God is nice and is doing his best to eliminate suffering.

[Muffled]

Differing conceptions of God, as usual. I lose it at the word 'his'. Whatever this 'God' is supposedly doing to eliminate suffering, it's not very skilled at it.

I would wager He is doing a lot better than you are.

 

[Muffled]

It doesn't seem like this god's best is very good. Why doesn't this god give the child rapist/murderer a heart attack after his first or second victim, instead of allowing him to claim twelve victims over the course of his life and die in his sleep at a ripe old age?

Does ending the life of a wicked person change his heart? And does he not deserve the right to repent as much as any sinner?

 

[Muffled]

WHAT? You would start fearing this god if this god started giving heart attacks to child rapist/murderers? Why would anyone other than child rapist/murderers be afraid? Personally I would be THANKFUL to any god that started taking such action. It would be an indication that this god actually cared about reducing needless human suffering.

Why is there a need to end suffering? The Buddhists think that but Jesus as God in the flesh determined that He must suffer on the cross.

 

[rational experiences]

Each human is born by sex. Body mind inherited.

Yet you start life innocent.

You should be taught you belong to family. And extended family. As the same two parents DNA was once the same for everyone.

Bio life on earth Changed by fall out conditions.

So body and mind health left.

God the conditions had to teach the children on earth consciousness. Survival and mutuality in sharing.

In survival those family members who threaten family were considered to not behave for human family's survival.

So an eye for an eye. What you see you knew by minds eye consciousness by sight to be wrong. To hurt or remove family surviving then you weren't considered family or mutually supportive.

So they locked them away in jail cells. If you Don't act as a family member then you aren't entitled. As it's survival.

As life lives present only by human sex. Innocent life is given life first and you are meant to continue being that same innocent. Hence repentance is used as a guise to do evil.

There is no teaching to learn in the taking of families life. It was chosen by family. It's not survival of life as first innocents learning only.... being the teaching of consciousness.

 

[QuestioningMind]

Does ending the life of a wicked person change his heart? And does he not deserve the right to repent as much as any sinner?

I guess I'm more concerned with the suffering of innocent children than the status of this wicked person's heart.

 

[QuestioningMind]

Why is there a need to end suffering? The Buddhists think that but Jesus as God in the flesh determined that He must suffer on the cross.

According to the OP it is what this god being wants... to reduce suffering.

 

[Link]

Are you telling me a Being capable of creating all this is Begging?

Salam

Amir al-mu'minin recited the verse:

O thou man! What hath beguiled thee from thy Lord, the Most Gracious One. (Qur'an, 82:6)

Then he said:

ومن كلام له (عليه السلام)

قاله عند تلاوته:

)يَا أَيُّهَا الاْنْسَانُ مَا غَرَّكَ بِرَبِّكَ الكَرِيم(

The addressee (in this verse) is devoid of argument and his excuse is most deceptive. He is detaining himself in ignorance.

أَدْحَضُ مَسْؤُول حُجَّةً، وَأَقْطَعُ مُغْتَرٍّ مَعْذِرَةً، لَقَدْ أَبْرَحَ جَهَالَةً بِنَفْسِهِ .

O man! What has emboldened you to (commit) sins, what has deceived you about your Allah and what has made you satisfied with the destruction of yourself? Is there no cure for your ailment or no awakening from your sleep? Do you not have pity on yourself as you have on others? Generally, when you see anyone exposed to the heat of the sun you cover him with shade, or if you see anyone afflicted with grief that pains his body you weep out of pity for him.

What has then made you patient over your own disease, what has made you firm in your own afflictions, and what has consoled you from weeping over yourself although your life is the most precious of all lives to you, and why does not the fear of an ailment that may befall you in the night keep you wakeful although you lie on the way to Allah's wrath due to your sins?

