When someone is a monster, who is to blame?

[Spiderman]

I would have to say I have seen evidence that I am a monster who is learning virtue and be a monster who at least fights for what is right and acts in a way that is noble minded. A huge work in progress.

I have known many monsters, and I don't mean selfish children who bully on the playground and torture animals. I'm talking about people that are guilty of torturing people to death, often children.

I'm just curious what your take is on why someone turns out that way?

I would say in my case it was too many factors. One problem is I am the problem. Another problem is exposure to pornography at age 8 did damage. A mom cheating on my Dad did damage with her having multiple partners, one of them who was a convicted sexual offender, wasn't helpful. Being unsupervised contributed.

I'm not one of these guys that feels strongly violent video games can cause school shootings, but I loved them and am open to the possibility, and video games that included stuff traditionally associated with being Satanic potentially played a role. I don't know. An obsession with horror films and watching the shower scene of psycho, watching stuff like silence of the lambs and hell raiser before the age of ten, didn't do me any favors.

Listening to music that glorified being stupid, killing people, being irresponsible, horrorcore rap, heavy metal, it definitely did send my young mind the message that it is cool being a selfish idiot, and being a good person is bad. I admit, I was so stupid I believed that. I hope most youngsters are not that stupid but I'm seeing evidence of a culture and media and entertainment industry that glorifies being stupid and worthless, and the people as a general rule seem to be buying it on average from the people I have met and meet.

That will create stupid worthless people and sociopaths when chronically bombarded with filth and trash and affirmation that being sick is great! It weakens and destroys civilizations.

Thoughts?

 

[King Phenomenon]

I would have to say I have seen evidence that I am a monster who is learning virtue and be a monster who at least fights for what is right and acts in a way that is noble minded. A huge work in progress.

I have known many monsters, and I don't mean selfish children who bully on the playground and torture animals. I'm talking about people that are guilty of torturing people to death, often children.

I'm just curious what your take is on why someone turns out that way?

I would say in my case it was too many factors. One problem is I am the problem. Another problem is exposure to pornography at age 8 did damage. A mom cheating on my Dad did damage with her having multiple partners, one of them who was a convicted sexual offender, wasn't helpful. Being unsupervised contributed.

I'm not one of these guys that feels strongly violent video games can cause school shootings, but I loved them and am open to the possibility, and video games that included stuff traditionally associated with being Satanic potentially played a role. I don't know. An obsession with horror films and watching the shower scene of psycho, watching stuff like silence of the lambs and hell raiser before the age of ten, didn't do me any favors.

Listening to music that glorified being stupid, killing people, being irresponsible, horrorcore rap, heavy metal, it definitely did send my young mind the message that it is cool being a selfish idiot, and being a good person is bad. I admit, I was so stupid I believed that. I hope most youngsters are not that stupid but I'm seeing evidence of a culture and media and entertainment industry that glorifies being stupid and worthless, and the people as a general rule seem to be buying it on average from the people I have met and meet.

That will create stupid worthless people and sociopaths when chronically bombarded with filth and trash and affirmation that being sick is great! It weakens and destroys civilizations.

Thoughts?

I would say it’s more mental illness and alcohol and drug addictions rather than video games and music that leads to bad behavior unfortunately

 

[Spiderman]

I would say it’s more mental illness and alcohol and drug addictions rather than video games and music that leads to bad behavior unfortunately

I said video games probably didn't have much to do with it. Music I know for sure incited me to bad behavior. Also, I wasn't mentally ill before being exposed to a lot of the things mentioned in the OP. That's something to consider. Chemical addictions came later too.

 

[74x12]

I would have to say I have seen evidence that I am a monster who is learning virtue and be a monster who at least fights for what is right and acts in a way that is noble minded. A huge work in progress.

I have known many monsters, and I don't mean selfish children who bully on the playground and torture animals. I'm talking about people that are guilty of torturing people to death, often children.

I'm just curious what your take is on why someone turns out that way?

I would say in my case it was too many factors. One problem is I am the problem. Another problem is exposure to pornography at age 8 did damage. A mom cheating on my Dad did damage with her having multiple partners, one of them who was a convicted sexual offender, wasn't helpful. Being unsupervised contributed.

