Atheists: If God existed would God……

[TransmutingSoul]

Was Abraham and Moses human and divine? Was Muhammad? And, if Baha'is include Adam and Noah as manifestations, were they also human and divine? These are just Baha'i beliefs. Lots of religions have their "God/men". And lots of religions claim some of their prophets to be Gods or incarnations of Gods. But are they? When it comes to incarnations, Baha'is say "no". And how do you know that? It all comes down to your beliefs based on your religion.

All the Messengers are both Divine and Human.

"... Even as He hath revealed: “No distinction do We make between any of His Messengers.” For they, one and all, summon the people of the earth to acknowledge the unity of God, and herald unto them the Kawthar of an infinite grace and bounty. They are all invested with the robe of prophethood, and are honored with the mantle of glory..."

Bahá'í Reference Library - Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, Pages 50-56

Regards Tony

 

[John53]

So what if one passage fits the definition of a story?

If you look at one quote and draw conclusions as if one quote represents the Baha'i Writings, that is called the fallacy of hasty generalization and the fallacy of jumping to conclusions.

The Baha'i Writings are expansive, more expansive than the silly Bible.

Like usual you provide no evidence for your claims.

(I fully expect your usual childish response.)

 

[Aupmanyav]

".. Even as He hath revealed: .."

Revealed to Bahaollah alone and to none other, unfortunately. And there is no further evidence for that, unfortunately.

The Baha'i Writings are expansive, more expansive than the silly Bible.

Right, Trailblazer, in our school examinations, we tried to fill as many pages as we could in the answer book, in hope of getting better grades.
Later, we come to know that what we write is important, not how expansive our writing has been.
But a nice way to address Bible and Christians. Same for Quran or BhagawadGita, and Muslims or Hindus. Silly book, Trailblazer?

I fully expect your usual childish response.

Not just childish but also highly deplorable, just like that of an ill mannered child.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Revealed to Bahaollah alone and to none other, unfortunately. And there is no further evidence for that, unfortunately.
Right, Trailblazer, in our school examinations, we tried to fill as many pages as we could in the answer book, in hope of getting better grades.
Later, we come to know that what we write is important, not how expansive our writing has been.
But a nice way to address Bible and Christians. Same for Quran or BhagawadGita, and Muslims or Hindus. Silly books, Trailblazer?

I would offer that there is the Bible where Abdul'baha offered this is applicable,

"THIS book is the Holy Book of God, of celestial Inspiration. It is the Bible of Salvation, the noble Gospel. It is the mystery of the Kingdom and its light. It is the Divine Bounty, the sign of the guidance of God, Abdul Baha Abbas."

And then there is the Bible that some people presented to us these days, that is entirely in opposition to a scientific mind.

Thus I depends how blunt one wants to offer the later, one could offer in one word, Silly! Personally I just offer what the Baha'i Scriptures offer, which is inclusive of the quote above by Abdul'baha.

Regards Tony

 

[Aupmanyav]

In that case, kindly ask Trailblazer to be more respectful of other religions, their followers and their books.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

The Baha'i Writings are expansive, more expansive than the silly Bible.

I watched a few shows today Susan and I too have concluded we live in a world that takes us to the brink of insanity. It is very frustrating indeed as to what a silly world we now have and live in.

Imagine with the science we have these days that some use the Bible to argue that the world is still round and that Jesus will come cloud surfing to pick up a few blessed souls.

I feel your frustration and I wish you all the best.

Love from Annette and I, Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

In that case, kindly ask Trailblazer to be more respectful of other religions, their followers and their books.

I wonder if they will reciprocate? After all I know Susan only wants peace and unity. Susan has chosen a hard audience to deliver that to, and usually it is the exclusive religious opponents that come and give the most rubbish in return. Most Athiests are better balanced.

Maybe we can all show more compassion?

Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

what a silly world we now have and live in.

and it will remain silly until more people recognize Baha'u'llah...
The naysayers think they bother me? I have had to endure real tests, but....