يَا أَيُّهَا الاْنْسَانُ، مَا جَرَّأَكَ عَلَى ذَنْبِكَ، وَمَا غَرَّكَ بِرَبِّكَ، وَمَا آنَسَكَ بِهَلَكَةِ نَفْسِكَ؟ أَمَا مِنْ دَائِكَ بُلوُلٌ، أَمْ لَيْسَ مِنْ نَوْمَتِكَ يَقَظَةٌ؟ أَمَا ترْحَمُ مِنْ نَفْسِكَ مَا تَرْحَمُ مِنْ غَيْرِكَ؟ فَلَرُبَّمَا تَرَى الضَّاحِيَ مِنْ حَرِّ الشَّمْسِ فَتُظِلُّهُ، أَوْ تَرَى الْمُبْتَلَى بِأَلَم يُمِضُّ جَسَدَهُ فَتَبْكِي رَحْمَةً لَهُ! فَمَا صَبَّرَك عَلَى دَائِكَ، وَجَلَّدَكَ عَلَى مُصَابِكَ، وَعَزَّاكَ عَنِ الْبُكَاءِ عَلَى نَفْسِكَ وَهِيَ أَعَزُّ الاْنْفُسِ عَلَيْكَ! وَكَيْفَ لاَ يُوقِظُكَ خَوْفُ بَيَاتِ نِقْمَة، وَقَدْ تَوَرَّطْتَ بمَعَاصِيهِ مَدَارِجَ سَطَوَاتِهِ!

You should cure the disease of languor in your heart by determination, and the sleep of neglectfulness in your eyes by wakefulness. Be obedient to Allah, and love His remembrance, and picture to yourself that you are running away while He is approaching you. He is calling you to His forgiveness and concealing your faults with His kindness, while you are fleeing away from Him towards others.

Certainly, Great is Allah the powerful, Who is so generous, and how humble and weak are you and still so bold to commit His disobedience although you live in His protection and undergo changes of life in the expanse of His kindness. He does not refuse you His kindness and does not remove His protection from you. In fact, you have not been without His kindness even for a moment, whether it be a favour that He conferred upon you or a sin of yours that He has concealed or a calamity that He has warded off from you.

What is your idea about Him if you had obeyed Him? By Allah, if this had been the case with two persons equal in power and matching in might (one being inattentive and the other showering favours upon you) then you would have been the first to adjudge yourself to be of bad behaviour and evil deeds.

فَتَدَاوَ مِنْ دَاءِ الْفَتْرَةِ فِي قَلْبِكَ بِعَزِيمَة، وَمِنْ كَرَى الْغَفْلَةِ فِي نَاظِرِكَ بِيَقَظَة، وَكُنْ لله مُطِيعاً، وَبِذِكْرِهِ آنِساً، وَتَمَثَّلْ فِي حَالِ تَوَلِّيكَ عَنْهُ إِقْبَالَهُ عَلَيْكَ، يَدْعُوكَ إِلَى عَفْوِهِ، وَيَتَغَمَّدُكَ بِفَضْلِهِ، وَأَنْتَ مُتَوَلٍّ عنْهُ إِلَى غَيْرِهِ.

فَتَعَالى مِنْ قَوِيّ مَا أَكْرَمَهُ! وَتَوَاضَعْتَ مِنْ ضَعِيف مَا أَجْرَأَكَ عَلَى مَعْصِيَتِهِ! وَأَنْتَ فِي كَنَفِ سِتْرِهِ مُقيِمٌ، وَفِي سَعَةِ فَضْلِهِ مَتَقَلِّبٌ، فَلَمْ يَمْنَعْكَ فَضْلَهُ، وَلَمْ يَهْتِكْ عَنْكَ سِتْرَهُ، بَلْ لَمْ تَخْلُ مِنْ لُطْفِهِ مَطْرِفَ عَيْن فِي نِعْمَة يُحْدِثُهَا لَكَ، أَوْ سَيِّئَة يَسْتُرُهَا عَلَيْكَ، أَوْ بَلِيَّة يَصْرِفُهَا عَنْكَ، فَمَا ظَنُّكَ بِهِ لَوْ أَطَعْتَهُ! وَايْمُ اللهِ لَوْ أَنَّ هذِهِ الصِّفَةَ كَانَتْ فِي مُتَّفِقَيْنِ فِي الْقُوَّةِ، مُتَوَازِيَيْنِ فِي الْقُدْرَ، لَكُنْتَ أَوَّلَ حَاكِم عَلى نَفْسِكَ بِذَمِيمِ الاْخْلاَقِ، وَمَسَاوِىءِ الاْعَمْالِ.


