The "Should Wants"

[Fireside_Hindu]

Namaste all,

I've made threads on contentment and motivation as it relates to attachment recently and there's another question related to all that which has come up.

We learn that attachment breeds unhappiness. But what about the things we are told we "should want" but don't? For example, we are told we should want children. But what if we don't want them? (inability is another issue, I'm speaking of people who can have children and have the resources to raise children but choose not to.)

I am 31 and have yet to feel a desire to have children, but as a Hindu I am told it it one of the primary goals and joys of life. But if I don't feel that way, how do I reconcile that with following my dharma?

I read an interesting article about a woman who never wanted children and she was giving an interview in her 50s about never starting a family. She mentioned something interesting, which was that when she was younger, she didn't want to have children but that she "wanted to want to have children". In other words, it would have been much easier for her socially, if she just went ahead and had children like society wanted her to, but she never developed the desire.

What are your thoughts on the "should wants"?

(Just to clarify, this is not a debate on the pros and cons of having children. I just use that as an example to illustrate the issue)

 

[DeviChaaya]

There are a number of things I 'should want'. One of them is a husband to love and to feel sexually attracted to. Unfortunately I'm not attracted to anyone and have zero sexual drive but I am told by pretty much all societies that I should want this, and children of course. I do not want children or a husband or a wife either. I want simply to help others and dedicate myself to Ma's servant. Also, cats. I love cats, I am far too attached to the little killing machines!

 

[SomeRandom]

Yeah no desire for kids, no desire for a husband, no desires that further the community. But what if there's a flip side? What if you don't want kids? Well, you could look at it like this. The earth is overpopulated, by not bringing in more kids, you are doing your part to preserve resources for future generations.
Perhaps you're not supposed to have a spouse yet. We don't live in the 1800s anymore. This is the 21st century. We must adapt to the times. Perhaps it's just not the right time for you. Maybe your destiny is to continue your own spiritual path before you allow another to come into that.
There are always outliers, there are always the "oddities" in society. But they too have their part to play. Just because it's not the "norm" doesn't mean it's bad.

 

[Vinayaka]

Namaste all,

I've made threads on contentment and motivation as it relates to attachment recently and there's another question related to all that which has come up.

We learn that attachment breeds unhappiness. But what about the things we are told we "should want" but don't? For example, we are told we should want children. But what if we don't want them? (inability is another issue, I'm speaking of people who can have children and have the resources to raise children but choose not to.)

I am 31 and have yet to feel a desire to have children, but as a Hindu I am told it it one of the primary goals and joys of life. But if I don't feel that way, how do I reconcile that with following my dharma?

I read an interesting article about a woman who never wanted children and she was giving an interview in her 50s about never starting a family. She mentioned something interesting, which was that when she was younger, she didn't want to have children but that she "wanted to want to have children". In other words, it would have been much easier for her socially, if she just went ahead and had children like society wanted her to, but she never developed the desire.

What are your thoughts on the "should wants"?

(Just to clarify, this is not a debate on the pros and cons of having children. I just use that as an example to illustrate the issue)

FS, I just see this as a tendency in society to poke our noses into other peoples' business. It's egotistical projection of ones own personality traits onto others, and that is the adharmic part. Not having children isn't adharmic. Saying something like 'you should want to stay out of jail' is different in that its just good advice.

We should all try hard as individuals to keep 'You should' out of our vocabulary unless advice is solicited. I've been told 'You should come to a festival' kind of stuff when I don't want to go to the festival.

So ... in one ear and out the other'.

 

[Islington]

Hello FS,

Still learning to be Hindu and many thing I discover with my swami. Some of them I don't agree on, but then, ask myself: to what end should I do this, or that?

I read that the purpose of having children is to please the ancestors, please the gods and to help a soul grow into the best it can be in this lifetime.
Well, I should be able to do that without having children of my own.

I can bring wealth to my family by working hard and then leaving my inheritance to my nephews/nieces. I can adopt or help to educate my family children, I can set up a good example to my youngest cousins, too.


