An experience of mine.

[1137]

I posted the following story in the Christian DIR:

This significant event has stayed with me for a long time. I was an atheist at the time and had a close friend who was a pastor at one of those modern, contemporary churches. We would meet for coffee now and then and he would always try to convert me. Then one day he says "you know, just put your biased aside, get in a dark room by yourself, and ask god to come to you." I have always been open minded, so I did it trying to put aside my skepticism. Wouldn't you know it, I did indeed connect to a god like being, but it was certainly not the Christian god. It helped me understand myself, helped teach me magic and mysticism, told me what I needed and helped point me in the direction of achieving it.

My question there was how they explain me praying to the Christian god and receiving aid from pagan deities instead. For here I'm just interested in thought in general, as another user had more to say but was out of place in the DIR.

I still consider myself a very rational person, and in fact I feel that I would be more ignorant to ignore my experiences. I've studied psychology into graduate level long enough to understand the conditioning and workings of the mind, meaning that something outside of my own psyche had to produce a change. One example is that I ended a 3 year battle with pain medication cold turkey based solely on my new found inner strength. To go from a self hating addict with no hope or self efficacy to a strong, sober individual based on one very specific experience is far more evidence for a deity than I've ever had before.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I posted the following story in the Christian DIR:

This significant event has stayed with me for a long time. I was an atheist at the time and had a close friend who was a pastor at one of those modern, contemporary churches. We would meet for coffee now and then and he would always try to convert me. Then one day he says "you know, just put your biased aside, get in a dark room by yourself, and ask god to come to you." I have always been open minded, so I did it trying to put aside my skepticism. Wouldn't you know it, I did indeed connect to a god like being, but it was certainly not the Christian god. It helped me understand myself, helped teach me magic and mysticism, told me what I needed and helped point me in the direction of achieving it.

My question there was how they explain me praying to the Christian god and receiving aid from pagan deities instead. For here I'm just interested in thought in general, as another user had more to say but was out of place in the DIR.

I still consider myself a very rational person, and in fact I feel that I would be more ignorant to ignore my experiences. I've studied psychology into graduate level long enough to understand the conditioning and workings of the mind, meaning that something outside of my own psyche had to produce a change. One example is that I ended a 3 year battle with pain medication cold turkey based solely on my new found inner strength. To go from a self hating addict with no hope or self efficacy to a strong, sober individual based on one very specific experience is far more evidence for a deity than I've ever had before.

Im somewhat confused about your question. Can you rephrase?

 

[outhouse]

Looks like copied material to proselytize, more so then a forum thread.

Your not debating anything here, so the obvious proselytizing is substantiated.

 

[Etritonakin]

I posted the following story in the Christian DIR:

This significant event has stayed with me for a long time. I was an atheist at the time and had a close friend who was a pastor at one of those modern, contemporary churches. We would meet for coffee now and then and he would always try to convert me. Then one day he says "you know, just put your biased aside, get in a dark room by yourself, and ask god to come to you." I have always been open minded, so I did it trying to put aside my skepticism. Wouldn't you know it, I did indeed connect to a god like being, but it was certainly not the Christian god. It helped me understand myself, helped teach me magic and mysticism, told me what I needed and helped point me in the direction of achieving it.

My question there was how they explain me praying to the Christian god and receiving aid from pagan deities instead. For here I'm just interested in thought in general, as another user had more to say but was out of place in the DIR.

I still consider myself a very rational person, and in fact I feel that I would be more ignorant to ignore my experiences. I've studied psychology into graduate level long enough to understand the conditioning and workings of the mind, meaning that something outside of my own psyche had to produce a change. One example is that I ended a 3 year battle with pain medication cold turkey based solely on my new found inner strength. To go from a self hating addict with no hope or self efficacy to a strong, sober individual based on one very specific experience is far more evidence for a deity than I've ever had before.

The evil will move to block attempts to draw near to God -even offering things which seem good -even miraculous things which mislead.

2Co 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
2Co 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Jas 4:8 Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded.

2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

If you sought God -and settled for something else -there is your answer.

One cannot simply ask of God without regard to their own ways. One draws near to God by obeying the commandments. The first is to have no other God before him.

If you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments. Settling for something in this life -especially from spirits you ought not commune with -is a bad choice.

God allowed the situation -but you have to make the right choice.

 

[George-ananda]

I posted the following story in the Christian DIR:

This significant event has stayed with me for a long time. I was an atheist at the time and had a close friend who was a pastor at one of those modern, contemporary churches. We would meet for coffee now and then and he would always try to convert me. Then one day he says "you know, just put your biased aside, get in a dark room by yourself, and ask god to come to you." I have always been open minded, so I did it trying to put aside my skepticism. Wouldn't you know it, I did indeed connect to a god like being, but it was certainly not the Christian god. It helped me understand myself, helped teach me magic and mysticism, told me what I needed and helped point me in the direction of achieving it.

