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When did God tell the Israelites that He was three persons?

Brian2

Brian2

Veteran Member
rosends said:
That site admits that early translations into Greek stuck with "I will be" in order to stay more true to the Hebrew. The site is dedicated to understanding an interpretation, not a translation. The Hebrew word is a pretty simple one -- eh'yeh is the first person future tense of "to be". That the idiom can be understood to be a name (also a purpose of the website) is not a problem, but then translating it (one does not translate proper names) is silly. Check the Onkelos' Aramaic and compare it to the T"Y and the Yerushalmi. The first doesn't translate it at all, treating it like a name, the other interpret it to refer to the past, present and future.

But if you want to translate it, "I will be" is the way to go. Basic Hebrew.
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Thanks
 
H

Hawkins

Well-Known Member
Soapy said:
I have heard many debates about the so-called Trinity God that the greater sect of Christianity is supposed to believe in. However, I cannot find in the scriptures anywhere where God tells anyone that He is three persons.

I know that God tells the Israelites that He is ONE GOD and that they should have no other God but He…, but I can’t see anywhere where it is stated, inferred, conjectured, shown, nor proved to the Israelites, Jews, nor Christian’s, that He is three person!

Are there any such proofs, suggestions, inferences, etc….?
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Israel is the only people in the area of Canaan believing the One God. Thus God didn't reveal His Trinity to introduce confusion. Just as Jesus pointed out, David the prophet in OT says that "the Lord of my lord..." He's pointing out His own deity. There are other signs and prophecies hinted on His Trinity. In a nutshell, it seems that God only reveals His Trinity to specific prophets such as David and Isaiah, perhaps couple others.

Humans get information from the testimonies of witnesses. God's chosen witness Thomas called Jesus God directly. Jesus made prophecies on the fall of Second Temple. Basically the fall of the Second Temple signifies the end of the authentication of Judaism. While authentication was given to Christianity instead.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
rosends said:
The God character in Judaism did different things (contradictory to the narrative describing the actions of the God character in Islam. Even though the underlying ideas are the same, no one character can do two contradictory things, so the characters must be distinct.
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I believe there are no contradictions but I am willing to let you try some out just for fun.
 
rosends

rosends

Well-Known Member
Muffled said:
I believe there are no contradictions but I am willing to let you try some out just for fun.
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According to Judaism, God commanded Abraham to sacrifice Isaac. According to Islam, he commanded Abraham to offer Ishmael. The Sacrifice Of Abraham
Those assign contradictory actions to a single entity. Therefore there must be 2 distinct characters.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
rosends said:
According to Judaism, God commanded Abraham to sacrifice Isaac. According to Islam, he commanded Abraham to offer Ishmael. The Sacrifice Of Abraham
Those assign contradictory actions to a single entity. Therefore there must be 2 distinct characters.
Click to expand...

I believe according to Islam is too vague. Is it according to the Qu'ran or a hadith. The hadiths are bogus.
 
River Sea

River Sea

Active Member
  • How come the Quran isn't attached to the Bible? Have one book with the old and new testaments, followed by the Quran.
  • We're all gods, so how many gods is that?
  • However, we're all one, so that would mean one God, right?
  • How is it that Brahman Allah and YHWH are the same God?
  • People came from the Indus Valley and branched outward, and through this, the three Abrahamic religions came about.
  • Spirituality math is fascinating, and no one seems to agree, ha ha., fun fun fun:)
 
IndigoChild5559

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
River Sea said:
  • How come the Quran isn't attached to the Bible? Have one book with the old and new testaments, followed by the Quran.
Click to expand...
The Quran teaches that the Bible is corrupted. Thus, no one is interested in a volume that combines the Bible with the Quran.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
River Sea said:
  • How come the Quran isn't attached to the Bible? Have one book with the old and new testaments, followed by the Quran.
  • We're all gods, so how many gods is that?
  • However, we're all one, so that would mean one God, right?
  • How is it that Brahman Allah and YHWH are the same God?
  • People came from the Indus Valley and branched outward, and through this, the three Abrahamic religions came about.
  • Spirituality math is fascinating, and no one seems to agree, ha ha., fun fun fun:)
Click to expand...

I believe it is God's will that the books be separate.
 
