Homosexuality and religious.

[Spirit of Light]

Does this mean you will withdraw membership of the Baha'i faith when they start issuing fines to adulterers?

In my opinion.

I have Baha'i as a personal belief. It is a path to unity and a path to God, that is what Baha'i faith is to me

 

[danieldemol]

I am not suggesting banning heterosexual relations.

Of course not and neither is Baha'u'llah, He would have had a much smaller following in His life time if He decided to discriminate against the majority the way He has against the minority (gay folk).

He could.

Without an unambiguous declaration from the Universal House of Justice saying as much there is no guarantee of this in a future Baha'i society.

I have no idea what the future holds, nobody knows. I don't think that is in the Book of Laws.

What Trailblazer thinks as an individual Bahai is of little relevance, for in a hypothetical Baha'i society what she thinks could easily be over-ruled by the Universal House of Justice.

No, I do not suggest a fine for that. That is just a personal dislike.

Ok

In my opinion.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

First of all "it is not MY book" i didnt write it.

You know very well what I mean.

Second of all, i take care of my own sexual preferences and dont tell others what to feel, my belief is between me and God.

I wasn't talking about your personal beliefs. I was talking about what the book of the religion you follow apparently says. I also ended the post by saying that apparently you believe things that are at odds with the scripture of the religion you follow (if the book idd says what other posters stated it says - I don't know and not interested enough to try and find out, so feel free to correct me by quoting what it actually says then).

So it should have been rather clear I was talking about the book and not about you.

 

[danieldemol]

I have Baha'i as a personal belief. It is a path to unity and a path to God, that is what Baha'i faith is to me

Does that mean you are not an enrolled member of the Baha'i community?

In my opinion.

 

[Spirit of Light]

You know very well what I mean.



I wasn't talking about your personal beliefs. I was talking about what the book of the religion you follow apparently says. I also ended the post by saying that apparently you believe things that are at odds with the scripture of the religion you follow (if the book idd says what other posters stated it says - I don't know and not interested enough to try and find out, so feel free to correct me by quoting what it actually says then).

So it should have been rather clear I was talking about the book and not about you.

I have my understanding of the teaching, others will have slightly different understanding.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Does that mean you are not an enrolled member of the Baha'i community?

In my opinion.

I am.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

That has already been done in this thread.

Can you link me to the post where the verses are posted?

tnx

 

[Spirit of Light]

Can you link me to the post where the verses are posted?

tnx

It was not a verse with link it was a reply from an other Baha'i

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

I would surpress my feelings and live by the teaching, remember i only speak of my own situation, i dont ask others to do or think like me.
And yes as a Strait man i lived 20 years without sex so i know i could do it again if needed

So.... you're not really "neutral" on the issue, are you.

"neutral" means you don't care either way if people are gay or not.
But you just said you would "suppress" your gay feelings.

That's not what one does when one does not care either way and is "neutral" on the issue.
That is instead what one does if one's actual stance is that being gay is bad.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Nope he missed it fully, @KWED Dont understand me at all. zero understanding

Are you sure?

Because your previous post, where you said that you would suppress your gay feelings if you had them, is pretty much perfectly in line with what he said there.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Oh how you must HATE everything that religious teaching say. How you must hate that others are different than you are...

This is dishonest.

You are misrepresenting him.
He is calling out misogyny and homophobia. Which is something every responsible citizen should do.
At best you could accuse him of not being correct about what baha'i believe about those issues.

But you can not accuse him of "hating everything that is different".

That is absolutely intellectually dishonest.

The guy is calling out perceived social injustice. How is that "hating everything that is different"???

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

It was not a verse with link it was a reply from an other Baha'i

I'm not interested in people's opinions.
I asked what the scripture itself actually literally says.

 

[Spirit of Light]

This is dishonest.

You are misrepresenting him.
He is calling out misogyny and homophobia. Which is something every responsible citizen should do.
At best you could accuse him of not being correct about what baha'i believe about those issues.

But you can not accuse him of "hating everything that is different".

That is absolutely intellectually dishonest.

The guy is calling out perceived social injustice. How is that "hating everything that is different"???

His every day push toward certain religions, his constant showing hate to what he himself dont believe in.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Not helpful for you. Homosexual acts are not to be done, but unlike Christians sexual sins are not high on the list for Baha'is. If a person is gay, he has to go celibate or he/she commits a minor sin under the Baha'i law. It is evil and a sin, but not very at all in my opinion. Very hard to do. I don't know anything about gay people needing to be purged from the world. I couldn't find that statement. Can you cite that to me?

You have a lack of understanding of Baha'i morals. Not surprising. We would never say "gay person go home". That is a straw man. I'm married to a gay person.

I don't understand why homosexuals should not engage in sex act, if sex in marriage union is OK? That is unfair to homosexuals and Allah's laws are always fair. Why should homosexuals be deprived from their small pleasures? Bahaollah was concerned only about pederasty, and I agree with him. If the participants are adults, I think it is OK.
I did not say anything about Bahaollah wanted to purge the world of homosexuals. No, I have never discriminated against LGBTQ. It is good that you have gone one step further by marrying one. In what way I lack understanding of Bahai morals?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

I'm just making a distinction between having homosexual leanings and acting on those leanings, between having heterosexual leanings and acting on those leanings.

You were talking in general terms.
You literally said that if your moral judgement doesn't agree with the moral judgement of your perceived authority, that you'll ignore your own judgement and go with the one from the authority instead, even though you don't understand that judgement.

Engaging in the atrocities would actually mean to go against how God in the Bible tells us to treat people.

God in your bible says to kill homosexuals who engage in homosexual sex.
God in your bible says to kill witches.
God in your bible says to kill disobedient children.
God in your bible condones and regulates slavery.

Religions might want people to commit atrocities for the sake of God and the religion etc, but the Bible God does not want that.

You should read the bible. Specifically the parts where God is telling people what to do when.

 

[Goldemar]

Yes, I can understand dhow that might make gay people feel, but all we can do is try to mitigate against it. We cannot change God's laws. Baha'is should make a special effort not to shun them or treat them differently.

Is the Baha'i God a loving God?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

I have my understanding of the teaching, others will have slightly different understanding.

For crying out loud.
Again: I wasn't talking about your personal beliefs. I was talking about what the book says.

How many times must it be repeated?

 

[Goldemar]

Because I believe that people who are committed to each other should get married before they have sex.

Why so?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

His every day push toward certain religions, his constant showing hate to what he himself dont believe in.

I haven't seen him do anything of the sort in this thread.

 

[Spirit of Light]

For crying out loud.
Again: I wasn't talking about your personal beliefs. I was talking about what the book says.

How many times must it be repeated?

You better just give up then..