My question there was how they explain me praying to the Christian god and receiving aid from pagan deities instead. For here I'm just interested in thought in general, as another user had more to say but was out of place in the DIR.

I still consider myself a very rational person, and in fact I feel that I would be more ignorant to ignore my experiences. I've studied psychology into graduate level long enough to understand the conditioning and workings of the mind, meaning that something outside of my own psyche had to produce a change. One example is that I ended a 3 year battle with pain medication cold turkey based solely on my new found inner strength. To go from a self hating addict with no hope or self efficacy to a strong, sober individual based on one very specific experience is far more evidence for a deity than I've ever had before.

Can you tell us more of what you felt you experienced. God/gods can come in many forms beyond the traditional Christian image. In your earnest seeking you might have gotten the form that is right for you. I believe in the end, it is all One.

 

[Laika]

To go from a self hating addict with no hope or self efficacy to a strong, sober individual based on one very specific experience is far more evidence for a deity than I've ever had before.

that's good to hear.

 

[Yoshua]

I posted the following story in the Christian DIR:

This significant event has stayed with me for a long time. I was an atheist at the time and had a close friend who was a pastor at one of those modern, contemporary churches. We would meet for coffee now and then and he would always try to convert me. Then one day he says "you know, just put your biased aside, get in a dark room by yourself, and ask god to come to you." I have always been open minded, so I did it trying to put aside my skepticism. Wouldn't you know it, I did indeed connect to a god like being, but it was certainly not the Christian god. It helped me understand myself, helped teach me magic and mysticism, told me what I needed and helped point me in the direction of achieving it.

My question there was how they explain me praying to the Christian god and receiving aid from pagan deities instead. For here I'm just interested in thought in general, as another user had more to say but was out of place in the DIR.

I still consider myself a very rational person, and in fact I feel that I would be more ignorant to ignore my experiences. I've studied psychology into graduate level long enough to understand the conditioning and workings of the mind, meaning that something outside of my own psyche had to produce a change. One example is that I ended a 3 year battle with pain medication cold turkey based solely on my new found inner strength. To go from a self hating addict with no hope or self efficacy to a strong, sober individual based on one very specific experience is far more evidence for a deity than I've ever had before.

Hi 1137,

It is good to know that your friend advised you to ask God to come to you. It is also good to know that you indeed know that it is not a Christian God that you received because some people who do the same as you did thought it is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob--the God in the Bible. They walked blindly thinking that the spirit that they received is truly the Holy Spirit.

Based on your question from my understanding is how come you received a pagan deity instead of a Christian God. In evangelical, we call in the name of Jesus Christ. We received, and accepted Him as our Lord and personal Saviour. We particularly calling to a name rather than not. Spirits are all around us, they see us especially our actions. Wrong application in calling a deity may lead to calling a demon or evil spirit. I'm not saying that what your friend (pastor) and what you've done is wrong. There are numerous cases that people who call unto God allowed their life to change by God powerfully. In your case as an Atheist, I believe that a person or your friend should lead you to call unto God instead doing it by yourself. This is only my perception based on my experience as Christian.

Thanks.

 

[HonestJoe]

I still consider myself a very rational person, and in fact I feel that I would be more ignorant to ignore my experiences. I've studied psychology into graduate level long enough to understand the conditioning and workings of the mind, meaning that something outside of my own psyche had to produce a change.

Why does that change have to be an actually existing deity as you perceive it though? There are an almost infinite number of things influencing our mind every second or every day and it is the combination of all those things that create and develop or general worldview. Even if one of those things for you was the influence of a deity, you can’t claim it was that deity alone that led to the change. Maybe the deity is a negative influence and you’d actually make more positive changes more quickly without it.

Ultimately I don’t see your experience puts you in any better a position to make a definitive statement about the existence of gods than anyone else. You’ve know way of knowing what the source of your experiences actually was, whether it was some kind of sentient being and, if so, if it is as you perceive it or entirely different. After all, some of the Christians you discussed it with may attribute your response to Satan, which isn’t really any less viable an explanation than your own.

 

[1137]

Im somewhat confused about your question. Can you rephrase?

I am interested in thoughts on such an experience in general, but mostly the idea that I called upon one specific god, and three different gods ended up appearing. Whether I had a real, divine experience or it was simply psychological in nature, either no god or the Christian god should have been expected to appear in some form. Remember, at the time I was very firmly an atheist, while I may prefer egyptian myth to other myths, I had no bias towards expecting anything to come at all. I honestly expected it not to work and to hear all about how I "didn't really try hard enough" or whatever. But something did happen, something very specific and unexpected, a try mystical experience. I was simply sharing the experience and some of my possible conclusions.

