Jeremiahcp
Well-Known Jerk
Lust is what gets me up in the morning.
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L U S T
- Thread starter Skwim
- Start date
Matthew 5:28, according to the NWT, says; "But I say to you that everyone who keeps on looking at a woman so as to have a passion for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart." Jesus was not discussing a passing look, but rather a man who would continue to dwell on immoral thoughts, to the point that only opportunity is lacking to complete the sin.
I do not believe Jesus was suggesting self-mutilation. Rather, he was advising drastic, even painful action, to avoid sinning.
I do not believe Jesus was suggesting self-mutilation. Rather, he was advising drastic, even painful action, to avoid sinning.
This is a great post, we do seem very conditioned to obsessing over sex. Sex feels great, well good sex...but, I also prefer it to be a sacred bond between me and my fiance, for example. At the same time, I think that lust is a very natural biological urge, and sometimes, we can be too tough on ourselves for ''lusting'' after another.
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
The idea that the all-powerful creator and ruler of the universe cares about the petty details of the reproductive drives and behaviors of a semi-primitive species who lives on a tiny speck, seems rather silly.
Although, I do understand why it seems so important to that species, and why it would become a focus of their clumsy and myopic attempts at creating religions.
Although, I do understand why it seems so important to that species, and why it would become a focus of their clumsy and myopic attempts at creating religions.
Jonathan Ainsley Bain
Logical Positivist
I think that being naturally attracted to someone for honest reasons is not actually 'lust'.
Lust seems to me to be a word that has all the negative connotations of a person using sex as an emotional crutch;
as a pseudo-emotion - something to fulfill the void of a emotionally deprived existence.
Jonathan Ainsley Bain
Logical Positivist
Only if they want the perfect spiritual emotions.
Jonathan Ainsley Bain
Logical Positivist
Being all-powerful he would care about each and every speck of dust intimately.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
And if a man and woman know for sure that one of them is infertile, it's okay for them to marry, just as long as they don't have sex? This is absolutely nuts!
Jonathan Ainsley Bain
Logical Positivist
Its not a matter of being ok, or not ok.
Sure its ok to have sex.
But if sex is just an emotional crutch - something you seek in order avoid
deep spiritual introspection - then its better for your 'happiness' to avoid sex.
If somebody's spiritual path is leading them to sex, then it would be wrong to
try and coerce them against it. But if you can willfully realize that it is just a base pleasure,
and progress beyond it, then all the better for you.
Its like trying to tell a fat person they should not eat ice-cream unless they are physically hungry.
Is that extra ice-cream going to make them happier?
Or will it result in a brief happiness followed by a more enduring self-loathing?
A depression which they have forgotten comes from seeking pleasure from eating.
How do you feel when the love-affair ends?
Happy?
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
All I know is that my love affair with my husband has lasted over 46 years now, and it's been years since my child-bearing days. I believe that while creating children is an integral and beautiful aspect of marital intimacy, to use it only for that purpose is to deny its great potential as an expression of love, commitment, and unity.
Jonathan Ainsley Bain
Logical Positivist
Oh sure.
But it is not the greatest expression of such.
Perhaps those things can be realized more fully, when they are more subtle?
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Well, to each his own.
james bond
Well-Known Member
Last point first. Did you miss Freud while in college? It's not just about sexual pleasure, but pain and pleasure. Love is about love and hate. The difficulty is we can't just separate one from the other. We are supposedly attracted to our opposite. What people do is end up taking it to extremes from problems in their love relationship where a healthy balance is required. (I think the lust relationship is a reflection of the love relationship.) Let's look at what Freud said about this since this was his bailiwick.
"I enjoyed this exhibition a lot. It is small, elegant, and understated, carefully curated by Dr Janine Burke, who has invited contemporary artists to contribute works that respond to the theme of love and lust in Freud’s work. Influenced by the ancient figure of Eros, the “love-force”, who emerged after chaos at the beginning of the world, Freud’s views on love were miscellaneous. He wrote in 1921: “Language has carried out a completely justifiable piece of unification by creating the word ‘love’ with its many uses.”
One of his most interesting ideas is that love and hate can co-exist as “ambivalence”; that the life drive, Eros, competes with the death drive, Thanatos; in other words, human beings are not merely driven towards self-preservation and happiness, but self-destruction too. This often seems to be the case in matters of love.
In 1926, Freud wrote, “[Eros] strives to make the ego and the loved object one, abolish all spatial barriers between them.” This sense of collapsed boundaries is present in Rachel Kneebone’s triptych of white porcelain sculptures, Emerging Out of an Inconceivable Void into the Play of Beings (2014), which is displayed in the hallway alongside Freud’s overcoat and glasses. It is a fascinating and delicate work."
https://www.freud.org.uk/exhibitions/75653/freud-and-eros-love-lust-and-longing/
Freud wrote "Beyond the Pleasure Principle" which is difficult reading, but summarized here.
"The essay describes humans as struggling between two opposing drives: Eros, which produces creativity, harmony, sexual connection, reproduction, and self-preservation; and Thanatos, which brings destruction, repetition, aggression, compulsion, and self-destruction.
In sections IV and V, Freud posits that the process of creating living cells binds energy and creates an imbalance. It is the pressure of matter to return to its original state which gives cells their quality of living. The process is analogous to the creation and exhaustion of a battery. This pressure for molecular diffusion can be called a "death-wish". The compulsion of the matter in cells to return to a diffuse, inanimate state extends to the whole living organism. Thus, the psychological death-wish is a manifestation of an underlying physical compulsion present in every cell.
Freud also stated the basic differences, as he saw them, between his approach and Carl Jung's, and summarized published research into basic drives (Section VI)."
Beyond the Pleasure Principle - Wikipedia
Saint Frankenstein, whether the views are screwed up is up to you, but lust in a relationship isn't just about the ole in-and-out.
james bond
Well-Known Member
I have to confess I avoided the Matthew part because that is a book that has troubled me in life the past year or so. Why are you saying this is adultery? In this case, I think you misunderstand what is meant by lust. It's isn't just sexual gratification or pleasure for oneself, but greed and possession. Throughout the Bible, there is warning about having too much of sexual gratification for oneself, greed and possession. It's addictive.
Skwim
Veteran Member
Care to rephrase this please. But let me just say, lust is not sexual gratification or sexual pleasure, or greed and possession, but The craving for sexual gratification.
Definition of craving
- : an intense, urgent, or abnormal desire or longing.
Jonathan Ainsley Bain
Logical Positivist
Well, to each his own.
Would you love your husband less if he failed to perform?
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
An interesting, if baseless, presumption.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Absolutely not. But I don't see that as a very good argument for your position.
Jonathan Ainsley Bain
Logical Positivist
It shows that the love and the sex are not the same thing at all.
Learn to think figuratively.