More to the sermon: Sermon 222: The addressee (in this verse) is devoid of argument | Nahjul Balagha Part 1, The Sermons | Al-Islam.org

It's not only God begging us, trying to save our souls, but his chosen best creatures came to this world, begging us to save our own souls, while they gain nothing nor lose anything either way.

 

[Trailblazer]

Salam

Amir al-mu'minin recited the verse:

O thou man! What hath beguiled thee from thy Lord, the Most Gracious One. (Qur'an, 82:6)

Then he said:

ومن كلام له (عليه السلام)

قاله عند تلاوته:

)يَا أَيُّهَا الاْنْسَانُ مَا غَرَّكَ بِرَبِّكَ الكَرِيم(

The addressee (in this verse) is devoid of argument and his excuse is most deceptive. He is detaining himself in ignorance.

أَدْحَضُ مَسْؤُول حُجَّةً، وَأَقْطَعُ مُغْتَرٍّ مَعْذِرَةً، لَقَدْ أَبْرَحَ جَهَالَةً بِنَفْسِهِ .

O man! What has emboldened you to (commit) sins, what has deceived you about your Allah and what has made you satisfied with the destruction of yourself? Is there no cure for your ailment or no awakening from your sleep? Do you not have pity on yourself as you have on others? Generally, when you see anyone exposed to the heat of the sun you cover him with shade, or if you see anyone afflicted with grief that pains his body you weep out of pity for him.

What has then made you patient over your own disease, what has made you firm in your own afflictions, and what has consoled you from weeping over yourself although your life is the most precious of all lives to you, and why does not the fear of an ailment that may befall you in the night keep you wakeful although you lie on the way to Allah's wrath due to your sins?

يَا أَيُّهَا الاْنْسَانُ، مَا جَرَّأَكَ عَلَى ذَنْبِكَ، وَمَا غَرَّكَ بِرَبِّكَ، وَمَا آنَسَكَ بِهَلَكَةِ نَفْسِكَ؟ أَمَا مِنْ دَائِكَ بُلوُلٌ، أَمْ لَيْسَ مِنْ نَوْمَتِكَ يَقَظَةٌ؟ أَمَا ترْحَمُ مِنْ نَفْسِكَ مَا تَرْحَمُ مِنْ غَيْرِكَ؟ فَلَرُبَّمَا تَرَى الضَّاحِيَ مِنْ حَرِّ الشَّمْسِ فَتُظِلُّهُ، أَوْ تَرَى الْمُبْتَلَى بِأَلَم يُمِضُّ جَسَدَهُ فَتَبْكِي رَحْمَةً لَهُ! فَمَا صَبَّرَك عَلَى دَائِكَ، وَجَلَّدَكَ عَلَى مُصَابِكَ، وَعَزَّاكَ عَنِ الْبُكَاءِ عَلَى نَفْسِكَ وَهِيَ أَعَزُّ الاْنْفُسِ عَلَيْكَ! وَكَيْفَ لاَ يُوقِظُكَ خَوْفُ بَيَاتِ نِقْمَة، وَقَدْ تَوَرَّطْتَ بمَعَاصِيهِ مَدَارِجَ سَطَوَاتِهِ!

You should cure the disease of languor in your heart by determination, and the sleep of neglectfulness in your eyes by wakefulness. Be obedient to Allah, and love His remembrance, and picture to yourself that you are running away while He is approaching you. He is calling you to His forgiveness and concealing your faults with His kindness, while you are fleeing away from Him towards others.

Certainly, Great is Allah the powerful, Who is so generous, and how humble and weak are you and still so bold to commit His disobedience although you live in His protection and undergo changes of life in the expanse of His kindness. He does not refuse you His kindness and does not remove His protection from you. In fact, you have not been without His kindness even for a moment, whether it be a favour that He conferred upon you or a sin of yours that He has concealed or a calamity that He has warded off from you.

