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Can Jewish law be fulfilled?

Harmonious

Well-Known Member
I dont really understand why you do not translate Elohim as God in the verses i gave. This surely cannot be the same for all hebrew speakers because I did a short course in biblical hebrew and Elohim is most definitely rendered as God in my workbook. And actually its in there as a proper noun thus it identifies a unique entity...
I said that it is one of God's names.

You are only selectively reading what I wrote as an explanation of Hebrew grammar.

Interesting.

its certainly not a verb which is what the word 'power' is
Power is NOT a verb, but a noun.

It could be that you are having difficulty with grammar. :sorry1:

without doing any ringing around can i ask if perhaps 'power' is the root word of Elohim ???
Yup.

And since one of the ways we experience and understand God as the All-Powerful, or Almighty, that is why we refer to God this way.

Could that be why you feel it should be translated as Power and not God?
Yup. Because it is a name, a description, not a translation for "God".

in the context of scripture, what is the difference between 'sons' and 'children' in your opinion?
It depends on the context IN the scripture.

But you see... God never refers to angels as children. He calls various humans children all over the place. It describes a relationship.
 
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smokydot

Well-Known Member
Popcorn time!
Yes you did.
:rolleyes: Whatever.
The concordances I use don't translate ANYTHING. They just give me the location of things.
Right, so that's the first assumed fact not in evidence. . .because my concordance also does not give translations. . .so how could I get one from there?
But your translation is not your own. You said that it WAS your knowledge of Hebrew.
I wasn't picking a dog in your argument with angellous.
Not much. . .that's why you reversed your validation of my translation. . .which is what this whole phony argument is about.
But you lied to ME. I won't forget that. (I may eventually forgive it, but I won't forget.)
I told you that I gave you my own translation. You said you got your information "from the Hebrew," when it was clear that it wasn't from the Hebrew.
That's the second assumed fact not in evidence.

You said you got your translation from your knowledge of Hebrew. My translation likewise came from knowledge of Hebrew,
it did not come from a concordance, as has been repeatedly and falsely asserted, because my concordance does not give translations.

Angellous_evangellous' seems to feel that he has some kind of proprietary rights over translating Hebrew. . .and that his personal translations
are the only ones with standing.
My translation came from knowledge of Hebrew just as yours (and his) did. . .it doesn't have to be my personal knowledge of Hebrew in order
to come from knowledge of Hebrew.

And if knowledge of Hebrew is so-o-o important, then why does it matter whose knowledge of Hebrew it is? . .why isn't the correctness of the translation the issue? . .
unless one thinks they have some kind of proprietary right over translations of Hebrew. . .or, unless it's just a red herring, in lieu of factual refutation of my argument.

This ridiculous notion, that because I can't read Hebrew means that any translation I offer of it is automtically without merit because it does not
come from knowledge of Hebrew, is patently absurd on its face. . .

you know it, and I know it. . .drop the red herring and the self-righteousness. . .deal with the issue--the translation itself, and not its source. . .enough already!
And now you have the temerity to say that you didn't say what you did say.
I didn't have one until now.
Whether it was concordance, or some other book, it doesn't matter. You lied about where you got your information. You said you got it from the Hebrew. Whether you got it from a concordance, a translation, whatever...
I don't really care, and that isn't a matter of importance to me.
What I DO care about is that you said that "you got it from the Hebrew," when you did no such thing.

That was a lie.
That's the third assumed fact not in evidence.

Shall I accuse you of lying because that is not what I said? . .I said I got it from knowledge of Hebrew, just as you got yours. . .I did not say
it was my personal knowledge of Hebrew, but it is still knowledge of Hebrew, nevertheless.

That was not a lie. . .that was refutation of the red herring that, just because I couldn't read Hebrew, any translation I offered was automatically without merit, because it didn't come from knowledge of Hebrew. . .now how dumb is that?
You have earned a place as perona non grata for a while. Don't expect to see answers from me for a while.{/quote]Shall I make you a persona non grata because you are "lying" about what I really said? . .you get to decide for both of us.

And that has nothing to do with the fact that I validated your translation of Genesis
Validation of "my" translation of Genesis is just what this whole phony argument is about. . .you spoke the truth of the matter before you realized
that angellous_evangellous had hung himself out to dry on the issue. . .so you then reversed yourself
to cover his ridiculous, bizarre and unhinged false assertions here --->http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/2323578-post693.html.

