who are the Christians?

[Corban]

What are chistians? what does it take to be qualified as such. How can we group so many people with so many beliefs into one category. Are methodist christian? are lutherans? baptists? they all believe in Christ, but they believe different things about Him, can they then be said to believe in the same being? There is one Jesus Christ who is eternal and unchanging so if two people believe different things about Him either one or both are false, and if one has a false belief about Christ is he truly a Christian?

 

[dan]

I figure anyone who believes Christ is the Redeemer and Savior qualifies as a Christian. Whether or not he/she is saved or approved of in God's eyes in another story, and we can't really judge that by categories; it's something that is in the heart of each individual.

 

[Ronald]

What are chistians? what does it take to be qualified as such. How can we group so many people with so many beliefs into one category. Are methodist christian? are lutherans? baptists? they all believe in Christ, but they believe different things about Him, can they then be said to believe in the same being? There is one Jesus Christ who is eternal and unchanging so if two people believe different things about Him either one or both are false, and if one has a false belief about Christ is he truly a Christian?

May I ask you, How do you say, "There is one Jesus Christ who is eternal and unchanging--" ***?

From what Bible, did you glean this wealth of gold?

Your 1st question, Christians believe, Jesus Christ is God, one part of the Trinity. Father, Son and Holy Ghost. From this point on is where the Denominations begin to separate.

How about a group who believes in the OT God, who is ONE/Echad and He alone is Eternal, who sent Yeshua/salvation into the world. That the whole world might be C/Korban? [ ]

 

[civilcynic]

I figure anyone who believes Christ is the Redeemer and Savior qualifies as a Christian. Whether or not he/she is saved or approved of in God's eyes in another story, and we can't really judge that by categories; it's something that is in the heart of each individual.

I agree with your definition of a Christian in your first sentence but it does lead me to wonder: Christian Denominations may agree on the basics (IE Christ as the Son of God) but there are alot of significant differences. Protestant and Catholic denominations use a different Bible; Catholics believe the PoP is God's representative and infallible, Protestants don't. Catholics believe newborns should be baptized to rid them of Original Sin, Protestants usually don't Baptize newborns (don't beliee in Original Sin) but rather waits til a person can consciously accept or reject Baptism.

How can any of these denominations be so adamant that their particular brand of religion is right and all other denominations should accede to their beliefs? I often see posts in which an individual claims he/she is right because of their knowledge of their denominations beliefs rejecting all other opinions as wrong in the absolute. So which one of the many Christian denominations is absolutely right and exactly what parts have the other denominations gotten wrong....Proof which can be supported by facts would be appreciated. Any takers?

 

[jeremy.swenson]

i think of a christian as one who believes their purpose in life to be to live in a way that is pleasing to Father/Son/Holy Ghost and to obtain afterlife in 'heaven' as a result of Jesus's act

 

[dan]

The Bible does not paint a comprehensive enough picture for us to pass an accurate judgment on true Christianity. Whatever other criteria are used are subjective. I think the only arguments that will work will be those that make the most sense; but those are few and far between - error can be pointed out in almost any argument. I believe my church to be the one and only completely and totally true church on the earth, but everybody and their dog says the same thing.

 

[iwilliam]

Why do you all call yourselves christians when Jesus never ordered his followers to be called so.

 

[dan]

We are to carry His name with us. We are to represent Him. What other way is this accomplished?

 

[civilcynic]

The Bible does not paint a comprehensive enough picture for us to pass an accurate judgment on true Christianity. Whatever other criteria are used are subjective. I think the only arguments that will work will be those that make the most sense; but those are few and far between - error can be pointed out in almost any argument. I believe my church to be the one and only completely and totally true church on the earth, but everybody and their dog says the same thing.

I agree wholeheartedly!

 

[Corban]

i think of a christian as one who believes their purpose in life to be to live in a way that is pleasing to Father/Son/Holy Ghost and to obtain afterlife in 'heaven' as a result of Jesus's act

alright, but what if they believe falsely. What if i call the lamp in my room Jesus and worship it and live in a way that is pleasing to my lamp while calling it Jesus, am i a Christian? That example is extreme, but applies to the many different denominations of Christians. They all believe that different things about God, and believe different things are pleasing to Him, so are all Christians, as long as they call their God Christ?

 

[Corban]

May I ask you, How do you say, "There is one Jesus Christ who is eternal and unchanging--" ***?

