, leading scholars to suppose that its author was unaware of it. Daniel is, however, quoted by the author of a section of the Sibylline Oracles commonly dated to the middle of the 2nd century BC, and was popular at Qumran beginning at much the same time, suggesting that it was known and revered from the middle of that century.[40]​

The prophecies contained in the book are accurate down to the career of Antiochus IV Epiphanes, king of Syria and oppressor of the Jews, but not in its prediction of his death: the author seems to know about Antiochus' two campaigns in Egypt (169 and 167 BC), the desecration of the Temple (the "abomination of desolation"), and the fortification of the Akra (a fortress built inside Jerusalem), but he seems to know nothing about the reconstruction of the Temple or about the actual circumstances of Antiochus' death in late 164. Chapters 10–12 must therefore have been written between 167 and 164 BC. There is no evidence of a significant time lapse between those chapters and chapters 8 and 9, and chapter 7 may have been written just a few months earlier again.[41]



References?

There is a 130 year gap between verses 35 and 36 in chapter 11, leading scholars to falsely believe the wilful King of verse 36 is Antiochus Epiphanies. And don't get caught up on Caesar Augustus being called a king, it simply means a ruler. Like later in the passage, Cleopatra was called the " King " of the South. It just means a ruler.

 

[Flankerl]

Kind of like Jesus fulfilled the law by keeping it perfectly. Does that mean we don't need to fulfill it again in our lives? Of course, we all need to fulfill the law. As for prophecy, there are often multiple fulfillments of same prophecy.

So this Jesus person menstruated and gave birth.

That's a bit weird.