I was a Christian ... once upon a time

[tarasan]

I was a christian many years ago. I believed I was saved and I believed that Jesus loved me. I began to question my faith and the more questions I asked, the more my faith fell apart. I felt sure God would answer all my questions eventually. But no answers came. I gradually realised that i was just talking to myself.

In my opinion, Christianity (and every other monotheistic religion I have encountered) fails from several standpoints - moral, scientific and logical. It seems to me that if someone is religious at all, it is overwhelmingly likely that they will have the same religion as their parents. It's a cultural phenomenon.

welcome man,

I asked questions too! turns out you werent reading the right books

lol oj good to have you around!

 

[Oneatatime]

I was a christian many years ago. I believed I was saved and I believed that Jesus loved me. I began to question my faith and the more questions I asked, the more my faith fell apart. I felt sure God would answer all my questions eventually. But no answers came. I gradually realised that i was just talking to myself.

In my opinion, Christianity (and every other monotheistic religion I have encountered) fails from several standpoints - moral, scientific and logical. It seems to me that if someone is religious at all, it is overwhelmingly likely that they will have the same religion as their parents. It's a cultural phenomenon.

Congratulations on your escape from looney land!

: hamster :

 

[blackout]

My hunch is that what you had was a religious experience, and not a born again experience. In fact I would bet my life on it.

I had a born again experience.

It led me right out of mainstream christianity.

(of course you will think you know better)

 

[JacobEzra.]

I was a christian many years ago. I believed I was saved and I believed that Jesus loved me. I began to question my faith and the more questions I asked, the more my faith fell apart. I felt sure God would answer all my questions eventually. But no answers came. I gradually realised that i was just talking to myself.

In my opinion, Christianity (and every other monotheistic religion I have encountered) fails from several standpoints - moral, scientific and logical. It seems to me that if someone is religious at all, it is overwhelmingly likely that they will have the same religion as their parents. It's a cultural phenomenon.

My parents re agnostic. I had just about none religious education as a kid and teen besides sunday school once or twice. And I was an atheist for most of my life.

So claiming religion is a cultural phenomenon is not true. And to say Christianity fails at moral, Id like to hear how so.


Besides that; Welcome to RF =]

 

[Protester]

I was a christian many years ago. I believed I was saved and I believed that Jesus loved me. I began to question my faith and the more questions I asked, the more my faith fell apart. I felt sure God would answer all my questions eventually. But no answers came. I gradually realised that i was just talking to myself.

In my opinion, Christianity (and every other monotheistic religion I have encountered) fails from several standpoints - moral, [What is the Moral argument for the existence of God?] scientific and logical.[Does God exist? Is there evidence for the existence of God]It seems to me that if someone is religious at all, it is overwhelmingly likely that they will have the same religion as their parents. It's a cultural phenomenon.

Now I could go over the Perseverance of the Saints - is it biblical? (which we 4-point Calvinists will agree with the 5-pointers, but just let's put it more simply, "Once a Christian, always a Christian" This means a Christian never can be lost and if it is obvious a person who said he was a Christian rejects Christianity --we Calvinists-- would say that person never was a Christian. So how do you explain First Cause, i.e., What is the Cosmological argument for the existence of God?

While the above references are quite short, the following excerpt from the 19th Century Easton Dictionary is even shorter.

Easton Dictionary (part of definition about God)

...The existence of God is taken for granted in the Bible. There is nowhere any argument to prove it. He who disbelieves this truth is spoken of as one devoid of understanding (Ps. 14:1).
The arguments generally adduced by theologians in proof of the being of God are:
(1.) The a priori argument, which is the testimony afforded by reason.
(2.) The a posteriori argument, by which we proceed logically from the facts of experience to causes. These arguments are,
(a) The cosmological, by which it is proved that there must be a First Cause of all things, for every effect must have a cause.
(b) The teleological, or the argument from design. We see everywhere the operations of an intelligent Cause in nature.
(c) The moral argument, called also the anthropological argument, based on the moral consciousness and the history of mankind, which exhibits a moral order and purpose which can only be explained on the supposition of the existence of God. Conscience and human history testify that "verily there is a God that judgeth in the earth."

