Christian Trinity

[Fool]

The is no reference to the son of God in the OT. By sons of God I infer you men "human" sons, which are not "the son of God." You may also mean Paul's reference to Jesus being our brother, which means, of course, we are equal to Jesus, and therefore we are all sons of God. It gets kind of confusing. If you eliminate the son of God from the Trinity, you have no logical contradiction.

son of god

the son of God is heaven and earth; which is created, begotten of God's spirit. behold i am making all things new. I AM that i am is god omnipresent and intrinsic to all as ONE. Christ isn't exclusive to Jesus. colossians 3:11 tells you this

in creating you transform something. in transforming something, the form is destroyed and another form created from it. but transforming it is preserved in another form. like the phoenix.

that is the trinity.

energy cannot be trully created, or destroyed, it is simply preserved in another form. 1 st law of thermodynamics.

welcome to the real world.


brahma, shiva, and vishnu are all aspects of the supreme being.

 

[Repox]

the son of God is heaven and earth; which is created, begotten of God's spirit. behold i am making all things new. I AM that i am is god omnipresent and intrinsic to all as ONE.

in creating your transform something. in transforming something, the form is destroyed and another form created from it. but transforming it is preserved in another form. like the phoenix.

that is the trinity.

energy cannot be trully created, or destroyed, it is simply preserved in another form. 1 st law of thermodynamics.

welcome to the real world.


brahma, shiva, and vishnu are all aspects of the supreme being.

Based on church history, church leaders invented the Trinity to allow for the son of God to be part of God. For those who worship the Trinity, equal weight is given to the three entities. The Trinity has nothing to do with the Frist Law of Thermodynamics. It is not a scientific symbol, it is a religious symbol. I suppose you can ignore the original meaning of the Trinity, and each religion can redefine it, but, the problem remains, it is illogical.

 

[Fool]

Based on church history, church leaders invented the Trinity to allow for the son of God to be part of God. For those who worship the Trinity, equal weight is given to the three entities. The Trinity has nothing to do with the Frist Law of Thermodynamics. It is not a scientific symbol, it is a religious symbol. I suppose you can ignore the original meaning of the Trinity, and each religion can redefine it, but, the problem remains, it is illogical.

if you have followed the thread you would note that the idea of the trinity was introduced through gnostic sources; which is mentioned at Luke 11:52. there were jewish gnostics.

creation, transformation(preservation), and destruction are not unique to christianity, hinduism, or western science.

the op was given to show that Jesus isn't equal to the Father because he isn't exclusively the son of God.

there are others as jesus noted in the quote from psalms. hebrews mentions melchizedek as the son of God too.

 

[Repox]

if you have followed the thread you would note that the idea of the trinity was introduced through gnostic sources; which is mentioned at Luke 11:52. there were jewish gnostics.

creation, transformation(preservation), and destruction are not unique to christianity, hinduism, or western science.

the op was given to show that Jesus isn't equal to the Father because he isn't exclusively the son of God.

there are others as jesus noted in the quote from psalms. hebrews mentions melchizedek as the son of God too.

I understand your clarification. It makes the Trinity meaningless, or subject to a multitude of interpretations, as far as one can stretch the metaphysical content of the Bible. It makes God a metaphysical giant with outstretched hands for any and all apparent meanings. Therefore, there is no God, no son of God, no Holy Spirit, just hybrid of meanings to suite one's fancy. Maybe that is what humans want, a god to identify with, a god to define, and a god to play with. It creates ambiguities while clarifying human needs as they become manifested in each twist and turn of the Godhead. Ultimately, it makes God a topic of continual discussion and debate. In heaven, philosopher kings would surround God with their discussions and continual redefinitions and abstractions. Is God up to it? Does He have an advance degree?