The evil will move to block attempts to draw near to God -even offering things which seem good -even miraculous things which mislead.

2Co 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
2Co 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Jas 4:8 Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded.

2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

If you sought God -and settled for something else -there is your answer.

One cannot simply ask of God without regard to their own ways. One draws near to God by obeying the commandments. The first is to have no other God before him.

If you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments. Settling for something in this life -especially from spirits you ought not commune with -is a bad choice.

God allowed the situation -but you have to make the right choice.

That is an interesting perspective. My pastor friend made it out as though if I honestly asked for God (very specifically the christian god / Christ) it would somehow appear or I would otherwise come to know it exists. I never really had respect for deities that did expect their followers to better themselves in some way.

Can you tell us more of what you felt you experienced. God/gods can come in many forms beyond the traditional Christian image. In your earnest seeking you might have gotten the form that is right for you. I believe in the end, it is all One.

Well the beings or forces as I saw them came as the Egyptian deities Set, Horus, and Thoth, but this is likely a projection of mine onto something more mystical/archetypal. As for the experience, it felt what I think may constitute as an out of body experience. I seemed to be in a garden walking with different beings in turn. They spoke in English though it seemed very awkward with the animal heads and all. I never spoke (though I did think) and the beings (or parts of my mind or whatever may have happened) seemed to talk aimlessly. Sometimes they'd say incoherent things, and each one said something life changing yet simple, such as how to act in a present situation at the time.

Hi 1137,

It is good to know that your friend advised you to ask God to come to you. It is also good to know that you indeed know that it is not a Christian God that you received because some people who do the same as you did thought it is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob--the God in the Bible. They walked blindly thinking that the spirit that they received is truly the Holy Spirit.

Based on your question from my understanding is how come you received a pagan deity instead of a Christian God. In evangelical, we call in the name of Jesus Christ. We received, and accepted Him as our Lord and personal Saviour. We particularly calling to a name rather than not. Spirits are all around us, they see us especially our actions. Wrong application in calling a deity may lead to calling a demon or evil spirit. I'm not saying that what your friend (pastor) and what you've done is wrong. There are numerous cases that people who call unto God allowed their life to change by God powerfully. In your case as an Atheist, I believe that a person or your friend should lead you to call unto God instead doing it by yourself. This is only my perception based on my experience as Christian.

Thanks.

Interesting, I think my friend would have resented the idea that other spirits could even jump in and do such a thing.

Why does that change have to be an actually existing deity as you perceive it though? There are an almost infinite number of things influencing our mind every second or every day and it is the combination of all those things that create and develop or general worldview. Even if one of those things for you was the influence of a deity, you can’t claim it was that deity alone that led to the change. Maybe the deity is a negative influence and you’d actually make more positive changes more quickly without it.

Ultimately I don’t see your experience puts you in any better a position to make a definitive statement about the existence of gods than anyone else. You’ve know way of knowing what the source of your experiences actually was, whether it was some kind of sentient being and, if so, if it is as you perceive it or entirely different. After all, some of the Christians you discussed it with may attribute your response to Satan, which isn’t really any less viable an explanation than your own.

I certainly do not think the change occurred solely due to the experience, there is definitely a good mix of psychology in there, but I have never seen magic and psychology to be at odds. The only thing I can rationally and honestly ascribe to a possible "deity" is the original idea or thought that violated all thinking and environments at the time. Once that thought entered, I took over from there and forged my way.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

Something similar for me: I have been a Christian all my life, but have had experiences I would more associate with others. By the time I FINALLY dream of speaking directly to Jesus (in my 20's), all I can do is tell him martyrdom is full of ----.

 

[Jonathan Ainsley Bain]

I posted the following story in the Christian DIR:

This significant event has stayed with me for a long time. I was an atheist at the time and had a close friend who was a pastor at one of those modern, contemporary churches. We would meet for coffee now and then and he would always try to convert me. Then one day he says "you know, just put your biased aside, get in a dark room by yourself, and ask god to come to you." I have always been open minded, so I did it trying to put aside my skepticism. Wouldn't you know it, I did indeed connect to a god like being, but it was certainly not the Christian god. It helped me understand myself, helped teach me magic and mysticism, told me what I needed and helped point me in the direction of achieving it.

My question there was how they explain me praying to the Christian god and receiving aid from pagan deities instead. For here I'm just interested in thought in general, as another user had more to say but was out of place in the DIR.

I still consider myself a very rational person, and in fact I feel that I would be more ignorant to ignore my experiences. I've studied psychology into graduate level long enough to understand the conditioning and workings of the mind, meaning that something outside of my own psyche had to produce a change. One example is that I ended a 3 year battle with pain medication cold turkey based solely on my new found inner strength. To go from a self hating addict with no hope or self efficacy to a strong, sober individual based on one very specific experience is far more evidence for a deity than I've ever had before.