I would suppose the Arminians and Calvinists among Christians would agree with this statement by Christ, it really says it best==

Mark 4
2He taught them many things in parables, and told them in his teaching, 3"“Listen! Behold, the farmer went out to sow, 4and it happened, as he sowed, some seed fell by the road, and the birds came and devoured it. 5Others fell on the rocky ground, where it had little soil, and immediately it sprang up, because it had no depth of soil. 6When the sun had risen, it was scorched; and because it had no root, it withered away. 7Others fell among the thorns, and the thorns grew up, and choked it, and it yielded no fruit. 8Others fell into the good ground, and yielded fruit, growing up and increasing. Some brought forth thirty times, some sixty times, and some one hundred times as much.”" 9He said, "“Whoever has ears to hear, let him hear.”"

You probably know about Professor Antony Flew: philosopher This Englishman's obituary is food for thought.

 

[smidjit]

I had a born again experience.

It led me right out of mainstream christianity.

(of course you will think you know better)

I don't think you had a born again experience. I think you had a religious experience. I believe that you probably believed one must merit heaven in order to enter in and you stumbled at the stumbling stone as do many.

 

[smidjit]

Let me be the first to yell...."No true Scotsman!".

I like to think of believers as pre-atheists.
We're all friends & on the same side.
Some just have a different path.

Funny you think all believers are pre atheists, so what you are saying is, I am no true scotsman. Do you even realize you contradicted your own statement?

 

[Pegg]

A question: Why are you a Jehovah's Witness from choice?

I heard about some of their teachings which were very appealing to me... i was only coming into my teenage years at that time though, so I didnt do anything about it until my late teens. I found the witnesses again and started to study seriously with them. But it was completely my own choice...non of my family are JW's non of my friends were religious... i was living with a bf at the time and I chose to leave him because I felt I have found something better.

 

[Spectrox War]

True belief results in spiritual regeneration. Once that happens the bible is clear. You cannot be a true believer, and then unbelieve. It's impossible.

John 10:1 ¶ Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.
2 But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep.
3 To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out.
4 And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
5 And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers.

Funny that because I know I was saved. I was convinced Jesus loved me. I was convinced of the truth of The Bible. And yet with one sweeping statement you have tried to invalidate my experience. This is the worse kind of lie I can imagine. It's not just about me either. I know at least 2 other people who were very devout, for years, and now they are atheists. Are they phoney too? I think they would be insulted.

Do you see yourself as one of the sheep then? I guess some people don't mind being emotionally fleeced by religious nonsense. If only they would keep the poison to themselves.

 

[Spectrox War]

welcome man,

I asked questions too! turns out you werent reading the right books

lol oj good to have you around!

Thanks. You're right about the book comment. It really wasn't a Good Book by any stretch of the imagination. For months I was deluded into thinking it was though.

 

[Spectrox War]

I heard about some of their teachings which were very appealing to me... i was only coming into my teenage years at that time though, so I didnt do anything about it until my late teens. I found the witnesses again and started to study seriously with them. But it was completely my own choice...non of my family are JW's non of my friends were religious... i was living with a bf at the time and I chose to leave him because I felt I have found something better.

Don't you have any issues around denying someone a blood transfusion or bone marrow transplant? Are only 144,000 souls saved?

 

[Breathe]

Welcome to RF.

In my opinion, Christianity (and every other monotheistic religion I have encountered)

Which monotheistic religions have you encountered?

It seems to me that if someone is religious at all, it is overwhelmingly likely that they will have the same religion as their parents. It's a cultural phenomenon.

Same religion, often yes - same denomination, not always.


I, however, am not the same religion as my parents'. Many are not. As the ease of access of various scriptures are available, it is easy to learn more about religions, and decide which ones you prefer and are closest to.

 

[Pegg]

Don't you have any issues around denying someone a blood transfusion or bone marrow transplant? Are only 144,000 souls saved?

the blood transfusion is honestly not an issue for me personally. I've been in the situation 4 times where I have refused a blood transfusion for myself, so if someone makes a personal decision in accord with their conscience, no, i dont have a problem with it.

144,000 are not the number of people saved, its the number who have been chosen to rule as a king in heaven. The rest of mankind have the opportunity for salvation to live on earth forever... billions will be resurrected and given another chance... and many more will survive the end of this system.

 

[Spectrox War]

the blood transfusion is honestly not an issue for me personally. I've been in the situation 4 times where I have refused a blood transfusion for myself, so if someone makes a personal decision in accord with their conscience, no, i dont have a problem with it.

