Why does GOD want us to Observe the Sabbath?

[Wandered Off]

I appreciate your providing us with materials to examine and study according to scripture to help us learn to identify the difference between what GOD says and what man says GOD says.

All scripture is what man says god says. That's the whole idea behind second-hand revelation (some guy said god told him to tell you...). Since scripture itself is "what man says god says," it's definitely the wrong tool to identify any suspected 'difference.'

 

[Amazed]

Ecc 8:5 He who guards the command knows no evil matter. And the heart of the wise discerns both time and right-ruling,

Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the entire matter: Fear Elohim and guard His commands, for this applies to all mankind!

 

[EtuMalku]

(Deuteronomy 20:10-14)
As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.

What kind of God approves of murder, rape, and slavery?

 

[Lucius7]

LUCIUS7 posted the following statement in #50
I have an even more comprehensive archive of dated and compiled post-Adamic human history to show world sabbatical history and secular history dating back well before the Exodus from Egypt and the formation of the written Hebrew calendar. Before words and scribes mankind kept flawless records of time and dates through astrology, and observance of the seasons and primarily, through counting Sabbaths in 7 day increments for thousands of years. Due to time, I just can’t enter into that topic right now
I don’t want you to feel like I’m neglecting to address all of your questions.

I will reply in red
Everyone who has studied any history knows that about 5000 years ago writing was first used to mark down information so it could be recorded. You have told us that 5985 years ago was Adamic creation and you have evidence that there has been recorded information that proves that there has been 855 X 7 Jublie Sabbaths from that date of 5985 creation down to today.

My question to you is if writing didn't start till only 5000 years ago what and where is your documentation for the 985 years before writing was developed????????
If you don't have documentation for over 900 years of the 855 Jublie Sabbaths then your date of 5985 years for creation is BOGUS. ALL that you have written on this subject in these posts are BOGUS.

PS- I did forget to answer your first question, “When did GOD create those pre-Adamic species?” The answer is found in Genesis 1:19-20. It was the fourth day of the original creation (4,000 years from the beginning of the first creation) over a period of 1,000 years.
You have admitted in figures that pre-Adamic species have been around for up to 4 Million years but now you say that information all happened in just 1000 years [the fouth day of creation] 4 Million years is not 1000 years in my mathmatcs.

When did all these animals and pre-Adamic people die off - during the Genesis Deluge and when did the Genesis deluge happen in your time frame????????

In previous posts you will see where I have stated that time was carefully kept through Sabbath observances dating back to the garden of Eden where the first observances would have occured with GOD and Adam congregating together. Because the first Sabbath observance of man was the first Sabbath after the creation of Adam. Prior to our modern advantages of time telling, precise time measurement included geneology, which is the main source by which measure time in the book of Genesis and throughout the scriptures. The exact number of years, which every generation of man after Adam lived,is kept so that we can easily find any number of secular and scriptural historic intersections at which we can begin counting backward in time into the lives of biblical geneologies from well founded and accepted points in secular history.

The answer to your second question is is my other response. THe answer is we cannot possible identify the exact time when any of the events within the first creation took place. The time period between the first and second creations are millions of years with no identifying markers. All we know is that the events within the first creation had to completely finish unfolding prior to the second 6,000 year creation which ended with the creation of man.

 

[Lucius7]

(Deuteronomy 20:10-14)
As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.

What kind of God approves of murder, rape, and slavery?

GOD was delivering Israel into the lands of the wicked followers of Ba'al and those who had chosen to reject the blessings and benefits of the law for the curses and consequences of disobedience and rebellion. This included slavery and having their mighty and proud cities overtaken by foreign invaders. If you read the rest of the bible you see that GOD ultimately ends of doing the same thing right back to Israel when they also reject HIM and turn back to Ba'al. GOD uses the Babylonians to invade and pillage and carry Israel away as slaves from the land HE had given them.
As of murder, it was not murder but fulfillment of GODs judgement of the wicked men before them. It in no way related to any percieved righteousness or right to judge on the behalf of Israel which just happened to be the tool which GOD used to fulfill HIS word.

As for rape, your use of the word rape is inconsistent with the Hebrew meaning. Hebrew men were expressly forbidden by GOD not to take conquered women as wives. Though later generatioins would abuse women, it was not according to GODs instruction or desire. It was man acting in his own authority.