From what Bible, did you glean this wealth of gold?

Your 1st question, Christians believe, Jesus Christ is God, one part of the Trinity. Father, Son and Holy Ghost. From this point on is where the Denominations begin to separate.

How about a group who believes in the OT God, who is ONE/Echad and He alone is Eternal, who sent Yeshua/salvation into the world. That the whole world might be C/Korban? [ ]

That's a fascinating thought, thank you for ignoring my question. If you wish to debate who God is post a thread for that. My questions is posed to those who call themselves Christians. The idea of my post is to explore how all these denominations that supposedly fall under the distinction of Christian, can be grouped together by a belief in Christ, when they all believe in a different being. My support is the Christian belief, (now i am not questioning wether it is a true belief but merely using it as a foundation to explore a particular belief, so don't get all defensive here) that Christ is eternal and unchanging, therefore if there are two different views about Him, they both can't be correct, one or both must be false, and withought even questioning which or if any are correct, let's merely look at the fact that they are different, the only thing that unifies these "Christians" is that they call whatever being they worship Christ. So my question are they all Christians? if i worship my lamp and call it Christ am i a Christian?

 

[Ronald]

That's a fascinating thought, thank you for ignoring my question. If you wish to debate who God is post a thread for that. My questions is posed to those who call themselves Christians. The idea of my post is to explore how all these denominations that supposedly fall under the distinction of Christian, can be grouped together by a belief in Christ, when they all believe in a different being. My support is the Christian belief, (now i am not questioning wether it is a true belief but merely using it as a foundation to explore a particular belief, so don't get all defensive here) that Christ is eternal and unchanging, therefore if there are two different views about Him, they both can't be correct, one or both must be false, and withought even questioning which or if any are correct, let's merely look at the fact that they are different, the only thing that unifies these "Christians" is that they call whatever being they worship Christ. So my question are they all Christians? if i worship my lamp and call it Christ am i a Christian?

Third Paragraph.
Christians believe Jesus is God, 1/3 of the trinity, Father - Son - Holy Ghost.
You cannot be concidered a Christian if you do not accept the triune God.
This they agree on, some do Saturday, most do Sunday. Some do _ _ ster, some Passover. 3500 different denominations and growing.
#1 I believe God is spirit! #2 Oh! I don't! I going to start a new denomination!

So, I did answer your question, then and now.

So Corban, Christian Corban, answer my question. Where did you find Eternal unchanging Jesus?

 

[harold e. rice]

A Christian is one that follows the teachings of Christ as recorded in the Gospels by questionable writers for we know that Mark and Luke weren't eyewitnesses to any of the text recorded in the books named after them.

Jesus was not a Christian but a devout Jew. It was Paul that wrote most of the ideology that the Christian Community follows thereby making him the father of Christianity. It wasn't Jesus' intentions to start a new religious movement and he didn't.

 

[dan]

Then how come He changed all the doctrine? WHy did He make all things new? Why did He call upon Paul to champion Christianity all over the world? Mark, by the way, was present.

Ron,
WHat's this triune God stuff? That's what the Catholics think. No one can be wrong if everyone is right; but I prefer not to subscribe to the PC relativist attitude of "your OK, he's OK, I'm OK, everyone's OK and nobody's wrong! Let's go smoke some weed and have some gay sex!" God intended it to be one way. Which way is that?

 

[Named]

Was the 'gay sex' comment really necessary?
You're not one of those hateful people?
<sighs>
I guess it can't be helped.

God intended it to be one way. Which way is that?

Are you sure about that?

 

[Corban]

A Christian is one that follows the teachings of Christ as recorded in the Gospels by questionable writers for we know that Mark and Luke weren't eyewitnesses to any of the text recorded in the books named after them.

Jesus was not a Christian but a devout Jew. It was Paul that wrote most of the ideology that the Christian Community follows thereby making him the father of Christianity. It wasn't Jesus' intentions to start a new religious movement and he didn't.

"A Christian is one that follows the teachings of Christ" this statement is exactly my point, and gets at the heart of my question. I agree with your statement, but i then ask again, Who then is a Christian? Are lutherans, are Catholics, are baptists? they all proclaim to follow the teachings of Christ, they all believe in the Bible, yet they do different things. Christ did teach in the Bible, Christ does not change, and the Bible says no prophecy of scripture is of any private interpretation. So if people have different beliefs about what Christ meant and do different things to follow Him, then they can't all be right, and they therefore are not all followers of Christ, if they don't do what Christ taught, so then who are the Christians? It can't be Lutherans and Catholics, and Baptists, and Mormons, and methodists, they can't all be Christians if they follow a different Christ, and if they believe in different teachings as they all do, they are obviously not following Christ because Christ does not change.

