Advice from Outsiders

[Quintessence]

Just curious...did anyone here mention being preyed on? The conversation has appeared more balanced but I mighta missed it (skim reading and all that...)

It's in the OP in the hypothetical response letter, though it's my intent for the overall discussion to be more balanced. To add some context, I'm fairly certain that this letter was sent out because we're in the midst of a pandemic and many have lost loved ones. Basically, they're aiming to hit people who are emotionally vulnerable to make their sales pitch. I think predatory is a good way to describe that, unfortunately.

I'm not dealing with anything like that now, @Hermit Philosopher - though the impact of a loss from a year ago still reverberates with me from time to time. Getting a letter like that this week I was able to brush it off, but if I'd gotten it a year ago? It wouldn't have been good. Imagine if I had lost someone else to the pandemic so far. It wouldn't have been good for that, either.

There's a different dynamic, though, when interactions are in-person. There's tone to read, body language to pick up on. Sometimes, even when the advice is bad, you can tell the person really cares about you and it isn't for some ulterior motive. In those cases, even misplaced advice can be touching and appreciated. It just depends.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

Over time, it's getting to bother me less and less. Maybe I'm just getting used to it. As you said, it certainly doesn't reflect well on their religion, to think they know it all. So lately I've been looking deeper in proselytising messages, and this is what I see. "I'm unaware. I need someone to convince of that, and that someone is you. I'm so unaware that I figure I know more than you, or anyone else that isn't a member of my tribe. If nothing else I hope it garners me some attention. " Something like that.

People who proselytise just haven't yet figured out that we're diverse. It's no different than a little kid with an ice cream cone offering you a lick. Because he likes it, he just assumes you will too. Do we criticise that kid, or do we understand it?

I have to admit, I am loving the analogy of proselytizers to little children lacking wherewithal.

 

[Quintessence]

I have to admit, I am loving the analogy of proselytizers to little children lacking wherewithal.

It's not limited to children. We all want to share that which we love with others. I mean, I don't understand why you all aren't fascinated by plants. Plants are awesome!

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

It's not limited to children. We all want to share that which we love with others. I mean, I don't understand why you all aren't fascinated by plants. Plants are awesome!

I am fascinated by plants! Plants are awesome! My wife's lately been collecting all forms of "succulents" to display around the house, because they're pretty and tend to be low-maintenance, and another (crazy) thing I didn't know about them is that they tend to be extremely easy to propagate. In a lot of cases you just break a piece off and plant it, and the part you broke off will begin sprouting roots! I'm surprised the things haven't taken over the Earth by now. There's even one called "Mother of thousands" that literally grows hundreds of baby versions of itself surrounding the edges of its leaves. Each of these babies is equipped with a set of roots, and when they fall off eventually, they are entirely ready themselves to become a separate "Mother of Thousands". It's wild, wild stuff.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

It's not limited to children. We all want to share that which we love with others. I mean, I don't understand why you all aren't fascinated by plants. Plants are awesome!

I also wanted to note - which I thought of after - that most of the kind of "sharing" you're referring to here doesn't come loaded with an insult to the intelligence of the person we're sharing with. Such as telling someone about your plants. You aren't asking them to also start collecting their own plants and fall in love with them - unless you are, which is then a lot more like proselytizing.

Sharing things doesn't necessarily mean you are doing so with the expectation that the other person also adopt the thing you are sharing with them. Proselytizing does that. And that's why people find it a more objectionable form of "sharing" then simply telling someone all the virtues you see in, and how much you like to collect plants/stamps/pokemon cards/etc.

 

[Vinayaka]

It's not limited to children. We all want to share that which we love with others. I mean, I don't understand why you all aren't fascinated by plants. Plants are awesome!

I'm fascinated by plants. This time of year it's marigolds. One small seed, 3 months later you have a 3 foot high plant with 50 blooms, and every time you pick some, it just makes a bunch more. Within each flower there's another couple hundred seeds. If those guys were smarter, they could overrun the planet. One seed equals 1000 more plants in just 2 generations.

If you like orchids, take a look at the picture today on the blog ... "Today at Kauai Aadheenam' . That was truly amazing.

Heck, even dandelions fascinate me.

Shall we become the plant proseltysers?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

As we go through life, we often seek help and guidance from those around us. Sometimes advice is unsolicited, and sometimes the advice comes from a perspective that is very foreign to our own.

I was reminded of these things late last week when I received a letter in the mail from a proselytizer. I was tempted to mail them something in response, but instead just writing it here:

Dear Proselytizer,

I have a deep appreciation for an old-fashioned approach to things. The hand-written letter you sent me in the mail was charming, right down to the choice to use simple lined paper from a note pad. As charming as it was, however, it was not in equal measure respectful. I do not share your path, and it is not appropriate for you to offer me advice on a sensitive topic like death and dying. Foreign advice in matters so sensitive is not helpful and often hurtful; attempting to prey upon the emotionally vulnerable speaks very poorly of your religion. I hope you consider this the next time you craft a hand-written letter to proselytize.

Regards,
- An adherent of a religion that doesn't proselytize (your welcome)​

-*-*-*-*-
​

Religion is inherently personal, and advice related to the bereavement process can be especially tone-deaf if we receive it from outsiders to our religious tradition. Advice from outsiders isn't always unhelpful, though. Inspiration from other paths can be just what we need sometimes, especially when our own ways are failing us.

What are your thoughts when it comes to advice from outsiders to your religious tradition? Do you have a story to share about when it was unhelpful or even hurtful? What about a time where it was just what you needed to get through something?

I don't know who you lost or your relationship to them, but my condolences.

When it comes to "advice" from people with other belief systems that really doesn't work in mine, I try to separate the people into two categories:

- well-meaning people who are trying to respond to what they see as an obligation to help, but might be so immersed in their own paradigm that they just don't have the tools to actually help someone with a different paradigm.

- opportunistic ghouls who see vulnerability as a way to try to recruit for their religion.

I don't generally bear the first category of people ill will. I may feel a bit sad that it's become obvious that they don't really know me, but that's about it. Especially with issues around death: our society in general is pretty crappy at equipping people to deal with death and dying, and certain mainstream religions are even worse. It's hard for me to fault people with a sincere desire to help just because they mess up expressing that desire in a constructive way.

The second category of people, though? **** them.