thou shalt not kill or thou shalt not murder

[Quiddity]

Waco was in God's name.

Many of us no longer look at the genocidal and infantcidal killing directed by God so frequent in Old Testament, as "just" but in fact it is immoral today.

I doubt it. I'm almost certain if I tried to kill you, you wouldn't let me.

 

[Hacker]

Only if it is a just killing, I do not consider it a sin.

What do you consider a "just" killing??? It's thou shall not kill, plain and simple.

 

[Quiddity]

What do you consider a "just" killing??? It's thou shall not kill, plain and simple.

Self-defense is one example.

 

[Booko]

Self-defense is one example.

Execution is another.

And here's the thing. Levitical law does call for execution in some cases.

If it was "Thou shalt not kill" then what are you going to do for an executioner? Call in the goyim?

 

[TashaN]

Now most would say it is translated as "Thou shalt not murder" but this was brought up in another thread...is there a difference? In the Biblical context? is there a difference between Killing and Murdering??

Even the OP is directing the question toward the bible but i wanted to share the same complete concept according to Quran because it's about the children of Israel as well.

[32] On that account: We ordained for the Children of Israel that if anyone slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole people: and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people. Then although there came to them Our Messengers with Clear Signs, Yet, even after that, many of them continued to commit excesses in the land. (Quran 5:32)

Peace and blessing,

 

[Deut 13:1]

I don't know what God says about just killings being a sin or not. I said intentional or unintentional, not just or unjust.

Do you know any examples in the bible, cause I don't. To be honest, I've never even though of killings being just or unjust (biblically anyway).

A defensive war is a biblical obligation. When someone comes to kill you, you have an obligation to defend yourself.

The Talmud says, If someone comes to kill you, you must rise up and kill him first. Sanhedrin 72a

 

[Deut 13:1]

Levitical law does call for execution in some cases.

Care to list how the Levitical law says it should be carried out as well? Or did you skip that part of the Torah since it doesn't fit well with your understanding of the bible?

 

[BM5]

The commandment should read " Thou shalt not kill unjustly. "

 

[Pah]

Then I would more assuredly commit a sin if someone trys to kill me unjustly. Perhaps you can show us an example from the Bible where a justified killing was considered a sin?

I would have to combine biblical points. James 2 says that conviction of one sin is conviction of all sins. Christ said that only those who would kill, by stoning, the adultress (prostitute?) under that law at the time had to be free of sin. That would negate all "justified" killing if you also combine "turning the other check" or taking no action against an attacker.

 

[McBell]

The commandment should read " Thou shalt not kill unjustly. "

It should read:
Thou Shalt not kill unless the one being killed
rejects the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God (Deuteronomy 17:12)
is a homosexual (Leviticus 20:13)
acts as a medium or fortuneteller (Leviticus 20:27)
strikes his father or mother(Exodus 21:15)
curses his father or mother (Proverbs 20:20) (Leviticus 20:9)
commits adultry (Leviticus 20:10)
follows another religion (Exodus 22:19)(Numbers 25:1-9)
are nonbelievers (2 Chronicles 15:12-13)
are not a virgin on wedding night (Deuteronomy 22:20-21)
speaks blasphemy (Leviticus 24:10-16)
working on the sabbath (Exodus 31:12-15)
is the son of a sinner (Isaiah 14:21)

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Now most would say it is translated as "Thou shalt not murder" but this was brought up in another thread...is there a difference? In the Biblical context? is there a difference between Killing and Murdering??

IMHO, it's defiantely murder, and one can only murder an innocent human being.

I'm pretty sure that the Hebrew word in the commandment lists is not the same for "kill" in the commands that God gave to people at war. That is, God said not to murder in the commandments, but to kill people in the wars of the Conquest in Canaan. Also, God told people to execute people for all kinds of crimes in Leviticus.

 

[reyjamiei]

Now most would say it is translated as "Thou shalt not murder" but this was brought up in another thread...is there a difference? In the Biblical context? is there a difference between Killing and Murdering??

"Thou shalt not kill makes no sense considering these verses:

Exodus 19:12 And thou shalt set bounds unto the people round about, saying, Take heed to yourselves, that ye go not up into the mount, or touch the border of it: whosoever toucheth the mount shall be surely put to death:

Exodus 21:12 He that smiteth a man, so that he die, shall be surely put to death.

Exodus 21:15 And he that smiteth his father, or his mother, shall be surely put to death.

Exodus 21:16 And he that stealeth a man, and selleth him, or if he be found in his hand, he shall surely be put to death.

Exodus 21:17 And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death.

Exodus 21:29 But if the ox were wont to push with his horn in time past, and it hath been testified to his owner, and he hath not kept him in, but that he hath killed a man or a woman; the ox shall be stoned, and his owner also shall be put to death.

Exodus 22:19 Whosoever lieth with a beast shall surely be put to death.

Exodus 31:14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.

Exodus 31:15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.

It appears that sometimes to kill is not a thou shalt not but a thou shall.