In my opinion, it is futile to define God, even though it may be a noble endeavor. To have a good perspective, one needs to be in the presence of God. Then, I don't think one could explain it. What I know is God is a duality, both Gods permanently attached to one another inside a glorious sphere. However, no define will suffice. We would have to be spiritual beings in heaven to really understand. Some gnostic definitions of God are interesting, they seem to suggest God is pure knowledge or found inside us. We will never really know as long as we live in a finite material world.

 

[Beth Stitely]

The first major flaw in Christian logic I noticed was the Problem of Evil.
Soon after, however, came the realization that Trinitarian Monotheism is an oxymoron. 1+1+1=1 only has value to a religionist with a particular theological axe to grind.
Tom

1X1X1=1

 

[Enoch07]

Are all aspects of the trinity equal?


John 10:29
My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

John 14:28
You have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If you loved me, you would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.

Depends on your deinition of equal. Each aspect of the trinity serves different purposes.

So with that I ask. Are all 3 of your aspects equal?

You have your rational/logical aspect. We'll call this the brain/mind/conscious.

You have your emotional aspect. We'll call this your heart/soul/unconscious.

Lastly we have your physical aspect. We'll call this your primal aspect. Food, sex, money, survival, power etc.

These 3 aspects are all you, but they can overide each other depending on the situation.

 

[New Age Spiritual Leader]

I believe God doesn't have parts. I do believe He is everywhere so it might seem like He has parts.

"He is everywhere"
You and others only say this, because you believe what other men told you.

In the esoteric sense, Global Consciousness is everywhere. Does that make humans "gods"?

You'll put "God" on this pedestal, but you fail to realize that "if He is everywhere" - evil would not exist.

But you can't see the finer details within your speak.

If "He is everywhere" - why do we have starvation, illness, murders and killings still happening?

Isn't your "God" powerful enough to stop these things from occurring?

It appears you fear life and to thwart this fear, you place the comfort of an "all-powerful being" to be always with you in your mind, because it doesn't require you to take full responsibility for your actions.

And when this "god" fails - you blame some other entity - "Satan".....when nothing is ever to be proven to be such.

You should be ashamed of yourself for promoting a ruse.

One can comfort others, be kind to others, care for others with complete effort.....ALL WITHOUT THE USE OF ANY RELIGION.

You apparently cannot realize this for yourself, so you require the counsel of other men to guide you. "Other men" who never met this god, nor never heard this god, and are only going by what yet other men told them.

Maybe you should ask your powerful god to guide you instead. Maybe you should ask Jesus.

*sighs*

 

[New Age Spiritual Leader]

I believe the Truth stands on its own. It is good to have a majority stand for it though.

What truth?

So now you think you know the truth of your religion......if so.....then you will have no problem answering - WITH COMPLETE TRUTH - the following questions:

Where does "God" specifically states whom is inspired and whom is not?


Where does "God" specifically states which texts are more holier than others?


Where does "God" specifically states which texts are scripture and which are not?

***************************

Please provide sources for your answers and/or links that show your answers to be true.

If you cannot, please just say...."I don't know". In the least you are being honest.

If you choose otherwise, it will be a clear indication that you are avoiding to answer and probably don't know what you are even talking about.

In other words - we will know if you are being honest or not.

Good luck!

 

[New Age Spiritual Leader]

I believe since you so easily believe in false concepts that this one may well be the case also but I wouldn't say so because I only know you from your words. However if you think that false concepts of God means you know more about God than I do then I believe you now Him less.

Now you speak of knowing what are false concepts?

Gee - you sure think you are special.

How about answering a few more questions then.....Every time I have posed them, everyone seems to run and hide....

Now its your turn to teach me what I do not know.

Are you a sinner? How so?

What "sinning" have you done?

Can you please describe the following "sin types" that Christianity states do exist and how they apply to humankind?

Where does "God" describe what a "common sin" is?

Where does "God" describe what a "mortal sin" is?

Where does "God" describe what a "venial sin" is?

Please provide links and/or sources for these answers.