I'm not one of these guys that feels strongly violent video games can cause school shootings, but I loved them and am open to the possibility, and video games that included stuff traditionally associated with being Satanic potentially played a role. I don't know. An obsession with horror films and watching the shower scene of psycho, watching stuff like silence of the lambs and hell raiser before the age of ten, didn't do me any favors.

Listening to music that glorified being stupid, killing people, being irresponsible, horrorcore rap, heavy metal, it definitely did send my young mind the message that it is cool being a selfish idiot, and being a good person is bad. I admit, I was so stupid I believed that. I hope most youngsters are not that stupid but I'm seeing evidence of a culture and media and entertainment industry that glorifies being stupid and worthless, and the people as a general rule seem to be buying it on average from the people I have met and meet.

That will create stupid worthless people and sociopaths when chronically bombarded with filth and trash and affirmation that being sick is great! It weakens and destroys civilizations.

Thoughts?

People defend the filth being unleashed in media today as expressions of freedom. But ancient philosophy tells us that freedom is not given for license but for cultivating virtue in yourself. But if you try to point out that things were better in the 1940s they'll bring up racism and sexism to prove you wrong. But of course we don't have to have racism/sexism just to go back to common decency so that's not an argument.

 

[Heyo]

I would have to say I have seen evidence that I am a monster who is learning virtue and be a monster who at least fights for what is right and acts in a way that is noble minded. A huge work in progress.

I have known many monsters, and I don't mean selfish children who bully on the playground and torture animals. I'm talking about people that are guilty of torturing people to death, often children.

I'm just curious what your take is on why someone turns out that way?

I would say in my case it was too many factors. One problem is I am the problem. Another problem is exposure to pornography at age 8 did damage. A mom cheating on my Dad did damage with her having multiple partners, one of them who was a convicted sexual offender, wasn't helpful. Being unsupervised contributed.

I'm not one of these guys that feels strongly violent video games can cause school shootings, but I loved them and am open to the possibility, and video games that included stuff traditionally associated with being Satanic potentially played a role. I don't know. An obsession with horror films and watching the shower scene of psycho, watching stuff like silence of the lambs and hell raiser before the age of ten, didn't do me any favors.

Listening to music that glorified being stupid, killing people, being irresponsible, horrorcore rap, heavy metal, it definitely did send my young mind the message that it is cool being a selfish idiot, and being a good person is bad. I admit, I was so stupid I believed that. I hope most youngsters are not that stupid but I'm seeing evidence of a culture and media and entertainment industry that glorifies being stupid and worthless, and the people as a general rule seem to be buying it on average from the people I have met and meet.

That will create stupid worthless people and sociopaths when chronically bombarded with filth and trash and affirmation that being sick is great! It weakens and destroys civilizations.

Thoughts?

Someone who is "a monster" at 15 is a product of her/his environment. But, except in rare cases, someone who is a monster at 30 is that by her/his own decision.

 

[Spiderman]

Someone who is "a monster" at 15 is a product of her/his environment. But, except in rare cases, someone who is a monster at 30 is that by her/his own decision.

I don't think so because there are things I'm drawn to that I can't actually make go away. I don't act on them, but naturally I'm dark, morbid, and love cemeteries, skeletons, death, and chaos, and have a very difficult time delighting in normal stuff.

I have tried with all my might to not be like that. It really isn't something I can make stop. What I have learned how to do is follow the golden rule. I have become like a vicious animal that has been tamed to be a friend of humans and can be played with.

But I'm still obsessed with darkness, I just am charitable and have compassion now. I didn't used to.

So it isn't a choice.

If a person is naturally a homosexual at age 15 to 30 chances are they are gay for life. I'm not gay but some of my depravity is even worse (in most people's opinions. I'm not saying being gay is always depraved either).

If there were a way I could heal and be a socially acceptable person, I would choose to do so.

 

[Heyo]

I don't think so because there are things I'm drawn to that I can't actually make go away. I don't act on them, but naturally I'm dark, morbid, and love cemeteries, skeletons, death, and chaos, and have a very difficult time delighting in normal stuff.

I have tried with all my might to not be like that. It really isn't something I can make stop. What I have learned how to do is follow the golden rule. I have become like a vicious animal that has been tamed to be a friend of humans and can be played with.

But I'm still obsessed with darkness, I just am charitable and have compassion now. I didn't used to.

So it isn't a choice.

