Prove To Me That A God/Deity Exists

Instead of trying to disprove gods and deities (which is scientifically speaking impossible) I want to hear why you think a god/deity exists, and why you think that the holy book of that god/deity which has no known author and contains things that seem mythical is a better explanation than proven facts published by scientists. And by proof I do not mean "well the bible says that he exists and the bible is his word so it proves itself." No. That is ********. I want REAL scientific proof that a god or deity exists. Give it a go.

God said it, I believe it, that settles it,

Can we all get on with enjoying life now?

WHY do you believe it? WHAT do you believe? WHY is is better than proven fact? Come on you will have to do better than that!

aerengarth said:

I want REAL scientific proof that a god or deity exists.

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Well the only way I believe something as true is if there is proof to back it up. I just don't go believing everything that some dusty old book says. Is it too much to ask for proof of something before you present it to me as fact?

We're not here to tell you what to believe and why. We're not here to tell you what is an isn't valid/acceptable proof. That's your responsibility. It's your worldview.

Also, I don't get the impression most theists present their beliefs as "facts." They present them as beliefs.

Not in my experience. Every religious person I have met has told me that God exists and that is a fact and that if I don't accept that fact, I will go to hell, another fact. All I am saying is prove it.

You haven't met many religious people, then.

Given what you've said in the OP, the proofs that would be offered you would reject anyway. There's no point in presenting them when you've already made up your mind regarding what is and isn't acceptable proof. Belief in the divine isn't a science concept. It never has been. This doesn't mean the beliefs are not grounded in reason and logic, but it is not scientific. The closest thing you will get to a "scientific" belief in the divine is naturalistic pantheism. Even then, the belief itself is non-science. It's nonsense to ask for scientific proof of the divine. The concept transcends science. That's why I face-palmed you earlier. You will never get what you're asking for.

My main point is that most of Religion directly conflicts with what we know about the universe. It makes no logical sense to believe in such things. It was our first attempt at understanding our world but it is now obsolete. There is no reason to believe such nonsense.

The belief in a god or gods is based on faith. Any "evidence" provided will simply be dismissed by you and really is not worth any effort on anyone's part.

And I didn't actually mean I wanted proof I just wanted to see what kinds of conversations it would spark up and what some would try to provide as proof.

*blink blink*

"Most" of religion directly conflicts with what we know about the universe? What nonsense talk is this? May I ask you what your experience with "religion" is?

Very well then this post started off terribly because I failed on explaining what I wanted. Sorry to waste your time.

aerengarth said:

Instead of trying to disprove gods and deities (which is scientifically speaking impossible) I want to hear why you think a god/deity exists, and why you think that the holy book of that god/deity which has no known author and contains things that seem mythical is a better explanation than proven facts published by scientists. And by proof I do not mean "well the bible says that he exists and the bible is his word so it proves itself." No. That is ********. I want REAL scientific proof that a god or deity exists. Give it a go.

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I know God exists because I'm supposed to know. It's not possible for me to change this.

God's "holy book" is the universe, not some writings by human men who were afraid of comets. You want real scientific proof that God exists? How about, the universe.

Instead of worrying about what others believe why don't you just live your life.

No, it's okay. I've just been around here long enough to get a tad miffed at seeing the same repetitive demand of theists when that demand is not reasonable to make. Usually the people who strut in here with that kind of question have a chip on their shoulder and are out to prove a point. If you're genuinely curious, I'd be more than happy to explain aspects of my personal path, but I didn't get the impression there was a genuine desire for understanding from the OP.

aerengarth said:

Instead of trying to disprove gods and deities (which is scientifically speaking impossible) I want to hear why you think a god/deity exists, and why you think that the holy book of that god/deity which has no known author and contains things that seem mythical is a better explanation than proven facts published by scientists. And by proof I do not mean "well the bible says that he exists and the bible is his word so it proves itself." No. That is ********. I want REAL scientific proof that a god or deity exists. Give it a go.

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Of course Gods exist. They exist on the minds of believers in order to cope with our unimportance and short lives. If you want evidence that God exists in objective reality, external of the mind, there is none as it is highly unlikely one exists.

The Doors of Perception said:

Of course Gods exist. They exist on the minds of believers in order to cope with our unimportance and short lives. If you want evidence that God exists in objective reality, external of the mind, there is none as it is highly unlikely one exists.

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How is it "highly unlikely" that God exists?

Seems to me that to unbelievers it should be 50/50.

aerengarth said:

..... I want REAL scientific proof that a god or deity exists. Give it a go.

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There is none.
Science does not deal with the supernatural. Any belief in a god or deities rests solely on faith, and anyone who attempts to use science to justify faith is only fooling themselves.

As to why I believe in a deity? It's simply a personal feeling with no other justification than it just feels correct. Since my belief does not interfere with reality, there is no conflict with science.

Super Universe said:

How is it "highly unlikely" that God exists?

Seems to me that to unbelievers it should be 50/50.

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Why should it be 50 / 50? There's no evidence of any divine being that does anything, the only possible standpoint would be deism. However, the complexity of the universr either has been or will be explained by science. There is no real chance of there being an afterlife / soul becausr consciousness is a product of the brain. Nothing that happens or works needs a supernatural hand. Things such as prayer working can be explained by belief and psychology and divine experiences can be explained by brain activity. If there is not one single thing suggesting a God exists, why should I be 50 / 50? I understand not being able to be sure, but even though there is a slight chance the sun won't rise tomorrow, I'm pretty damn confident it will.

Why would it be possible to even gauge the likelihood or unlikelihood of the existence of such (a) being/force/existence(s)? And were it possible to gauge, what point would that probability have? No, this is not a sensible line of inquiry. What one should instead seek to determine is IF it is possible for the universe to exists as it does with such a supernatural dimension, as well as without.

If it is possible that the universe's known state(s) could feasibly exist without the existence of a supernatural dimension, there is nothing to prevent the non-existence of that supernatural dimension (i.e. it is POSSIBLE that supernatural things do not exist). It is not however possible to take this one step further, to prove that supernatural things cannot exist - since it is possible that such a dimension might exist in such a way that no interaction with that dimension can be detected or accurately predicted. Perhaps specific supernatural claims might be disproved (depending on their specificity and falsifiability), but many supernatural claims lack this capacity and are instead unfalsifiable.

Edit: Science has developed feasible models for the existence of the universe as we know it without a supernatural dimension

If it is possible that a supernatural dimension could feasibly exist without preventing the existence of the universe in it's known state(s), there is nothing to prevent the existence of that supernatural dimension (i.e. it is POSSIBLE that supernatural things exist). It is not however possible to take this one step further, to prove that supernatural things exist - since it is possible that anything which we deem 'super'natural is merely a misunderstood part of the natural or else our senses playing tricks on us.

Edit: Religion has developed models for the existence of an unfalsfiable supernatural dimension without preventing the existence of the universe as we know it (though such models are abstract and rely on being undetectable and upredictable)


That is the limit of our capacity to inquire of the existence of the supernatural.