Perhaps it is because the way in which you have construed that which you consider 'Christian' is not the same
as that which is TRUE Christianity. Perhaps the way in which you have imagined the Pagan is closer to the Truth.

The parable of the Good Samaritan best explains how the outward form is quite different to the inner truth.

There are plenty of people in this world who profess Christianity, and yet are awful sinners,
and there are plenty of Good people who have been put off the outward form of Christianity because of this.

That which is ethically and morally true and good is quite different to symbols and buildings such as churches.

Having said all that, many spirits exist, but ask yourself deep down, knowing that if all the gods and Gods exist,
which particular entity could you imagine as being more pure than Jesus?

 

[1137]

Looks like copied material to proselytize, more so then a forum thread. s

Your not debating anything here, so the obvious proselytizing is substantiated.

I was sharing a story, I'm not sure how this could possibly seem like proselitizing. Where would I copy my personal experience from? How could you possibly be at a loss to find something debatable in a person claiming that they have experienced gods, and that they are indeed deities rather than any psychological or physical quirk.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

My question there was how they explain me praying to the Christian god and receiving aid from pagan deities instead. For here I'm just interested in thought in general, as another user had more to say but was out of place in the DIR.

I am interested in thoughts on such an experience in general, but mostly the idea that I called upon one specific god, and three different gods ended up appearing.

From what Christians tell me, they say if you're not connected to god then you can bring in evil spirits without you knowing it. The Bible says that satan can mask himself as an angel of light. I may take that into consideration only if you felt you should have gotten an answer from the Christian god but the other gods came and disturbed you instead.

On a different note, if the god/s are real, then we can't control what they do and who appears just as I can't predict if my friend will knock at my door or a stranger. Some Christians call it "familar-spirits" those who you can't differientiate who is god and who is not, type of thing.

That and/or your interests in pagan deities could have been in your subconscious and manfested when you were praying or meditating. In hypnosis type states, one is open to experience many different things. Depending on how you view reality is what you associate those feelings and visions with. For example, someone pushed me back on my shoulder so I wouldnt get hit by a car. A Christian would say God. An atheist would probably say "that's odd". A Pagan might say Ordin. A Ssntero may say it's his head Orisha.

I know that doesn't help; however, I don't know how close that is to the psychology field. If it is close, that's the best I can think of objectively speaking.



The closest I had to those type of experiences was the car thing and just things I personally would not consider coinsedences. It could be just in my head; and, I find myself falling into that.

My questions are, where you looking for the Christian God? (if not, maybe those other god/s where familar-spirits or spirits blocking you from who you were asking for-as so many Christians would say)

Where you open to any god/s that may come (if so, maybe reflect on the god/s that appeared to you and learn about the one/s you find yourself close to-pagan, christian, whoever)

Are you still an atheist? (If not, maybe just reflecting and learning about any god/s you are pulled to may give you a perspective on your experience-working backwards)

Reflection and more meditation may help with your question as well.

 

[George-ananda]

Well the beings or forces as I saw them came as the Egyptian deities Set, Horus, and Thoth, but this is likely a projection of mine onto something more mystical/archetypal. As for the experience, it felt what I think may constitute as an out of body experience. I seemed to be in a garden walking with different beings in turn. They spoke in English though it seemed very awkward with the animal heads and all. I never spoke (though I did think) and the beings (or parts of my mind or whatever may have happened) seemed to talk aimlessly. Sometimes they'd say incoherent things, and each one said something life changing yet simple, such as how to act in a present situation at the time.

Very interesting. What was you knowledge of and opinion on Egyptian gods before this experience?

 

[1137]

Very interesting. What was you knowledge of and opinion on Egyptian gods before this experience?

I had decent, academic knowledge and have learned of Egypt since I was a child in Hebrew school. I simply thought they were a primitive fabrication.

 

[Desert Snake]

I had decent, academic knowledge and have learned of Egypt since I was a child in Hebrew school. I simply thought they were a primitive fabrication.

I'm leaning towards, these were not ''actual', beings, but literary/phychological creations, in which you simply inserted them into a dialogue context...
Is there anything that makes you think they were not simply archetypes of 'gods', or whatnot?

 

[George-ananda]

I had decent, academic knowledge and have learned of Egypt since I was a child in Hebrew school. I simply thought they were a primitive fabrication.

So this vision seemed to come out of the blue? That would make it more interesting. Why do you think these forms came to you?

 

[outhouse]

I was sharing a story

Whatever

I don't buy a word of it , none of it.

I'm not sure how this could possibly seem like proselitizing.

Because this is the debate section.

 

[outhouse]

or it was simply psychological in nature

Well that sums it up.

 

[1137]

Whatever

I don't buy a word of it , none of it.




Because this is the debate section.

I don't think you understand words. Back on ignore.