If a person is naturally a homosexual at age 15 to 30 chances are they are gay for life. I'm not gay but some of my depravity is even worse (in most people's opinions. I'm not saying being gay is always depraved either).

If there were a way I could heal and be a socially acceptable person, I would choose to do so.

If you don't act on your dark impulses, that is the choice I am talking about. Having a dark fantasy doesn't make you a monster, acting on them does. Some people make a career out of their fantasies. Most psychopaths choose a career where their special abilities are valued and never become criminal.

 

[Gargovic Malkav]

I'm just curious what your take is on why someone turns out that way?

Reasons differ.
But I think the way people are raised plays a significant role is many cases.

For instance, I think it makes a big difference when a mother says to her child: "Don't get to close to the edge of the roof or you'll fall!"
In this scenario the parent is warning the child for a realistic danger.

But some parents would say: "Don't get to close to the edge of the roof, or I will beat the crap out of you!"
In this scenario, the parent is intimidating the child to keep the child under control(and taking out their frustrations on the child when confronted with a lack of control).
I think this has a huge impact on the child's development.

Of course there is still the natural aspect.
But I think I would've become a very different person if God didn't give my mother the balls to run away from my biological father, preventing him the chance to raise me, as he is the textbook example of a narcissistic psychopath.

 

[Nimos]

That will create stupid worthless people and sociopaths when chronically bombarded with filth and trash and affirmation that being sick is great! It weakens and destroys civilizations.

Thoughts?

I don't believe people can chose to do bad things just for doing it, it needs something to trigger it. Whether that is some social aspect like being pressured into it, believing in stuff that justify such thing, traumas, former bad experiences or psychological issues. Whatever could affect someone's behaviour.

If you think you know the causes for your own issues, such as being exposed to pornography at and early age and the other things you mentioned, you might have a chance to come to terms with them.

 

[ChristineM]

I would have to say I have seen evidence that I am a monster who is learning virtue and be a monster who at least fights for what is right and acts in a way that is noble minded. A huge work in progress.

I have known many monsters, and I don't mean selfish children who bully on the playground and torture animals. I'm talking about people that are guilty of torturing people to death, often children.

I'm just curious what your take is on why someone turns out that way?

I would say in my case it was too many factors. One problem is I am the problem. Another problem is exposure to pornography at age 8 did damage. A mom cheating on my Dad did damage with her having multiple partners, one of them who was a convicted sexual offender, wasn't helpful. Being unsupervised contributed.

I'm not one of these guys that feels strongly violent video games can cause school shootings, but I loved them and am open to the possibility, and video games that included stuff traditionally associated with being Satanic potentially played a role. I don't know. An obsession with horror films and watching the shower scene of psycho, watching stuff like silence of the lambs and hell raiser before the age of ten, didn't do me any favors.

Listening to music that glorified being stupid, killing people, being irresponsible, horrorcore rap, heavy metal, it definitely did send my young mind the message that it is cool being a selfish idiot, and being a good person is bad. I admit, I was so stupid I believed that. I hope most youngsters are not that stupid but I'm seeing evidence of a culture and media and entertainment industry that glorifies being stupid and worthless, and the people as a general rule seem to be buying it on average from the people I have met and meet.

That will create stupid worthless people and sociopaths when chronically bombarded with filth and trash and affirmation that being sick is great! It weakens and destroys civilizations.

Thoughts?

There are many factors to shape a person's personality, mostly in the learning environment from infant to mid/late teens. These may be hidden and triggers in later life may set the beast free some are obvious.

I know a police inspector, part of his job is to visit schools to give talks. He claims (and over the years has been proven quite accurate) to be able to sense if a pre teen will grow to be a bad one.

I think the monster is grown in adolescence

 

[PureX]

It's easy for some people to become attracted to the ugliness in life. Especially people who are genetically or otherwise predisposed to additions. Because one of the main components of addiction and addictive behavior is an obsession with hopelessness as an excuse to indulge in the addiction. If "life sucks and then you die" the why not get high, or drunk to the point of oblivion, or even death? Why care how we hurt other people? And so on. Addiction and a fascination with destructive behavior go hand in hand. The "bottom is attractive" as they say in recovery groups. Something that is often difficult for outsiders to understand. And yet it is a very powerful draw to those who have fallen into that abyss. There is freedom and exultation in being a total failure as a human being. And those who do become real monsters, I think, become addicted to the destructiveness of it, itself.