 

[Lucius7]

All scripture is what man says god says. That's the whole idea behind second-hand revelation (some guy said god told him to tell you...). Since scripture itself is "what man says god says," it's definitely the wrong tool to identify any suspected 'difference.'

GOD says that ALL scripture is divinely inspired and is profitable for reproof and instruction in righteousness. To say otherwise is to contradict GOD and places your statement outside of truth or relevance. If you choose to turn to sources outside of GOD then you keep using mans tools and to identify mans gods, don't try to use them to figure GODs truth.

 

[EtuMalku]

What a crock of BS
Sex Slaves (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)
When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)


God Assists Rape and Plunder (Zechariah 14:1-2 NAB)

Lo, a day shall come for the Lord when the spoils shall be divided in your midst. And I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem for battle: the city shall be taken, houses plundered, women ravished; half of the city shall go into exile, but the rest of the people shall not be removed from the city. (Zechariah 14:1-2 NAB)


David's Punishment - Polygamy, Rape, Baby Killing, and God's "Forgiveness" (2 Samuel 12:11-14 NAB)

Thus says the Lord: 'I will bring evil upon you out of your own house. I will take your wives [plural] while you live to see it, and will give them to your neighbor. He shall lie with your wives in broad daylight. You have done this deed in secret, but I will bring it about in the presence of all Israel, and with the sun looking down.'
Then David said to Nathan, "I have sinned against the Lord." Nathan answered David: "The Lord on his part has forgiven your sin: you shall not die. But since you have utterly spurned the Lord by this deed, the child born to you must surely die." [The child dies seven days later.]

This has got to be one of the sickest quotes of the Bible. God himself brings the completely innocent rape victims to the rapist. What kind of pathetic loser would do something so evil? And then he kills a child! This is sick, really sick!

 

[Lucius7]

Lucius –



My summary:

The OLD covenant was made with Israel - Exodus 16:29, 31:16,31.

The “sabbath” was a part of the OLD covenant made with/ given to ISRAEL - - - Exodus 16:29, 31:16,31.)

The “sabbath” was given at “Sinai” - Exodus 16, Exodus 20:8 and NEVER observed until this time.

The “sabbath” was a SIGN between God and Israel. See Exodus - 20:12,20, 31:16,31, Deut. 5:15.

Why? Because Israel had no rest in Egypt and God delivered them out of the land - Deut. 5:15.)

Only Israel was held accountable to observe the sabbath !

Why change the very PURPOSE for which the “sabbath” was given ???

Here’s your 3rd opportunity Lucius to point-for-point show if I have taken any scripture out of context, and how it is I – not you – that has acted irresponsibly.

I'll despense with a response to your contempt and provide the corrections to your blasphemy for the sake of those being exposed to this.

The OLD covenant was made with Israel - Exodus 16:29, 31:16,31.
GEN 6:18 But with thee will I establish my covenant; and thou shalt come into the ark, thou, and thy sons, and thy wife, and thy sons' wives with thee. (Noah was not an Israelite and he well predated the Hebrews and their fathers. This is more evidence that GODs covenant encompasses far more than most religions profess.)

GEN 7:2 Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that [are] not clean by two, the male and his female. (clean and unclean animals are defined by GODs Law. The first time they occur to Israel is hundreds of years after this account. GOD had already defined for Noah what the difference between clean and unclean beasts)
GEN 9:3-7 Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things. But flesh with the life thereof, [which is] the blood thereof, shall ye not eat. And surely your blood of your lives will I require; at the hand of every beast will I require it, and at the hand of man; at the hand of every man's brother will I require the life of man. Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man. And you, be ye fruitful, and multiply; bring forth abundantly in the earth, and multiply therein. (Here GOD gives a recorded irrefutable scriptural account of verbally preserving and teaching HIS Law prior to the written record in Exodus, for the benefit to and for those who regard HIM and keep HIS Law.)
GEN 17:3 And Abram fell on his face: and God talked with him, saying, As for me, behold, my covenant [is] with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations. Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee. I will make thee exceeding fruitful, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee. And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee. And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God. And God said unto Abraham, Thou shalt keep my covenant therefore, thou, and thy seed after thee in their generations. This [is] my covenant, which ye shall keep, between me and you and thy seed after thee; Every man child among you shall becircumcised. (GOD told Abram “Thou” shall keep My commandments, and thy seed”. In order to keep the commandments Abram would have to know the commandments. In order for his sons to keep the commandments, Abram had to pass it down. The Law (which includes the Sabbath as a pre-type) was established and given to man prior to Egypt even becoming a major empire, verified by scripture on multiple accounts.)