********************************

Not tough at all, huh?

We'll see, won't we.

 

[New Age Spiritual Leader]

I believe basing your lack of belief in religion on a false concept leaves you without a valid reason.

You lack a belief in many teachings by Jesus. What is your excuse?

Gospel of Thomas - Patterson & Robinson Translation -- Nag Hammadi Library

Are you one of those "naysayers of Jesus", just because some guy told you that they are not valid?

How is it that you can think a "half-Jesus" is a "complete Jesus"? Just because men told you not to obey those teachings?

Did you even know of those teachings?

What kind of excuses will you give to explain yourself for not following all of what Jesus taught?

Yes "muffled" - we will know if you are a so-called "Christian" in truth.....or just a poser with a pension to follow what men tell them?

Why won't you follow Jesus completely?

Why do you research every other aspect of your life, except the religion you tout?
- Yes you will. You will research what food you will eat. You will research medical and health benefits. You will research insurance for your home, car, and life. YOu will research pretty much everything you interact with on a daily basis....>EXCEPT RELIGION<!!

Why?

Why can't you be completely honest with yourself and others?

Be honest with others for once in your life. You've been duped by men you don't know.

 

[Fool]

I understand your clarification. It makes the Trinity meaningless, or subject to a multitude of interpretations, as far as one can stretch the metaphysical content of the Bible. It makes God a metaphysical giant with outstretched hands for any and all apparent meanings. Therefore, there is no God, no son of God, no Holy Spirit, just hybrid of meanings to suite one's fancy. Maybe that is what humans want, a god to identify with, a god to define, and a god to play with. It creates ambiguities while clarifying human needs as they become manifested in each twist and turn of the Godhead. Ultimately, it makes God a topic of continual discussion and debate. In heaven, philosopher kings would surround God with their discussions and continual redefinitions and abstractions. Is God up to it? Does He have an advance degree?

In my opinion, it is futile to define God, even though it may be a noble endeavor. To have a good perspective, one needs to be in the presence of God. Then, I don't think one could explain it. What I know is God is a duality, both Gods permanently attached to one another inside a glorious sphere. However, no define will suffice. We would have to be spiritual beings in heaven to really understand. Some gnostic definitions of God are interesting, they seem to suggest God is pure knowledge or found inside us. We will never really know as long as we live in a finite material world.

forms are finite, energy isn't. all finite forms are forms of infinite energy. E = m(c*c)

 

[Fool]

You lack a belief in many teachings by Jesus. What is your excuse?

Gospel of Thomas - Patterson & Robinson Translation -- Nag Hammadi Library

Are you one of those "naysayers of Jesus", just because some guy told you that they are not valid?

How is it that you can think a "half-Jesus" is a "complete Jesus"? Just because men told you not to obey those teachings?

Did you even know of those teachings?

What kind of excuses will you give to explain yourself for not following all of what Jesus taught?

Yes "muffled" - we will know if you are a so-called "Christian" in truth.....or just a poser with a pension to follow what men tell them?

Why won't you follow Jesus completely?

Why do you research every other aspect of your life, except the religion you tout?
- Yes you will. You will research what food you will eat. You will research medical and health benefits. You will research insurance for your home, car, and life. YOu will research pretty much everything you interact with on a daily basis....>EXCEPT RELIGION<!!

Why?

Why can't you be completely honest with yourself and others?

Be honest with others for once in your life. You've been duped by men you don't know.

St Thomas Christians or the Syrian Malabar Nasrani are one of the oldest forms of Christianity. There is historical documentation corroborating the fact but many won't look past their own local denomination.

nasrani

St Thomas Christians

 

[InChrist]

we all became flesh; if all of us have the Spirit of God?


1 Corinthians 3:16
Do you not know that you are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit dwells in you?

We were all born as humans and our existence began. The scriptures reveal that eternal Son of God became flesh temporarily.
How have you determined that you or all of us have the Spirit of God, according not just by that one verse, but the entire chapter of 1 Corinthians and the message Paul has expressed therein?