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

I would have to say I have seen evidence that I am a monster who is learning virtue and be a monster who at least fights for what is right and acts in a way that is noble minded. A huge work in progress.

I have known many monsters, and I don't mean selfish children who bully on the playground and torture animals. I'm talking about people that are guilty of torturing people to death, often children.

I'm just curious what your take is on why someone turns out that way?

I would say in my case it was too many factors. One problem is I am the problem. Another problem is exposure to pornography at age 8 did damage. A mom cheating on my Dad did damage with her having multiple partners, one of them who was a convicted sexual offender, wasn't helpful. Being unsupervised contributed.

I'm not one of these guys that feels strongly violent video games can cause school shootings, but I loved them and am open to the possibility, and video games that included stuff traditionally associated with being Satanic potentially played a role. I don't know. An obsession with horror films and watching the shower scene of psycho, watching stuff like silence of the lambs and hell raiser before the age of ten, didn't do me any favors.

Listening to music that glorified being stupid, killing people, being irresponsible, horrorcore rap, heavy metal, it definitely did send my young mind the message that it is cool being a selfish idiot, and being a good person is bad. I admit, I was so stupid I believed that. I hope most youngsters are not that stupid but I'm seeing evidence of a culture and media and entertainment industry that glorifies being stupid and worthless, and the people as a general rule seem to be buying it on average from the people I have met and meet.

That will create stupid worthless people and sociopaths when chronically bombarded with filth and trash and affirmation that being sick is great! It weakens and destroys civilizations.

Thoughts?

Thoughts? Yes: “monsters” are people too.

It may be a very hard pill to swallow at times, but that is the simple matter of things.

The greatest of worldly evils* are rooted in unaddressed suffering or misdirected hatred and pain.

*) Excluding that which concerns neurological disfunction, as such behaviour is not within in my definition of “evil”.

Evil is a slave to its obsession with suffering - its own and especially, that of others.


Humbly
Hermit

 

[Dan From Smithville]

People defend the filth being unleashed in media today as expressions of freedom. But ancient philosophy tells us that freedom is not given for license but for cultivating virtue in yourself. But if you try to point out that things were better in the 1940s they'll bring up racism and sexism to prove you wrong. But of course we don't have to have racism/sexism just to go back to common decency so that's not an argument.

I wasn't alive in the 40's. How were they better? Like a big war do you?

 

[Kooky]

People defend the filth being unleashed in media today as expressions of freedom. But ancient philosophy tells us that freedom is not given for license but for cultivating virtue in yourself. But if you try to point out that things were better in the 1940s they'll bring up racism and sexism to prove you wrong. But of course we don't have to have racism/sexism just to go back to common decency so that's not an argument.

How would you know that things were better in the 1940s, have you lived there?

Also, the question should always be: "Better for whom"?
As a diabetic, I would have likely died in the 1940s, and as a socialist, I would have likely been murdered by fascists or imprisoned by liberals.

So sure, maybe things would have been better for you living in a racist or fascist white state in 1940. Or maybe they wouldn't have been, maybe your situation would be worse. A lot of people had a rather terrible time during the 1940s, who's to say that you wouldn't be among them?

 

[Spiderman]

How would you know that things were better in the 1940s, have you lived there?

Also, the question should always be: "Better for whom"?
As a diabetic, I would have likely died in the 1940s, and as a socialist, I would have likely been murdered by fascists or imprisoned by liberals.

So sure, maybe things would have been better for you living in a racist or fascist white state in 1940. Or maybe they wouldn't have been, maybe your situation would be worse. A lot of people had a rather terrible time during the 1940s, who's to say that you wouldn't be among them?

America has far worse crime was the context I was primarily speaking of now. The people I've talked to from generations ago say there were no school shootings and much lesser suicide rate. Mental illness I have reason to believe wasn't as common. People weren't as heavily medicated.

There were more nuclear families. More children had a strong Father figure and Mother figure to teach them maturity and discipline.

I didn't say that it was better in every single way. Women's rights and rights for other ethnicities has improved. But has culture really become more healthy? Culture is imploding all the signs would suggest.

I mean, we had people storm the white house and Capitol Hill waving Confederate flags and people got killed, and in my city a bunch of businesses were burned to the ground and police essentially just said **** it , lets let the city burn and wait for national guards to show up.