The “sabbath” was a part of the OLD covenant made with/ given to ISRAEL - - - Exodus 16:29, 31:16,31.)
Your references are once again correct for validating your stand-alone statements. They are 2 of 137 additional references in 66 verses. The Sabbath was indeed a foundational part of the Original Covenant, and was a pre-type given to the pre-type of Israel, the physical (not spiritual) descendants of Abraham who were bondsmen in Egypt. The Law in it’s entirely was recorded in writing for the first time in history at Sinai to be preserved that way until the last days. Prior to this, as scripture verifies, the law had been passed down by a select few lines of Seth with whom GOD either gave the law or who preserved it verbally.

The “sabbath” was given at “Sinai” - Exodus 16, Exodus 20:8 and NEVER observed until this time.
EXO 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Both of your references verify that the law, including the Sabbath, was passed down through Moses. These are included in the 137 verses cited above. However, neither the entire chapter of Exodus 16 or Exodus 29:8 (seen above) in any way imply that the law or the Sabbath were of no effect at any previous time. This is a clear example of adding to scriptures to promote a false doctrine using scriptures. REV 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and [from] the things which are written in this book.

CONTINUE ON NEXT POST

 

[Lucius7]

CONTINUED FROM ABOVE

The “sabbath” was a SIGN between God and Israel. See Exodus - 20:12,20, 31:16,31, Deut. 5:15.
EXO 31:16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, [for] a perpetual covenant.
LEV 24:8 Every sabbath he shall set it in order before the LORD continually,[being taken] from the children of Israel by an everlasting covenant.
ISA 56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
The Sabbath is not only covenant with GODs children, but it is perpetually binding until this heaven and earth pass away. (MAT 5:18) It did not terminate with Israel (prophets observed it), it did not terminate with Christ (Christ observed it), it did not terminate with Christs death (the women, the disciples, and the Apostles continued to observe it as well as the entire congregations of the early Church), and it did not terminate with the book of Revelation (the letters to the Churches of the end days include instructions to keep GODs commandments and to observe the Sabbath, and the book of Revelation and the Bible end with the command exactly 7 verses from the final word. “Keep the commandments.”

Why? Because Israel had no rest in Egypt and God delivered them out of the land - Deut. 5:15.)
Again, that was just a pre-type of a pre-type. GOD ordained the Sabbath on the 7th day of creation (long before Israel), established it with HIS people verbally prior to Israel, who used it as weekly rest. Its significance is a seven “day” Plan and purpose for humanity ending in divine inheritance. You will find nowhere in contextual scripture where termination of Sabbath observance is approved by GOD or HIS true Administration. Attempts to do so MUST be achieved either through ignorance of the Law and its applications in the scriptures, or through miscontextual misrepresentations of mistranslated material filtered through flawed perspectives- resulting in untruths perceived as truths (i.e. the earth is flat. An untruth accepted as fact, supported by limited understanding of Law and science, and corrected when a broader understanding was achieved through adjusted perspectives).

Only Israel was held accountable to observe the sabbath !
Proven incorrect by my references and stated above. Israel was held accountable to observe the Sabbath. PERIOD. Not the first, not the last.

Why change the very PURPOSE for which the “sabbath” was given ???
That’s a good question! You perceived the purpose for the Sabbath incorrectly, as I have verified by scriptures. GOD would have had to change the entire purpose of the Sabbath to limit its observance to Israel. To do so would have terminated eligibility of salvation to anyone outside of the physical ancestry of Abraham, and invalidated the teachings and purpose of Christ as HE IS. So, again, your continue to speak outside of the understanding gained from reading and understanding the Law and its applications as they relate both to scriptures and to life. A position from which every man, whether a king or a prophet, has come. GOD say the “whole world is deceived.”

My question for you, if you continue to believe that your little scriptural cup holds water, is
“Why did Jesus observe and teach on the Sabbath, and why did His Apostles and Church continue to teach and observe the Sabbath until the end of the scriptural record?”