What is your idea about Him if you had obeyed Him? By Allah, if this had been the case with two persons equal in power and matching in might (one being inattentive and the other showering favours upon you) then you would have been the first to adjudge yourself to be of bad behaviour and evil deeds.

فَتَدَاوَ مِنْ دَاءِ الْفَتْرَةِ فِي قَلْبِكَ بِعَزِيمَة، وَمِنْ كَرَى الْغَفْلَةِ فِي نَاظِرِكَ بِيَقَظَة، وَكُنْ لله مُطِيعاً، وَبِذِكْرِهِ آنِساً، وَتَمَثَّلْ فِي حَالِ تَوَلِّيكَ عَنْهُ إِقْبَالَهُ عَلَيْكَ، يَدْعُوكَ إِلَى عَفْوِهِ، وَيَتَغَمَّدُكَ بِفَضْلِهِ، وَأَنْتَ مُتَوَلٍّ عنْهُ إِلَى غَيْرِهِ.

فَتَعَالى مِنْ قَوِيّ مَا أَكْرَمَهُ! وَتَوَاضَعْتَ مِنْ ضَعِيف مَا أَجْرَأَكَ عَلَى مَعْصِيَتِهِ! وَأَنْتَ فِي كَنَفِ سِتْرِهِ مُقيِمٌ، وَفِي سَعَةِ فَضْلِهِ مَتَقَلِّبٌ، فَلَمْ يَمْنَعْكَ فَضْلَهُ، وَلَمْ يَهْتِكْ عَنْكَ سِتْرَهُ، بَلْ لَمْ تَخْلُ مِنْ لُطْفِهِ مَطْرِفَ عَيْن فِي نِعْمَة يُحْدِثُهَا لَكَ، أَوْ سَيِّئَة يَسْتُرُهَا عَلَيْكَ، أَوْ بَلِيَّة يَصْرِفُهَا عَنْكَ، فَمَا ظَنُّكَ بِهِ لَوْ أَطَعْتَهُ! وَايْمُ اللهِ لَوْ أَنَّ هذِهِ الصِّفَةَ كَانَتْ فِي مُتَّفِقَيْنِ فِي الْقُوَّةِ، مُتَوَازِيَيْنِ فِي الْقُدْرَ، لَكُنْتَ أَوَّلَ حَاكِم عَلى نَفْسِكَ بِذَمِيمِ الاْخْلاَقِ، وَمَسَاوِىءِ الاْعَمْالِ.


More to the sermon: Sermon 222: The addressee (in this verse) is devoid of argument | Nahjul Balagha Part 1, The Sermons | Al-Islam.org

It's not only God begging us, trying to save our souls, but his chosen best creatures came to this world, begging us to save our own souls, while they gain nothing nor lose anything either way.

picture to yourself that you are running away while He is approaching you. He is calling you to His forgiveness and concealing your faults with His kindness, while you are fleeing away from Him towards others.

That is the most important thing we need to know from the verses you cited. People not only flee away from God and turn towards others, they flee God and turn towards self and the enjoyments and pleasures of the material world of dust instead of turning towards God.

I turned away from God for many years and believed in name only, not in favor of others or the material world, but because I did not really believe that God is the only one who can help me. It took a lot more suffering on my part for me to finally realize that.

(Qur’án 29:2)
Do people think once they say, “We believe,” that they will be left without being put to the test?

 

[Bird123]

Salam

Amir al-mu'minin recited the verse:

O thou man! What hath beguiled thee from thy Lord, the Most Gracious One. (Qur'an, 82:6)

Then he said:

ومن كلام له (عليه السلام)

قاله عند تلاوته:

)يَا أَيُّهَا الاْنْسَانُ مَا غَرَّكَ بِرَبِّكَ الكَرِيم(

The addressee (in this verse) is devoid of argument and his excuse is most deceptive. He is detaining himself in ignorance.

أَدْحَضُ مَسْؤُول حُجَّةً، وَأَقْطَعُ مُغْتَرٍّ مَعْذِرَةً، لَقَدْ أَبْرَحَ جَهَالَةً بِنَفْسِهِ .