E

Eli G

Well-Known Member
True religion is authentically endorsed by God. True original Judaism had prophets who performed miracles and demonstrated power from God; sometimes Jehovah would speak to some leader or prophet of the nation that he himself was protecting.

Exactly the same thing happened with true Christianism: many anointed Christians, continuing the display of power from on high they had been given like Jesus, performed publicly many mighty works. In this way they verified that they had the backing of the true God.

Apart from that, the study of the world's religions shows that some originate from others in the form of religious revolutions. People dissatisfied with traditional and national religious practices decide to create new life styles and philosophies, and form educational groups. Even Greek philosophy was based on that type of evolutionary mechanism of ancient beliefs, adapting them to the most recent realities and knowledge.

Islam is a local religion that spread. It arose from the evolution of local religions such as Hinduism and others, syncretized with the Abrahamic monoteism that they had inherited from the non-Israelite descendants of Abraham who occupied the area of origin of that religion.

However, Islam and its religious leaders have never displayed powerful works that publicly showed that they have the backing of the God they claim to worship. It is just a human religion with the same origin common to all other human religions that exist.

True and pure God's worship has not human origin.
 
Soapy

Soapy

Son of his Father: The Heir and Prince
Hawkins said:
Israel is the only people in the area of Canaan believing the One God. Thus God didn't reveal His Trinity to introduce confusion. Just as Jesus pointed out, David the prophet in OT says that "the Lord of my lord..." He's pointing out His own deity. There are other signs and prophecies hinted on His Trinity. In a nutshell, it seems that God only reveals His Trinity to specific prophets such as David and Isaiah, perhaps couple others.

Humans get information from the testimonies of witnesses. God's chosen witness Thomas called Jesus God directly. Jesus made prophecies on the fall of Second Temple. Basically the fall of the Second Temple signifies the end of the authentication of Judaism. While authentication was given to Christianity instead.
Click to expand...
Are you sure that Thomas is portrayed as a witness to the trinity God?

Are you saying that Jesus revealed to David and Isaiah that God is three persons?

Didn’t Jesus challenge the Jews who accused him of ‘making himself God’ (By the way, that doesn’t make sense as written. It’s more likely that it was ‘Making out you are a God!’ as many religions believed that anyone who claimed to be ‘Son of [a] God’ was a God!). And note that Jesus actually said, “I only said that God is my Father!”.
And we know that, in reality, being Son of God does not make that person also God…

But wasn’t the accusation that Jesus was making himself EQUAL TO God…

I mean, linguistics… common sense… No one can be EQUAL TO GOD if they ARE GOD… Being EQUAL requires TWO entities… and God said: “Beside(s) me, THERE IS NO OTHER GOD’… there is no one like him…!
 
IndigoChild5559

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Muffled said:
I do not believe the Qu'ran teaches that but it surely points out that men corrupt its meaning in interpretation.
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Sura 3:78: And there is indeed a group among them who twist their tongues with the book, that you may suppose it to be from the book. But it is not from the book. And they say, “It is from God,” though it is not from God. And they knowingly speak a lie against God.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
Soapy said:
Are you sure that Thomas is portrayed as a witness to the trinity God?

Are you saying that Jesus revealed to David and Isaiah that God is three persons?

Didn’t Jesus challenge the Jews who accused him of ‘making himself God’ (By the way, that doesn’t make sense as written. It’s more likely that it was ‘Making out you are a God!’ as many religions believed that anyone who claimed to be ‘Son of [a] God’ was a God!). And note that Jesus actually said, “I only said that God is my Father!”.
And we know that, in reality, being Son of God does not make that person also God…

But wasn’t the accusation that Jesus was making himself EQUAL TO God…

I mean, linguistics… common sense… No one can be EQUAL TO GOD if they ARE GOD… Being EQUAL requires TWO entities… and God said: “Beside(s) me, THERE IS NO OTHER GOD’… there is no one like him…!
Click to expand...

However, I believe if God appears in two different places then He is equally God without being two entities.
 
Soapy

Soapy

Son of his Father: The Heir and Prince
Muffled said:
However, I believe if God appears in two different places then He is equally God without being two entities.
Click to expand...
ButGod didn’t appear in two places AT THE SAME TIME!

In fact, God never appeared IN PERSON anywhere at any time. All references to ‘God’ appearing, are ‘Chazah’… ‘envisionments’… or by REPRESENTATIVE such as an angel.
 
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