 

[Fool]

We were all born as humans and our existence began. The scriptures reveal that eternal Son of God became flesh temporarily.
How have you determined that you or all of us have the Spirit of God, according not just by that one verse, but the entire chapter of 1 Corinthians and the message Paul has expressed therein?

plenty of passages.

Colossian 3:11 Christ is all and in all.

Ecclesiastes 12:7
and the dust returns to the ground it came from, and the spirit returns to God who gave it.

The spirit created heaven and earth from God because I AM that i am.
Exodus 3:14


Romans 8:11
If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit who dwells in you.


Nehemiah 9:30
For many years you were patient with them. By your Spirit you warned them through your prophets. Yet they paid no attention, so you gave them into the hands of the neighboring peoples.

 

[InChrist]

plenty of passages.

Colossian 3:11 Christ is all and in all.

Ecclesiastes 12:7
and the dust returns to the ground it came from, and the spirit returns to God who gave it.

The spirit created heaven and earth from God because I AM that i am.
Exodus 3:14


Romans 8:11
If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit who dwells in you.


Nehemiah 9:30
For many years you were patient with them. By your Spirit you warned them through your prophets. Yet they paid no attention, so you gave them into the hands of the neighboring peoples.

So when you read those verses do you read them in the context of the rest of the passage or chapter or isolated as you have listed them? Do you believe that everyone automatically has the Spirit or do the scriptures indicate something takes place which causes the Spirit to begin dwelling in a person?

 

[Fool]

So when you read those verses do you read them in the context of the rest of the passage or chapter or isolated as you have listed them? Do you believe that everyone automatically has the Spirit or do the scriptures indicate something takes place which causes the Spirit to begin dwelling in a person?

I've read the bible more than 14 times in the last 20+ yrs using more than one translation. I now look closely at both the hebrew and the greek words used to translate them. I've also read many, many commentaries on said books, chapters, verses.

Jesus didn't quote whole passages from the bible. He literally used single verses to get his point across. Jesus didn't say worshiping himself, or flattering him, but believing him and putting into practice what he taught.

Everyone has the Spirit, not everyone overcomes the first death.

More for you,

call no man father on earth because you have one Father in heaven.

Our Father who art.............

Malachi 2:10
Do we not all have one Father? Did not one God create us? Why do we profane the covenant of our ancestors by being unfaithful to one another?

Romans 1:7
To all in Rome who are loved by God and called to be his holy people: Grace and peace to you from God our Father and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

1 Corinthians 1:3
Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Galatians 4:6
Because you are his sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls out, “Abba, Father.”

James 1:27
Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

 

[Muffled]

What majority?
Most people know that your religion is wrong. That's why most people aren't Christian.
Tom

I believe I know some people who are not Christian and mostly they either lack knowledge or don't like what is right about the religion. I believe some people think they know Christianity is wrong but they are wrong about it.

 

[Muffled]

how do you define aspect?

I believe this is an interesting subject to me because it is the name God gave me. It means that which may be perceived. So if I perceive that you have blue eyes it is one of your aspects. If I perceive that you like the color blue that is an aspect even though it is not part of you and could be temporal ie tomorrow you might like green.

 

[Muffled]

This, in brief, is the amazing story of how the doctrine of the Trinity came to be introduced—and how those who refused to accept it came to be branded as heretics or unbelievers.
The Surprising Origins of the Trinity Doctrine

I believe one might learn as much about Christianity from reading Harry Potter. The facts are not there to support the conclusion.

 

[Nakosis]

I believe one might learn as much about Christianity from reading Harry Potter. The facts are not there to support the conclusion.

The pope may have condemned the Harry Potter books, but J K Rowling has now revealed that Christianity has been one of her major inspirations.

J K Rowling: 'Christianity inspired Harry Potter'