So you underlined what a Christian is, but the questions has yet to be answered, who is a Christian?

 

[Corban]

Jesus was not a Christian but a devout Jew. It was Paul that wrote most of the ideology that the Christian Community follows thereby making him the father of Christianity. It wasn't Jesus' intentions to start a new religious movement and he didn't.

"Jesus was not a Christian, but a devout Jew"

Good point and again you got at the heart of what i'm am trying to explore. Jesus was a Jew, He was also a Christian, if we apply your definition of what a Christian is, then certainly Jesus followed His own teachings, and by your definition would be a Christian. But the point is there is a big difference between Jews and the Christians, but there is no difference between true Judaism and true Christianity. There is in my mind only one religion and always has been, one true religion that is, it has existed since the beginning of man though men have called it different names. The only true religion is that which follows the only true God. You say Judaism had been around for ca. 4000 years, but what was Judaism and from whence did it spring. The God of the Jews is the God of Abraham, Isac and Jacob, yet it is the same God that spoke to Adam, Enoch and Noah long before "Judaism" came into being, He is the same God, then now and forever, He does not change. The way He deals with His children has changed, He gave certain laws to Moses and we call this Judaism, He gave certain laws to the Apostles and we call this Christianity, what then is true religion? the answer is simple, it is not following the tradtions of the past, but following the teachings of God that He gives to us. It is not bound by Judaism or christianity, yet it encompasses both. True religion is based on revelation from God, revelation that does not cease but continues, true religion then is following the living God, and it has always been that. our mistake is only listening to His past words and rejecting current revelation. God's words for Noah to build an ark did not free the people of Isreal from Egypt, God's words to Moses in the wilderness did not guide Peter when establishing the church. The only sure foundation and therefor the only true religion is one that follows continuing revelation from God. God has always led His church by Prophets men called of God by revelation to speak in the current time.
As to your second question, you say it is impossible for us to know which church is true. I disagree. It is given of God for us to know by revelation. God's speaks to His prophets who in turn speak to the people, we can hear His words and then after own study ask Him directly if they are true, I believe in Christ not because i have studied and proved Him to be the son of God, but because God revealed that truth to me directly. Revelation is alive and well today. On our own I agree it is impossible to know, yet i belived God can manifest such things to us, indeed this is the purpose of our lives, it is our responsibility to find out. and it is by that we will be judged, on our pursuit of the truth and our acceptance of it. We can know things are true by the power of the Holy Ghost and then we will be judged by how we respond to that witness.

 

[Ronald]

Corban,
He can't be Christian!
His name is Yahoshua/Yeshua/salvation/Gods salvation among others.
His title is Mashiach/Messiah/Annointed/Prince/High Preist among others.
The adversary thought it good to change "Times and the Torah".
Thus we have Jesus Christ/God/Holy Ghost.
If Christianity began in Antioch, then it is a Greek Religion.
My religion, my savior is Hebrew.
My God is the God of the Hebrew.
Paul was a Hebrew Rabbi, sent by Yeshua to the Nations/Gentiles.
The religion he taught was Hebrew.
The adversary twisted his (Pauls) teachings into a New Religion.

 

[dan]

Was the 'gay sex' comment really necessary?
You're not one of those hateful people?
<sighs>
I guess it can't be helped.


Are you sure about that?

<Sigh> I guess if someone uses homosexuality to be sarcastic then they're a hateful bigot. It's a good thing we can lob such a gross generalization around straight people. If they ever got as upset about being stereotyped as we do then things might get out of hand. Good use of the italized "those." Very categorizing and judgmental. -just playin'-

The comment wasn't adhering strictly to the topic of the thread, and I apologize, but I just thought it would be sardonic to link gay people with the ludicrously PC, since the two philosophies compliment each other so well. I'm not, for the record, at all prejudiced against anyone, I just use different kinds of topical humor. Some people get it and some don't, but I never mean to offend. I apologize if that's the way I came off. I can get pretty sarcastic sometimes.

 

[dan]

Oh, and I'm positive about there being one correct way that God intended. Sorry, I forgot to include that.