O man! What has emboldened you to (commit) sins, what has deceived you about your Allah and what has made you satisfied with the destruction of yourself? Is there no cure for your ailment or no awakening from your sleep? Do you not have pity on yourself as you have on others? Generally, when you see anyone exposed to the heat of the sun you cover him with shade, or if you see anyone afflicted with grief that pains his body you weep out of pity for him.

What has then made you patient over your own disease, what has made you firm in your own afflictions, and what has consoled you from weeping over yourself although your life is the most precious of all lives to you, and why does not the fear of an ailment that may befall you in the night keep you wakeful although you lie on the way to Allah's wrath due to your sins?

يَا أَيُّهَا الاْنْسَانُ، مَا جَرَّأَكَ عَلَى ذَنْبِكَ، وَمَا غَرَّكَ بِرَبِّكَ، وَمَا آنَسَكَ بِهَلَكَةِ نَفْسِكَ؟ أَمَا مِنْ دَائِكَ بُلوُلٌ، أَمْ لَيْسَ مِنْ نَوْمَتِكَ يَقَظَةٌ؟ أَمَا ترْحَمُ مِنْ نَفْسِكَ مَا تَرْحَمُ مِنْ غَيْرِكَ؟ فَلَرُبَّمَا تَرَى الضَّاحِيَ مِنْ حَرِّ الشَّمْسِ فَتُظِلُّهُ، أَوْ تَرَى الْمُبْتَلَى بِأَلَم يُمِضُّ جَسَدَهُ فَتَبْكِي رَحْمَةً لَهُ! فَمَا صَبَّرَك عَلَى دَائِكَ، وَجَلَّدَكَ عَلَى مُصَابِكَ، وَعَزَّاكَ عَنِ الْبُكَاءِ عَلَى نَفْسِكَ وَهِيَ أَعَزُّ الاْنْفُسِ عَلَيْكَ! وَكَيْفَ لاَ يُوقِظُكَ خَوْفُ بَيَاتِ نِقْمَة، وَقَدْ تَوَرَّطْتَ بمَعَاصِيهِ مَدَارِجَ سَطَوَاتِهِ!

You should cure the disease of languor in your heart by determination, and the sleep of neglectfulness in your eyes by wakefulness. Be obedient to Allah, and love His remembrance, and picture to yourself that you are running away while He is approaching you. He is calling you to His forgiveness and concealing your faults with His kindness, while you are fleeing away from Him towards others.

Certainly, Great is Allah the powerful, Who is so generous, and how humble and weak are you and still so bold to commit His disobedience although you live in His protection and undergo changes of life in the expanse of His kindness. He does not refuse you His kindness and does not remove His protection from you. In fact, you have not been without His kindness even for a moment, whether it be a favour that He conferred upon you or a sin of yours that He has concealed or a calamity that He has warded off from you.

What is your idea about Him if you had obeyed Him? By Allah, if this had been the case with two persons equal in power and matching in might (one being inattentive and the other showering favours upon you) then you would have been the first to adjudge yourself to be of bad behaviour and evil deeds.

فَتَدَاوَ مِنْ دَاءِ الْفَتْرَةِ فِي قَلْبِكَ بِعَزِيمَة، وَمِنْ كَرَى الْغَفْلَةِ فِي نَاظِرِكَ بِيَقَظَة، وَكُنْ لله مُطِيعاً، وَبِذِكْرِهِ آنِساً، وَتَمَثَّلْ فِي حَالِ تَوَلِّيكَ عَنْهُ إِقْبَالَهُ عَلَيْكَ، يَدْعُوكَ إِلَى عَفْوِهِ، وَيَتَغَمَّدُكَ بِفَضْلِهِ، وَأَنْتَ مُتَوَلٍّ عنْهُ إِلَى غَيْرِهِ.