It is way more unsafe than it was when there were censorship laws and not a bunch of glorification of being a selfish pig or sociopath in the entertainment industry and media.

Even among African Americans, it is overall better now, but black on black killings didn't used to be as common, and more black Fathers were there on average for their children in previous generations.

Now, one in 9 black children has had a Father in prison, and I don't think that counts as the ones that went to jail without going to prison. Living in a black neigborhood myself , drug addiction , violence, hip hop glorifying crime, death from overdoses, and shootings run rampant.

No one is going to convince me that it was like that in the 30's 40's and 50's. I'm just saying, overall it's probably better to be black in America today, but in the ghettos I've lived in like Saint Luke's mission of mercy in Buffalo New York, I would prefer possibly the 1950's or death over that , because my suspicion is very strong that the glorification of crime that is constantly bombarding them now is worse, creating a greater hell in their neighborhoods.

 

[Quagmire]

I think we all have a monster inside of us. Regardless where it came from or who or what put it there, it's all ours now.

So each of us has to take responsibility for our own monster, because if we don't somebody else will, and those arrangements usually suck pretty bad.

 

[74x12]

How would you know that things were better in the 1940s, have you lived there?

Also, the question should always be: "Better for whom"?
As a diabetic, I would have likely died in the 1940s, and as a socialist, I would have likely been murdered by fascists or imprisoned by liberals.

So sure, maybe things would have been better for you living in a racist or fascist white state in 1940. Or maybe they wouldn't have been, maybe your situation would be worse. A lot of people had a rather terrible time during the 1940s, who's to say that you wouldn't be among them?

Even though I've already addressed this line of flawed reasoning I see you still can't resist.

We're talking about morals and ethics here. Not racism, not sexism, not technology and not fascism of all things.

 

[Kooky]

Even though I've already addressed this line of flawed reasoning I see you still can't resist.

We're talking about morals and ethics here. Not racism, not sexism, not technology and not fascism of all things.

Well, morally and ethically, the 1940s were among the worst periods in human existence, with racial segregation, genocide, colonialism, fascism and overall oppression being part of the daily lives of more people than in any other period since. Stalinism, Nazism, and the Holocaust are some of the moral and human tragedies of that era.

EDIT: If you ignore all of that, then we aren't talking about the real 1940s, we are talking about a fantasy construction that has little to do with real life history.
In that case, we might as well talk about how nice of a place Middleearth, Narnia or Oz would be.

 

[74x12]

Well, morally and ethically, the 1940s were among the worst periods in human existence, with racial segregation, genocide, colonialism, fascism and overall oppression being part of the daily lives of more people than in any other period since. Stalinism, Nazism, and the Holocaust are some of the moral and human tragedies of that era.

EDIT: If you ignore all of that, then we aren't talking about the real 1940s, we are talking about a fantasy construction that has little to do with real life history.
In that case, we might as well talk about how nice of a place Middleearth, Narnia or Oz would be.

If you paint with such broad strokes modern times are not any better ... human trafficking, slavery, terrorism etc. You're damning ordinary people for the actions of dictators and sleazy thugs. Or are you also admitting culpability for all those things happening now in your own time?

I think I can logically point out how some things were better then without condoning the mistakes and downright evil of those days. As it is now so it was then. There were good and bad people. Since you bring up the holocaust let's talk about that. Some people actually rescued holocaust victims. Would you judge them too? Are you so righteous?

I believe it is you who are living in a magical fairy tale because you don't want to see how things really were or are.

 

[Kooky]

If you paint with such broad strokes modern times are not any better ... human trafficking, slavery, terrorism etc. You're damning ordinary people for the actions of dictators and sleazy thugs. Or are you also admitting culpability for all those things happening now in your own time?

I'm not damning anyone. I simply question your praise for the "ethics" of a time period most infamous for a world spanning war and both the most brutal tyrannies and the most horrific genocides in recorded human history.

Some people rescued Holocaust victims. Some people made the Holocaust happen. Many did nothing.
Tell me how that makes the 1940s more moral than our age.

Sure, if you completely ignore all the bad things that happened, and only ever look at people doing good things, and then compare it to the full gamut of today, good and bad, then the 1940s come out smelling like roses. But you have to acknowledge that you are deliberately constructing a lopsided comparison there.