You should pick your associates more carefully. . .he really is not a good influence on you, involving you in his falsehoods, over-inflated ego, prevarication and wrongly influencing you to take up his offenses (to be offended by what he is offended).
I have nothing more to say to you. You no longer amuse me.
Would that have anything to do with your duplicity in this matter, and not being able to defend it?

Methinks the pot is calling the kettle black. . .think about it. . .you're a reasonable person.
 
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angellous_evangellous

Guest
Well, Harmonious, it appears I was wrong.

Cut off my legs and call me shorty.
 
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angellous_evangellous

Guest
it did not come from a concordance, as has been repeatedly and falsely asserted, because concordances do not give translations...

Some have limited notes.

If you insist that you didn't get it from a concordance, I'd bet a buffalo nickel you got it from an interlinear. :D
 
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angellous_evangellous

Guest
You should pick your associates more carefully. . .he really is not a good influence on you, involving you in his falsehoods, over-inflated ego and prevarication.

Hey.... my ego is deliciously brilliant, the only flaws being like those of an almost perfectly clear diamond. When you discover its magnificence you will find a fabulously enthusiastic sense of humor and a cunning wit. If you gaze at its beauty you will see a devestating intellect and poetic gentlemanly charm.

[edit] To know it is to love it, and to love it is to realize that Angellous is your daddy.

There's nothing to inflate - it was never empty.
 
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Harmonious

Well-Known Member
The concordances I use don't translate ANYTHING. They just give me the location of things.
I should have said, "The concordances I USUALLY use..."

For the benefit of anyone who is playing along...

Once, when I used an online concordance for a different thread about a different matter, the concordance listed each time a Hebrew root was used, and it offered a translation and/or interpretation for each time the Hebrew word was used.

Once I knew where to look to find the word, I was able to discern for myself the translation - the one the concordance offered was not always correct.

This is how I know that some concordances do, indeed, offer translations.
 
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angellous_evangellous

Guest
Your ignorance is showing again. . .those words are straight out of the OT, and anyone who is familiar with it knows that. . .

Are you as big and important as the OT?

Are your words given the same weight as God and men?
 
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angellous_evangellous

Guest
Your ignorance is showing again. . .that's a pitiful card to try to play. . .those words are straight out of the OT, and anyone who is familiar with it knows that. . .

I'm just encouraging a little discretion before saying something like that.

What if - as per usual - you are misinterpreting the text? You've just insulted God in a pretty big way.
 
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angellous_evangellous

Guest
Are yours?

Have you read the whole OT, or the whole NT? . .you certainly haven' read the Prophets.

I'm not the one throwing around bible verses as if I were God.

Yes, I've read them several times. A good deal of it in Hebrew, and all of the Greek and then some (apocrypha and apostolic fathers). I've memorized a good portion of the NT Greek as well.
 

BigRed

Member
you'll find your fulfillment to this prophecy in Nehemiah chapters 2

When the jews were released from their captivity in Babylon, Nehemiah led them back to their homeland from the places where they had been dispersed, jerusalem was rebuilt and the people returned to their homeland.

However, a far greater fulfillment has occurred in our days.

No way! No way has anything happened that can be considered a fulfillment of Genesis 30.
The ten lost tribes are still lost. They have never come back to Israel.

BigRed
 

BigRed

Member
Mankind cannot fulfill Jewish Law. Jesus came to earth to fulfill the Law, not destroy it (Matt 5:17). Jesus was able to fulfill the Law only because He was fully God as well as fully man (Colossians 1:15-17, 2:9, John 1:1, John 8:58, 10:30, John 1:14, Hebrews 4:15, Philippians 2:5-11).
A righteous man without sin was the only way to fulfill the Law. However, because mankind is born with a sinful nature, it would take God becoming flesh to fulfill the Law. Jesus did that.

I think that you are coming in to this discussion without reading all that has been written so far.
For example....Abraham was promised the promised land. He never received it. So the Law was not fulfilled.
For example..All Israel was promised that they would be gathered back in Israel. Never fulfilled.

Jesus was also a sinner. He committed a crime by beating people out of the Temple, turning over the tables, and pouring the money on the ground.

BigRed
 
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