فَتَعَالى مِنْ قَوِيّ مَا أَكْرَمَهُ! وَتَوَاضَعْتَ مِنْ ضَعِيف مَا أَجْرَأَكَ عَلَى مَعْصِيَتِهِ! وَأَنْتَ فِي كَنَفِ سِتْرِهِ مُقيِمٌ، وَفِي سَعَةِ فَضْلِهِ مَتَقَلِّبٌ، فَلَمْ يَمْنَعْكَ فَضْلَهُ، وَلَمْ يَهْتِكْ عَنْكَ سِتْرَهُ، بَلْ لَمْ تَخْلُ مِنْ لُطْفِهِ مَطْرِفَ عَيْن فِي نِعْمَة يُحْدِثُهَا لَكَ، أَوْ سَيِّئَة يَسْتُرُهَا عَلَيْكَ، أَوْ بَلِيَّة يَصْرِفُهَا عَنْكَ، فَمَا ظَنُّكَ بِهِ لَوْ أَطَعْتَهُ! وَايْمُ اللهِ لَوْ أَنَّ هذِهِ الصِّفَةَ كَانَتْ فِي مُتَّفِقَيْنِ فِي الْقُوَّةِ، مُتَوَازِيَيْنِ فِي الْقُدْرَ، لَكُنْتَ أَوَّلَ حَاكِم عَلى نَفْسِكَ بِذَمِيمِ الاْخْلاَقِ، وَمَسَاوِىءِ الاْعَمْالِ.


More to the sermon: Sermon 222: The addressee (in this verse) is devoid of argument | Nahjul Balagha Part 1, The Sermons | Al-Islam.org

It's not only God begging us, trying to save our souls, but his chosen best creatures came to this world, begging us to save our own souls, while they gain nothing nor lose anything either way.

This is not God begging. This is mankind manipulating.
It has never ever been about Sin.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Link]

This is not God begging. This is mankind manipulating.
It has never ever been about Sin.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Yet I see a world running from God and their duty towards him.

 

[Bird123]

Yet I see a world running from God and their duty towards him.

You still do not Understand. Many see God as a Ruler and we are doing things for God. This has never been the Truth. God has no needs!!

God is Unconditional Love. Unconditional Love always does what is Best for the other. This physical world does not exist for God. God created this physical world for all His children. Why? The time-based causal nature is Perfect for Learning.

One chooses. One gets Results. One learns all sides, Intelligence chooses the best choices. One walks to that Higher Level where one can create a Heavenly State for oneself and others.

Eternity has purpose. When one reaches a point where most every lesson is learned, there is still more to do. One can teach!!

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[samtonga43]

This is not God begging. This is mankind manipulating.
It has never ever been about Sin.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Yes, clear to me also. Surely if God were to beg, we would have to assume that we had something He did not have. But this is logically impossible.

 

[Link]

You still do not Understand. Many see God as a Ruler and we are doing things for God. This has never been the Truth. God has no needs!!

God is Unconditional Love. Unconditional Love always does what is Best for the other. This physical world does not exist for God. God created this physical world for all His children. Why? The time-based causal nature is Perfect for Learning.

One chooses. One gets Results. One learns all sides, Intelligence chooses the best choices. One walks to that Higher Level where one can create a Heavenly State for oneself and others.

Eternity has purpose. When one reaches a point where most every lesson is learned, there is still more to do. One can teach!!

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

God has no needs we agree. But he is the ultimate gift and only really meaningful gift, he can give, so created us to worship him and for our benefit. If we run away from him, what will we run to? And if we hate God and his light, do we not deserve his wrath?

He created hell and heaven and life and death as a pressure so we can become something high and great.

The life and pleasures in this world are a distraction to test us if we are steadfast to God. That's all. Its simple, use the world to get closer to God, life is but a moment, live it in obedience to God.

Also, Ruling for sake of ruling, is not good. But God rules because he has wisdom to guide humanity and humanity is need of his authority and guidance.

Make the mistake of running away from him, and he will catch you.

 

[Link]

Yes, clear to me also. Surely if God were to beg, we would have to assume that we had something He did not have. But this is logically impossible.

He begs because he loves. He cares. But he has nothing to gain for himself. He is trying to save us.

 

[Goldemar]

God has no needs we agree. But he is the ultimate gift and only really meaningful gift, he can give, so created us to worship him and for our benefit. If we run away from him, what will we run to? And if we hate God and his light, do we not deserve his wrath?

He created hell and heaven and life and death as a pressure so we can become something high and great.