. . . and he that placeth his complete trust in God, God shall, verily, protect him from whatsoever may harm him, and shield him from the wickedness of every evil plotter.
Bahá’u’lláh, Gleanings from the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 233

And if he feareth not God, God will make him to fear all things; whereas all things fear him who feareth God.
Bahá’u’lláh, The Four Valleys, p. 58

Armed with the power of Thy name nothing can ever hurt me, and with Thy love in my heart all the world's afflictions can in no wise alarm me.
Bahá’u’lláh, Prayers and Meditations by Bahá’u’lláh, p. 208

It took me a while, but I finally realized that when everything else is taken away, all I have left is God.
It's a hard lesson.

 

[ppp]

If you look at one quote and draw conclusions as if one quote represents the Baha'i Writings,

Since I have read the book, and I know that the whole thing continues in that vein, I am going to ask you to take your ill-considered assumptions about my assumptions and dump them in the rubbish bin.

The Baha'i Writings are expansive, more expansive than the silly Bible.

And the silly Ba'hai writings are far, far less expansive than the Star Trek writings.

.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

and it remain silly until more people recognize Baha'u'llah...
The naysayers think they bother me? I have had to endure real tests, but....

. . . and he that placeth his complete trust in God, God shall, verily, protect him from whatsoever may harm him, and shield him from the wickedness of every evil plotter.
Bahá’u’lláh, Gleanings from the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 233

And if he feareth not God, God will make him to fear all things; whereas all things fear him who feareth God.
Bahá’u’lláh, The Four Valleys, p. 58

Armed with the power of Thy name nothing can ever hurt me, and with Thy love in my heart all the world's afflictions can in no wise alarm me.
Bahá’u’lláh, Prayers and Meditations by Bahá’u’lláh, p. 208

It took me a while, but I finally realized that when everything else is taken away, all I have left is God.
It's a hard lesson.

Reminds of this prayer that I offer every morning. Note the start of the 2nd verse, that has always made me think. Many writings tells us where to put our ultimate trust.

"The following commune is to be read … every day:
O God! O God! This is a broken-winged bird and his flight is very slow—assist him so that he may fly toward the apex of prosperity and salvation, wing his way with the utmost joy and happiness throughout the illimitable space, raise his melody in Thy Supreme Name in all the regions, exhilarate the ears with this call, and brighten the eyes by beholding the signs of guidance.

O Lord! I am single, alone and lowly. For me there is no support save Thee, no helper except Thee and no sustainer beside Thee. Confirm me in Thy service, assist me with the cohorts of Thy angels, make me victorious in the promotion of Thy Word and suffer me to speak out Thy wisdom amongst Thy creatures. Verily, Thou art the helper of the weak and the defender of the little ones, and verily Thou art the Powerful, the Mighty and the Unconstrained. —‘Abdu’l-Bahá"

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

And the silly Ba'hai writings are far, far less expansive than the Star Trek writings.

But also



Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

Since I have read the book, and I know that the whole thing continues in that vein, I am going to ask you to take your ill-considered assumptions about my assumptions and dump them in the rubbish bin.

And the silly Ba'hai writings are far, far less expansive than the Star Trek writings.

Do you really think I care what you think of the Baha'i Writings?
Think again.

 

[Trailblazer]

Reminds of this prayer that I offer every morning. Note the start of the 2nd verse, that has always made me think. Many writings tells us where to put our ultimate trust.

"The following commune is to be read … every day:
O God! O God! This is a broken-winged bird and his flight is very slow—assist him so that he may fly toward the apex of prosperity and salvation, wing his way with the utmost joy and happiness throughout the illimitable space, raise his melody in Thy Supreme Name in all the regions, exhilarate the ears with this call, and brighten the eyes by beholding the signs of guidance.