 

[Lucius7]

Sex Slaves (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)
When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)

This is an application of the Law specifically for the nation of Israel. It deals with Israelites and expresly forbids contact with foreigners. To own slaves in Israel meant to adhere to GODs applications regarding treatment of slaves which was a very humane and loving environment prior to Israels violations. If an Israelite makes an arrangement for marraige, then this law establishes that all rights and privelidges and inheritences be restored to her. It also provides for her legal protections in the event that the man takes another woman, providing that she can't simply be disinherited. It even provisions that she may terminate the arrangement and leave a free woman. It is very clearly an ancient law for womens rights in Israel.
God Assists Rape and Plunder (Zechariah 14:1-2 NAB)

Lo, a day shall come for the Lord when the spoils shall be divided in your midst. And I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem for battle: the city shall be taken, houses plundered, women ravished; half of the city shall go into exile, but the rest of the people shall not be removed from the city. (Zechariah 14:1-2 NAB)

GOD is prophesying through Zecharaiah regarding the ravenous pagan kingdoms which had been divinely restrained under provisions of the Law. Violations within the contract of the Law include that physical protection will be withdrawn if certain Laws are violated repeatedly. The nations which invaded had no regard for the law and would rape and burn the people and use them in ritualistic sacrifices. It was a national punishment for national disobedience, and resulted in GOD hand being removed so that Satan could excersise free will against them.

David's Punishment - Polygamy, Rape, Baby Killing, and God's "Forgiveness" (2 Samuel 12:11-14 NAB)

Thus says the Lord: 'I will bring evil upon you out of your own house. I will take your wives [plural] while you live to see it, and will give them to your neighbor. He shall lie with your wives in broad daylight. You have done this deed in secret, but I will bring it about in the presence of all Israel, and with the sun looking down.'
Then David said to Nathan, "I have sinned against the Lord." Nathan answered David: "The Lord on his part has forgiven your sin: you shall not die. But since you have utterly spurned the Lord by this deed, the child born to you must surely die." [The child dies seven days later.]

Again. A very real and sobering account of an extreme violation by a man who had recieved so much responsibility from GOD. David understood the consequences before he committed the violation. David was very close to the Law and knew it very well. What he did was a slap in GODs face. Imagine how you would feel to have someone you loved so much to suddenly turn against you?

This has got to be one of the sickest quotes of the Bible. God himself brings the completely innocent rape victims to the rapist. What kind of pathetic loser would do something so evil? And then he kills a child! This is sick, really sick!

Again. A very real and sobering account of an extreme violation by a man who had recieved so much responsibility from GOD. David understood the consequences before he committed the violation. David was very close to the Law and knew it very well. What he did was a slap in GODs face. Imagine how you would feel to have someone you loved so much to suddenly turn against you?

 

[Lucius7]

When did all these animals and pre-Adamic people die off - during the Genesis Deluge and when did the Genesis deluge happen in your time frame????????

As stated in my first response, the life-forms under the first creation timeline died-off as a result of the extreme geological results of the Luciferian rebellion. THe damaged triggered what secular pseudo-science records using the carbon data and climate patterns. The death of all pre-Adamic life occured in the void state of decomposition described in Genisis 2 (with the exception of Satan and his demons and potentially a few forms of scavanger life, though highly improbable)

THe flood began at the beginning of Sabbath TISRI 8 (AM 1655, BC 2325) and ended on Heshvan 27; 365 days (1 solar year later) (AM 1656, BC 2324)

 

[Arlanbb]

THe flood began at the beginning of Sabbath TISRI 8 (AM 1655, BC 2325) and ended on Heshvan 27; 365 days (1 solar year later) (AM 1656, BC 2324)[/quote]
The bible says that there were different people on earth after the Deluge than before the Deluge. All human and animal life was destroyed by the deluge except Noah and family and animals in the ark. You say the Genesis Deluge started in 2325 BC. and ended a year later. Lets see what history say about that time period.

The Mesopotamian King list runs from 2800 - 1500 BC without a break in it.
The Egyptian Kings list runs from 3000 - 2625 BC [Early Dynastic Period] through the Old Kingdom [2625=2130] clear down to 30 BC [Hellenistic Period].

According to the book ANCIENT EGYPT Meryre Pepy I was King from about 2338 down to 2298 and your biblical deluge 2325 BC happened right in the middle of him being King of Egypt.

