Why I CANNOT Believe in The Resurrection

[ElishaElijah]

already done. God speaks through reason. It’s unreasonable to think that any document can be its own authority.

God is the one who gave the Scriptures that authority and will hold everyone accountable to His Word, the Scriptures.

 

[sojourner]

The Trinity is a serious problem for Jesus and the resurrection since he IS part of the sacrifice and the beneficiary of that sacrifice. Jesus needs to be separate and independent for salvation to work. The Trinity is a disputed belief, as you know.

There is no “separation.” Salvation is realizing the oneness of creation and the oneness of creation and Creator.

Well if a God impregnates a woman to create a child to sacrifice to itself is DOES have an obligation to follow through with the plan. Otherwise God would be flawed and have to change. Plus surely God would know Jesus wouldn't bail out of being executed since god is all-knowing, right? Or can God be fooled? If jesus and God are one in the Trinity the God will know what jesus is thinking, yes? So God cannot avoid the plan it sets.

God didn’t impregnate a woman to create a child to be sacrificed. God sacrificed Divinity to become human. Out of love — not out of some imagined “obligation” to do so.

When is this supposed to happen? Some 2000 years and humanity isn't divine yet.

Yes we are. We’re simply living a nightmare and need to wake up. That’s what the Greek term anastasis, translated as “resurrection” means: to get up, as in arising from sleep. We are inherently Divine, as is the whole created order. Everything is made out of the substance of God.

Unimportant

I said relatively. Salvation doesn’t hinge on the suffering, IMO.

Irrelevant to the topic.

No, it’s vitally relevant. Do you know how much suffering is involved in being crucified? Just undergoing the process is sacrifice enough, I think. Even if one doesn’t die.

 

[sojourner]

God is the one who gave the Scriptures that authority and will hold everyone accountable to His Word, the Scriptures.

Nope. Church councils set the canon and imparted authority to certain texts.

 

[ElishaElijah]

OK, what is that, and prove it's a real thing that happens outside of your imagination. I won't take your work for it.


OK, prove this God exists outside of your imagination and verify it is doing what you are claiming here. I'm not convinced you are correct.


OK, what is your test in reality. Every believer is confident in their beliefs, yet there's so much disagreement. This suggests believers are overconfident.


You're correct that lazy believers just adopt the interpretation they hear from others. I'd think if a God really existed it would be active correcting people. This doesn't happen, so the God dews';t exist, or just doesn't care that so many are off the mark.

When you experience God for yourself and are filled with the Holy Spirit that’s when you know. Some people never get there, die in their sins. I was fortunate, when I called to God He showed up.
“And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭1:13-14‬ ‭NIV‬‬

 

[danieldemol]

Why not Bruce Metzger? Why not believe the man that taught Ehrman ? I notice who seems to drawn in by Bart . Even Bart gets misquoted . Why would I trust over and above my own reading of a bible I can readily pick up in any book shop ? Do you need boffins to tell what to believe? Are you that vulnerable?

I don't let anyone tell me what to believe, I listen to people and then check, and Bart checked out really well when I checked.

Have you ever really listened to then cross checked a decent Bart lecture?

 

[ElishaElijah]

Nope. Church councils set the canon and imparted authority to certain texts.

“Although I hope to come to you soon, I am writing you these instructions so that, if I am delayed, you will know how people ought to conduct themselves in God’s household, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭3:14-15‬ ‭NIV‬‬
“Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household, built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. In him the whole building is joined together and rises to become a holy temple in the Lord. And in him you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭2:19-22‬ ‭NIV‬‬

 

[SeekingAllTruth]

Why I CANNOT Believe in The Resurrection

Jesus' father should have been a unique original God not shared by any other religion. But he is not. Yahweh is a pagan minor god of the Canaanite pantheon of gods led by El that the Jews adopted as their own god when the Jews dwelt among the Canaanites. You can see in Genesis how Yahweh constantly says, "We" and then he becomes a singular god and divorces Asherah his wife. As such Mary was impregnated with Jesus by a pagan god. Jesus cannot be the Messiah. So he didn't resurrect because a pagan god has no power to resurrect.

 

[sojourner]

“Although I hope to come to you soon, I am writing you these instructions so that, if I am delayed, you will know how people ought to conduct themselves in God’s household, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭3:14-15‬ ‭NIV‬‬
“Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household, built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. In him the whole building is joined together and rises to become a holy temple in the Lord. And in him you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭2:19-22‬ ‭NIV‬‬

Yet you deny the church’s wisdom and authority in other things.


Interesting...

