Silicon Hero
Member
Eudaimonist said:
Would you mind explaining to me how its a non-sequitor?
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An article against Atheism
- Thread starter darkwaldo
- Start date
Would you mind explaining to me how its a non-sequitor?
smiling4ever
New Member
no........
Mick in England
Member
On the one hand, atheists are logical by refusing to believe in a God they can't see, but at the same time they're illogical in refusing to consider Jesus's words when he said "God sent me to tell you secrets hidden since the foundation of the world"..
Mike in England,
After answering Sunstone's excellent question, would you please provide the reference for your quote? Thanks.
After answering Sunstone's excellent question, would you please provide the reference for your quote? Thanks.
TurkeyOnRye
Well-Known Member
I would also like to hear why rejecting such a statement is illogical.
A fundie think tank?! Well there's is an oxymoron. Yes, the article was pretty much drivel. First of all, maybe atheism isn't too popular in the *US* *right now*, but most of Western Europe is probably at some level non-theistic, agnostic, or at least unchurched.
I have read both Sam Harris' books and think he has more to say than this stuff does. Does he have me convinced? Almost but not quite. OTOH, I
don't /probably never have believed in a personal God that knows you.
OTOH, Sam Harris asserts that without religion, basically this is the only way for humans to survive and so forth. I now consider this also somewhat of a "faith based" assertion. But this is a bit outside the arguments of this article. Harris holds a very strong impassioned view of theism (including progressives, agnostism, etc.) that seems almost to be based on the faith that he can actually convince others of this thru logical argument. He also doesn't separate what Europeans believe into subsections (like agnostism, etc. which he condemns). He even compares crime rates in blue states vs. red states. But there is no evidence that people in blue states dont' believe in God, though they are less fundamentalist. So imo, this sort of is not based on true observation. He is basically cutting out info that isn't convenient. This sort of idea is a kind of militancy in non-belief that to me almost is like belief.
For instance, if you say "I don't believe in god(s), and don't care". That's one thing. IF you say, "I don't believe in your god, and neither should you", that requires some degree of "evangelism". However, this is way over the heads of the authors of this little passage imo.
--des
I have read both Sam Harris' books and think he has more to say than this stuff does. Does he have me convinced? Almost but not quite. OTOH, I
don't /probably never have believed in a personal God that knows you.
OTOH, Sam Harris asserts that without religion, basically this is the only way for humans to survive and so forth. I now consider this also somewhat of a "faith based" assertion. But this is a bit outside the arguments of this article. Harris holds a very strong impassioned view of theism (including progressives, agnostism, etc.) that seems almost to be based on the faith that he can actually convince others of this thru logical argument. He also doesn't separate what Europeans believe into subsections (like agnostism, etc. which he condemns). He even compares crime rates in blue states vs. red states. But there is no evidence that people in blue states dont' believe in God, though they are less fundamentalist. So imo, this sort of is not based on true observation. He is basically cutting out info that isn't convenient. This sort of idea is a kind of militancy in non-belief that to me almost is like belief.
For instance, if you say "I don't believe in god(s), and don't care". That's one thing. IF you say, "I don't believe in your god, and neither should you", that requires some degree of "evangelism". However, this is way over the heads of the authors of this little passage imo.
--des
daphnestory
Daphne R
actually 16% of the world, and 12% of America identify themselves as non-religious (meaning atheists/agnostics/humanists/etc.) also, the population is growing faster than Christianity is spreading. In 15-20 years or so, it'll be overtaken by Islam as the world religion. However, thats just world religion, I don't know how the growth rate is growing here, but most polls showed that Christianity declined from 85% of the American population to 76% in the last 10 years, and is still decreasing at a steady rate. I think that essay was biased and got it's info from biased sources...
America is one of the most religious "first world" countries in the world with the exception of Turkey. It isn't so much that most Americans are actively religious so much as it's very "American" to at least identify as religious.
I'm not bringing up politics to argue it, but look at the major Christian involvement in one of our two major political parties in particular. That's a lot of Americans that fully support religious involvement in their government.
Do you think an openly atheist person could run for president? I'd say that I very strongly doubt it.
McBell
mantra-chanting henotheistic snake handler
Does not work for me either.
McBell
mantra-chanting henotheistic snake handler
MSizer
MSizer
You'd have a better chance of convincing richard dawkins that the book of genesis is factual.
I like Dan Dennett's claim that there have been atheists presidents, they were just smart enough not to say it out loud.
My personal favourite article on the site...
My Last Atheist
Is it possible that this is a big ****-take, and I'm misreading the ironical humour? That's possible, right?
I think my favourite quote is
'The second group of atheists thinks they’re smarter than God'. Pretty sure they don't.
We have an atheist Prime Minister. Even in a country which is much more religiously apathetic overall than the States, I would suggest it hasn't won her many votes, and cost her plenty. Of course, her fiscal policy has destroyed her poll ratings much more effectively than her religious beliefs (or lack thereof) anyway...!
Last edited:
Marisa
Well-Known Member
It says "page not found" when I clicked it.
I found this, though: Statistics on Religion in America Report -- Pew Forum on Religion & Public Life