PLEASE EXPLAIN HOW the Mesopotaian and EGYPTION KINGs LIVED THROUGHT THE BIBLICAL DELUGE????

 

[Wandered Off]

GOD says that ALL scripture is divinely inspired and is profitable for reproof and instruction in righteousness.

Conveniently, scripture says scripture is divinely inspired. "It is because it says it is" creates a large, round-shaped logic problem.

The Qu'ran says its divinely inspired, but I don't see you quoting from that. Are you contradicting GOD? I suspect you don't think so, because you don't place your faith in the human who wrote it. Well, there is no more reason to put faith in the humans who wrote the scripture you quoted than in the human who wrote the Qu'ran.

To say otherwise is to contradict GOD and places your statement outside of truth or relevance.

To say otherwise is to contradict the tribesmen who wrote that part of the Bible. There's no way around that.

 

[Arlanbb]

From post # 11 By LUCIUS7

"GOD does not give us a method of measuring how long the earth existed during the Luciferian inhabitation, ....

"Lucifer and his angels also inhabited the earth prior to man and archeological evidence could point to that, but not Jericho or Egypt

I don't know what bible you read but from what I understand LUCIFER and his ANGELS are NOT HUMAN BEINGS which build houses etc. ANGELS do not build house etc. because they have no substance like humans. So to imply that archaeologist would find building formed by ANGELS is rediculess and unfounded assumption.

You still have not explained how humans inhabited buildings in old Jericho over 10,000 years ago. Thousands of years before God made your Adam??????

 

[Arlanbb]

I wrote to Lucius7

-I have another book used in archaeology called: ARCHAEOLOGY OF THE LAND OF THE BIBLE - 10,000-586 BCE". This book tells of all the people that had lived and died in Palestine in the last 12,000 years. These are real humans like you and I with the same type of DNA as you have. On page 39 is a map of all the major dig sites in Israel of cities that are up to 10,000 years old. There are 22 cities. One of them is Jericho [oldest] and another is Shaar Hogolan where I spent two summers digging. People live and built houses in Shaar Hogolan from aout 6400 to 5800 BC long before your so called creation of Adam.

LUCIUS 7 wrote "Pre-Adamic humans built tools, musical instruments, shelters and huts, and did live in Palestine and Israel. These were the descendants and ancestors of the humanoid species’ listed above. You are arguing under the assumptions that only humans use tools, play music and build cities, despite the fact that the modern animal kingdom can supply innumerous examples of animals that can do all of the above by design. Why would you expect that creatures with all of our same physical characteristics would have lived and built in a way that is not similar to our own species? How else would they have thrived and survived and satisfied their needs? Though there intellectual capacity for advanced reasoning were not as developed to the extent that ours is, they would certainly have been considered among the most intelligent and logical species in the pre-Adamic world. I assure you without any shadow of a doubt, using GODs record and in many respects, mans record too, that the anatomically modern human-type beings which lived in Palestine were NOT post-Adamic humans. There is no confirmed scientific or otherwise proof which can clearly and truthfully identify those remains with our modern human species. Any attempt to make assumptions based on theories are not fully justified.

You are competely wrong about the people found living in Palestine up to 12,000 years ago. All historicans know that the NEANDERTHALS, were the last prehumans to live along with Modern human, and all evidence has shown that they lived in Europe, and western and central Asia from about 130,000 to 30,000 years ago. That being so the NEANDERTHALS had died out over 18,000 years before the people that lived in Palestine only 12,000 years ago.

ALSO DNA is different between Moden Human and Neanderthals.

LUCIUS 7 stated "Before words and scribes mankind kept flawless records of time and dates through astrology, and observance of the seasons and primarily, through counting Sabbaths in 7 day increments for thousands of years. .....
I ask you to produce these so called "FLAWLESS RECORDS" for counting the"SABBATHS in 7 days" way before there was writing?????

LUCIUS 7 stated "I have read your second post and can answer all of your challenges in detail with even more historical data but for the sake of time I am going to refrain from responding to your second post at this time. ..... I don’t want you to feel like I’m neglecting to address all of your questions.
When are you going to answer ALL my questions in my second post?????
Without a real Genesis deluge all the stories written before that time period in the bible have no proof that they happened and tf they didn't happened then your Sabbath argument has no foundation to it at all. Facts are facts.