The life and pleasures in this world are a distraction to test us if we are steadfast to God. That's all. Its simple, use the world to get closer to God, life is but a moment, live it in obedience to God.

Also, Ruling for sake of ruling, is not good. But God rules because he has wisdom to guide humanity and humanity is need of his authority and guidance.

Make the mistake of running away from him, and he will catch you.

Why do we deserve His wrath though? Why is He wrathful at all? Why does He not just forgive?

 

[Link]

Why do we deserve His wrath though? Why is He wrathful at all? Why does He not just forgive?

Some evils, they should be forgiven. If a person is sincere, and asks forgiveness, should be forgiven. Should not from justice perspective, but kindness and mercy overcoming anger and vengeance perspective. We been given time to reform and escape our sins. Death is a pressure cooker, we die evil, and there should be consequences.

But righteous retribution, justice, and vengeance is a thing. God is One, same thing that makes him absolutely merciful in proper place of mercy and most merciful, also makes him the most severe in retribution and vengeance.

God is not going treat the good and evil the same. And those who sought to set things right in their souls and on earth with those who caused havoc and corruption on earth.

The two God does not deal with the same way. To do so would be injustice on his part.

The lovers and believes of God's light and unseen path and signs, can't be the treated the same as those who ran away towards darkness for petty gains and desires. No way.

They are opposites and will get opposite treatment.

 

[Goldemar]

Some evils, they should be forgiven. If a person is sincere, and asks forgiveness, should be forgiven. Should not from justice perspective, but kindness and mercy overcoming anger and vengeance perspective. We been given time to reform and escape our sins. Death is a pressure cooker, we die evil, and there should be consequences.

But righteous retribution, justice, and vengeance is a thing. God is One, same thing that makes him absolutely merciful in proper place of mercy and most merciful, also makes him the most severe in retribution and vengeance.

God is not good treat the good and evil the same. And those who sought to set things right in their souls and on earth with those who caused havoc and corruption on earth.

The two God does not deal with the same way. To do so would be injustice on his part.

The lovers and believes of God's light and unseen path and signs, can't be the treated the same as those who ran away towards darkness for petty gains and desires. No way.

They are opposites and will get opposite treatment.

Hmm, okay. Sounds like a pretty vengeful God to me, though.

 

[Link]

Hmm, okay. Sounds like a pretty vengeful God to me, though.

I find God beautiful. Its hard to get use to in the start, but you get to see vengeance and hate also has a proper place in virtue, and is part of how we should balance ourselves. We should not equate good and evil either.

You temper your vengeance with patience and discipline and know its coming one day, justice is coming. And then vengeance feelings become part of a healing to the heart.

To want justice is part of the hope of the oppressed. Those on side of oppressors and doing nothing against oppressors (both type of people), probably want all things to be forgiven, but not oppressed.

Oppressed want justice. God will listen to their prayers over oppressors for sure.

 

[Trailblazer]

Why do we deserve His wrath though? Why is He wrathful at all? Why does He not just forgive?

God does forgive.
Even if we deserve God's wrath, God forgives those who stray from His path because God is All-Merciful and Ever-Forgiving. If nobody ever strayed from God's path how could God be called merciful and forgiving?

“My God, my God! If none be found to stray from Thy path, how, then, can the ensign of Thy mercy be unfurled, or the banner of Thy bountiful favor be hoisted? And if iniquity be not committed, what is it that can proclaim Thee to be the Concealer of men’s sins, the Ever-Forgiving, the Omniscient, the All-Wise?”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 310

 

[Goldemar]

I find God beautiful. Its hard to get use to in the start, but you get to see vengeance and hate also has a proper place in virtue, and is part of how we should balance ourselves. We should not equate good and evil either.

You temper your vengeance with patience and discipline and know its coming one day, justice is coming. And then vengeance feelings become part of a healing to the heart.

To want justice is part of the hope of the oppressed. Those on side of oppressors and doing nothing against oppressors (both type of people), probably want all things to be forgiven, but not oppressed.

Oppressed want justice. God will listen to their prayers over oppressors for sure.

Are you saying that there will be an eternal punishment for those who commit evil in God's Sight?