 

[sojourner]

Why I CANNOT Believe in The Resurrection

Jesus' father should have been a unique original God not shared by any other religion. But he is not. Yahweh is a pagan minor god of the Canaanite pantheon of gods led by El that the Jews adopted as their own god when the Jews dwelt among the Canaanites. You can see in Genesis how Yahweh constantly says, "We" and then he becomes a singular god and divorces Asherah his wife. As such Mary was impregnated with Jesus by a pagan god. Jesus cannot be the Messiah. So he didn't resurrect because a pagan god has no power to resurrect.

We all have the power to stand up.

 

[John1.12]

I don't let anyone tell me what to believe, I listen to people and then check, and Bart checked out really well when I checked.

Have you ever really listened to then cross checked a decent Bart lecture?

I've mainly listened to all his debates.

 

[John1.12]

Hmmm, hard to say. If he exists he used Christian scientists to refute the Flood.

The same ones that try to explain all the water on earth ? And the something from nothing fairy tale?

 

[John1.12]

The atonement doctrine implies that Jesus was just waiting around getting fattened up to be a blemish free human sacrifice to finally make a way for God to forgive?

When the Israelites had finally rejected the Gospel of Christ and sought to stop him by having him killed, Jesus gave them a severe tongue lashing, a verbal beat down.


“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You build tombs for the prophets and decorate the graves of the righteous. 30 And you say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our ancestors, we would not have taken part with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’ 31 So you testify against yourselves that you are the descendants of those who murdered the prophets. 32 Go ahead, then, and complete what your ancestors started!

33 “You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell? 34 Therefore I am sending you prophets and sages and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town. 35 And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36 Truly I tell you, all this will come on this generation.

37 “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. 38 Look, your house is left to you desolate. 39 For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’”

Killing Jesus wasn't the Gospel!

Jesus turning to them said, “Daughters of Jerusalem, do not weep for me, but weep for yourselves and for your children. For behold, the days are coming when they will say, ‘Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bore, and the breasts that never gave suck!’ Then they will begin to say to the mountains, ‘Fall on us’; and to the hills, ‘Cover us’. For if they do this when the wood is green, what will happen when it is dry?”

Not supposed to reject Jesus's message and kill him!

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Footnotes

The gospel of christ comes after the cross.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Yet you deny the church’s wisdom and authority in other things.


Interesting...

When they go against the Word of God, yes. You read Revelation letters to the Churches?

 

[John1.12]

What on earth do you mean by "unbelieving scientists". You imagine all scientists are atheists? Just to inform you, that is not true.

Furthermore, it's not the role of scientists to teach spiritual truths. Their role, is to help us understand the natural world. What we do with that after the fact, is a matter of faith. Some choose to reject what science shows us, because it conflicts with their beliefs. Rather than examining their faith and beliefs, the choose to ignore science.

And to me, that is not true faith at all. It's fear, and a marriage to one's ideas, rather than a commitment to Truth. Others, like myself, accept the sciences and modify what I may believe about God to take into account sound, and credible science. Can you say the same thing? If not, why not?

If a person rejects the biblical worldview he will arrive at different conclusions. Just like the scientists who do believe in a worldwide flood do .

 

[John1.12]

And I quote the Bible back to you, you cant accept that because the Bible contradicts itself. The reason that the Bible contradicts itself is because it contains human ideas mixed in with divine revelation. Those Human ideas were converted to scripture by the fallible men of the church in order to have a foundation for their authority. So Bible worshipers must then ignore inconsistencies and pretend there a seamless transition from the religion of Judaism to the religion about Jesus which replaced the religion of Jesus.

Do you think all this stuff is influencing your judgement. It certainly would to me if I was reading the bible with the ' glasses ' your wearing.

 

[Subduction Zone]

The same ones that try to explain all the water on earth ? And the something from nothing fairy tale?

Why do you think the relatively small amount of water on the Earth is so hard to explain? You almost seem like a Flat Earther when you make this argument.

By the way, "something from nothing" is a strawman argument. You only demonstrate that you have no clue what you are talking about. You one the other hand apparently do believe in the something from nothing fairy tale. Or did you forget the magical beginning of the Earth (LOL! Not even the Solar System, quite the error there) in Genesis?

 

[John1.12]

The most pertinent part of your post are the first three words.

God uses unbelieving people all the time.

My point was about what certain scientists believe which contradicts the bible.

 

[Subduction Zone]

My point was about what certain scientists believe which contradicts the bible.

Sometimes the Bible is just wrong. It is wrong even about the Bible.

 

[John1.12]

Sometimes the Bible is just wrong. It is wrong even about the Bible.

If you read the bible as if its not true ,what do you expect ?

 

[Subduction Zone]

If you read the bible as if its not true ,what do you expect ?

If the Bible was true it would not have endless errors in it. I do not make assumptions either way at the start. It is when one makes the error that something is true without evidence that they believe such books.

You do not even seem to know how to test your beliefs properly. Here is a challenge, can you think of a proper challenge for your beliefs?