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Is forced labour in prisons ethical?

danieldemol

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Wikipedia: Prison strikes.

Now, if we can please be done with this dance, I would appreciate a YES or NO answer to the following question:
  • assuming that some system of incarceration should be maintained, and
  • assuming that the society involved insures humane conditions of incarceration, and
  • acknowledging that systems of incarceration impose a cost to that society,
  • is it reasonable that those incarceration participate, in accordance with their ability, in offsetting that cost?
I would tentatively say in a non-automated society and if it is even necessary sure. However I would like to note that your article on prison strikes says that they are illegal and punishable by the likes of solitary confinement etc which makes ETA *one of* the above assumptions seemingly moot in my view.
 

danieldemol

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
If one isn't fit to stand trial, how would they wind up in prison to begin with?
I believe maybe you are conflating fitness to work with fitness to stand trial. Being sane enough to sit in a courtroom and give testimony are different to the competency level required to do hard labour or any complex tasks that may be required as I see it.
 

SalixIncendium

Qur'an Reciting Transtheistic Mahdi Claimant
Staff member
Premium Member
I believe maybe you are conflating fitness to work with fitness to stand trial. Being sane enough to sit in a courtroom and give testimony are different to the competency level required to do hard labour or any complex tasks that may be required as I see it.
Hard labor now? Initially, we were just discussing labor. Another goalpost moved.

Prison doesn't have just one task.

Anyway, since I'm not inclined to keep chasing goalposts, I'm done here. I've made my point.
 

danieldemol

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Hard labor now? Initially, we were just discussing labor. Another goalpost moved.
Does this mean you think they should only be forced to do easy labour? Well at least thats something in my view. Now is it the actual case in reality that they only do easy labour?
Prison doesn't have just one task.
I don't know anything about it, is there some sort of official source on what task/(s) are allowed?
 

PureX

Veteran Member
Is forced labour in prisons ethical? My intuitive hunch is probably not, so why do we allow it exactly?
It is both reasonable and ethical to expect prisoners to work for their keep.

However, it would be very unwise to allow ourselves to force them to do so. As it opens the door to all manner of very likely abuse. We have been down this road in the past, and abuses were commonplace and horrific.
 

Tomef

Active Member
Is forced labour in prisons ethical? My intuitive hunch is probably not, so why do we allow it exactly?
I think some sort of work offers a greater potential for rehabilitation than sitting in a cell with nothing to do all day. There should be a serious attempt to make the work at least purposeful and instructive, though. Not just breaking rocks or some other pointless punishment detail.
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
It is both reasonable and ethical to expect prisoners to work for their keep.

However, it would be very unwise to allow ourselves to force them to do so. As it opens the door to all manner of very likely abuse. We have been down this road in the past, and abuses were commonplace and horrific.

I think this comes closest to my position as well. It's reasonable to expect prisoners to work, but they should not be forced. Forced prison labor has the connotations of chain gangs, rockpiles, southern work farms, whips, dogs, "spend a night in the box," etc.

Absolutely no force should be imposed, except which is minimally necessary to prevent escape.
 

PureX

Veteran Member
Even just prison privatization has caused serious abuses. Judges not long ago were caught sending minors to private detention centers in return for kickbacks from the greedsters operating those centers.
 

danieldemol

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
In how many societies and families do you
suppose the rule has been, "Work, or you dont eat"?
That hasn't been a rule in my family, I would not expect those who are unfit to work to not eat, and in a probably soon to be automated society I wouldn't expect anyone to work to eat once that point in time is crossed. I also would not stick a family member in solitary confinement for refusing to work for any reason in my view.
 
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