144,000 are not the number of people saved, its the number who have been chosen to rule as a king in heaven. The rest of mankind have the opportunity for salvation to live on earth forever... billions will be resurrected and given another chance... and many more will survive the end of this system.

So if your sick child was lying in a hospital bed and needed a transfusion or bone marrow operation, what would you do?

 

[Spectrox War]

Welcome to RF.



Which monotheistic religions have you encountered?



Same religion, often yes - same denomination, not always.


I, however, am not the same religion as my parents'. Many are not. As the ease of access of various scriptures are available, it is easy to learn more about religions, and decide which ones you prefer and are closest to.

Judaism, Xianity, Islam, Hinduism, Pastafarianism

In my experience, my comment about kids having the same religion as their parents by and large is true (if the kids turn out to be religious). There are of course exceptions to the rule.

 

[Spectrox War]

Congratulations on your escape from looney land!

: hamster :

Thanks, bud. Although it looks like I've plunged headlong into another loony one. Present company excepted of course.

 

[Pegg]

So if your sick child was lying in a hospital bed and needed a transfusion or bone marrow operation, what would you do?

I would find the best doctor I could and ask for the best medicine available. However, my situation is that my husband is not a JW, so he would obviously have a say in the treatment given to our kids and im pretty sure he would take a blood transfusion... so my kids might end up with one anyway


With regard to bone marrow transplants, the WT has not stated that they must be avoided like blood. That is left to individual conscience because marrow is not actually blood. An article about bone marrow states this:

1984 WT
The Bible states clearly that God’s servants must ‘abstain from blood.’ (Acts 15:28, 29; Deuteronomy 12:15, 16) But, since red cells originate in the red bone marrow, do the Scriptures class marrow with blood? No. In fact, animal marrow is spoken of like any other flesh that could be eaten. Isaiah 25:6 says that God will prepare for his people a banquet that includes “well-oiled dishes filled with marrow.” Normal slaughtering and drainage procedures never drain all blood cells from the marrow. Yet once a carcass is drained, then any of the tissue may be eaten, including the marrow.
Of course, marrow used in human marrow transplants is from live donors, and the withdrawn marrow may have some blood with it. Hence, the Christian would have to resolve for himself whether—to him—the bone-marrow graft would amount to simple flesh or would be unbled tissue. Additionally, since a marrow graft is a form of transplant, the Scriptural aspects of human organ transplants should be considered. See “Questions From Readers” in our issue of March 15, 1980. Finally, writing in Harrison’s Principles of Internal Medicine (Update I, 1981, page 138), Dr. D. E. Thomas observes that “virtually all marrow transplant recipients will require platelet transfusions” and many are given “packed red blood cells.” So the Christian should consider what additional issues he would have to face if he submitted to a marrow transplant.—Proverbs 22:3.
Though a personal decision has to be made on this matter, the Bible’s comments about blood and marrow should help the individual to decide.

 

[Spectrox War]

However, my situation is that my husband is not a JW, so he would obviously have a say in the treatment given to our kids and im pretty sure he would take a blood transfusion... so my kids might end up with one anyway

Are you serious? Your kid "might end up with one anyway"! I would submit to you that any chance of denying your child a blood transfusion he needs would be an act of evil. Full stop.

 

[Spectrox War]

Protester:

Read my reply to Smidjit's post for a response to your ridiculous assertion. The arguments for the existence of God I've heard before and they aren't particularly compelling. Not that I'm saying that atheists can prove that God doesn't exist either. All these arguments are a bit weak. I would approach it from the opposite direction. What evidence is there for God in the religions that exist? I have gone through each one to a greater or lesser degree and I can no longer find good evidence in any of them. In fact I would go further and say that all of them have things in them that are spectacularly wrong from a moral or logical standpoint. So where is God? He's being rather elusive if he wants to pass on a very important message to humanity. A message that demonstrates insight, vision, ethics and good sense.

In my opinion secular humanism has done more to reduce the misery of the human condition in 200 years than religion has managed in 2000.

 

[Pegg]

Are you serious? Your kid "might end up with one anyway"! I would submit to you that any chance of denying your child a blood transfusion he needs would be an act of evil. Full stop.

Well, unfortunately i dont consider blood to be the best medicine...and I would never forgive myself if the blood they received was tainted with some serious disease. So i will always opt for a better alternative for my kids.

If that is evil, then so be it.