O Lord! I am single, alone and lowly. For me there is no support save Thee, no helper except Thee and no sustainer beside Thee. Confirm me in Thy service, assist me with the cohorts of Thy angels, make me victorious in the promotion of Thy Word and suffer me to speak out Thy wisdom amongst Thy creatures. Verily, Thou art the helper of the weak and the defender of the little ones, and verily Thou art the Powerful, the Mighty and the Unconstrained. —‘Abdu’l-Bahá"

Regards Tony

That is one of my favorite prayers. I memorized that prayer over 40 years ago along with about 20 other prayers, including the Tablet of Ahmad.... and I still have it memorized...
I have an eidetic memory.

 

[John53]

Do you really think I care what you think of the Baha'i Writings?
Think again.

@TransmutingSoul Look at the peace in unity in action.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I watched a few shows today Susan and I too have concluded we live in a world that takes us to the brink of insanity. It is very frustrating indeed as to what a silly world we now have and live in.
Imagine with the science we have these days that some use the Bible to argue that the world is still round and that Jesus will come cloud surfing to pick up a few blessed souls.

All your God' doing. No one else to blame.
Et tu, Tony? You too believe that Bible is a silly book? I did not expect this from you. Then, I think, there is nothing more to say.
Then why do you believe that any God created Adam from soil? And LGBTQ are an abomination.
And Jesus did come surfing. Don't you believe that?

I wonder if they will reciprocate?

Why should you worry about that. You do your duty. That is what we Hindus are asked to do.

"yoga-sthaḥ kuru karmāṇi, saṅgaṁ tyaktvā dhanañjaya;
siddhy-asiddhyoḥ samo bhūtvā, samatvaṁ yoga ucyate." BG 2.48

"Perform your duty equipoised, O Arjuna, abandoning all attachment to success or failure. Such equanimity is called yoga."

 

[TransmutingSoul]

That is one of my favorite prayers. I memorized that prayer over 40 years ago along with about 20 other prayers, including the Tablet of Ahmad.... and I still have it memorized...
I have an eidetic memory.

Well done you. I have always meant to do that with the Tablet of Ahmad. Maybe now is the time to do just that, learn well this Tablet and chant it during thy days .

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Et tu, Tony? You too believe that Bible is a silly book? I did not expect this from you. Then, I think, there is nothing more to say.

That is a demonstration that people read into what was said what was not said and offer it back incorrectly.

I did not say what you offered, I was careful with what I offered so it could not be taken in that way.

Regards Tony

 

[Aupmanyav]

and it will remain silly until more people recognize Baha'u'llah..

Wow, I did not know that you were so much against Bible. Being against Bible is being against Christians. Won't you need the help of Christians who follow a silly book to bring peace and brotherhood, or you think that they would be taken care of by the Bahai militia when the time comes?

.. promotion of Thy Word - ‘Abdu’l-Bahá"

Whose word? God's or Bahaollah's? No evidence is available for either. Why would not Abdul Baha say so? After all, it was a family enterprise and Bahaollah was his father.

 

[Sheldon]

Why assume that God did, when you cannot even prove it?
Any cancer researcher would laugh in your face and you know it.

@lewisnotmiller said that atheists don't blame God for anything and I told him almost all atheists I know blame God for everything that is bad in this world, everything they don't like. The evidence is readily available as it is plastered all over this forum.

I think you might be confusing a rational extrapolation of theistic claims, with an actual belief atheists hold. if it helps atheists don't believe any deity exists, thus blaming it for anything would be irrational, so if you think they're doing this you've likely misunderstood the context of an argument against a specific theistic claim, with a belief someone is asserting.

 

[Sheldon]

No, I was not using free will as an excuse. I said that free will does not cause cancer, but that does not mean that God causes cancer. It is not an either/or, either God causes cancer or free will causes cancer. Sometimes **** just happens and the cause is unknown.

Don't you think it's a bit suspect that different deities receive the approbation of adherents for all the "good" stuff, but a shrug of a shoulders is generally the response to the "bad" stuff? Doesn't the bias in that position leap out at you? This is the kind of rationale that rejoices at miracles when something advantageous or at least innocuous happens, but then claims their deity is mysterious when tragedy strikes. It is very poor and irrational reasoning.