And so many "should wants" according to families, friends, societies! "should wants" should just change according to the passing years and evolution of society.
But once I understand the reason, I usually can find a way around, because, as much as I "should want" stuff, I truly want to experience my life and walk down my small dharmic path.

 

[Vinayaka]

I'd just like to add some stuff about svadharma. Svadharma is the dharma of an individual. Each individual soul has their own duty to perform. It's a result of many factors. Karma, genetic codes, etc. So 'you should' can only be applied on an individual level, not as a generalisation. That is why in traditional guru-sishya relationships, its a one to one deal. When the sishya asks for advice, and the teacher says, 'you' he or she is referring only to that individual, and nobody else.

 

[Aupmanyav]

DeviChaaya and FS: 'You should' do what comes naturally to you. However, there is a right age for doing each thing. Children are best before the age of 35 for women (that is what medicine pundits keep saying). My daughter was born when I was 27 and son at the age of 30. He was in regular job when I was 50 and I married my daughter by the age of 53. Responsibilities for children over. I think I was lucky that way. Islington: Yes, Hindus think that having children pays the debt to ancestors but it is about continuation of the family and culture, which I think is a social responsibility. Any particular reason that you do not want to have children? Of course, you can leave your inheritance for nephews and nieces. 'You should' not expect anything other than this from an old orthodox person like me.

 

[Islington]

Oh, I was mainly going along with FireSide's illustration (too lazy to find my own)! I could have said the same about not wanting a car or to someday get my own house in the countryside. These examples are what any Westerner should want, what is viewed as normal, at least in my country.

 

[Shantanu]

Namaste all,

I've made threads on contentment and motivation as it relates to attachment recently and there's another question related to all that which has come up.

We learn that attachment breeds unhappiness. But what about the things we are told we "should want" but don't? For example, we are told we should want children. But what if we don't want them? (inability is another issue, I'm speaking of people who can have children and have the resources to raise children but choose not to.)

I am 31 and have yet to feel a desire to have children, but as a Hindu I am told it it one of the primary goals and joys of life. But if I don't feel that way, how do I reconcile that with following my dharma?

I read an interesting article about a woman who never wanted children and she was giving an interview in her 50s about never starting a family. She mentioned something interesting, which was that when she was younger, she didn't want to have children but that she "wanted to want to have children". In other words, it would have been much easier for her socially, if she just went ahead and had children like society wanted her to, but she never developed the desire.

What are your thoughts on the "should wants"?

(Just to clarify, this is not a debate on the pros and cons of having children. I just use that as an example to illustrate the issue)

I have a simple philosophy: if something comes within your path of life, deal with it in the most naturally-satisfying manner that you can bearing the central principles of ahimsa and progress of humankind and concern for the environment. This applies to all ones engagements on a daily basis: it is the basis of my satya-advaita.

 

[Vinayaka]

Yes, Hindus think that having children pays the debt to ancestors but it is about continuation of the family and culture, which I think is a social responsibility.

I've always not really liked the overemphasis on it. What about the individual who is more suited to sannyasin life. You end up with a person not happy in marriage just because his family was overbearing. Also, what about the person who is too immature or emotionally unstable to make a good parent? You end up with abusive situations unnecessarily. I think it better in some cases to discourage marriage at all, let alone having kids.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Well, your view, Vinayaka. Sure, exceptions are there. Sankara was one. If the person has not matured emotionally, then it is the responsibility of his/her parent that he/she should not get the additional burden of marriage and family. I am talking of a general rule of the society. No marriage in India also means less support or parents in their old age. Of course, Western society differs in this respect from the Indian society.

 

[Vinayaka]

Well, your view, Vinayaka. Sure, exceptions are there. Sankara was one. If the person has not matured emotionally, then it is the responsibility of his/her parent that he/she should not get the additional burden of marriage and family. I am talking of a general rule of the society. No marriage in India also means less support or parents in their old age. Of course, Western society differs in this respect from the Indian society.

Yes, I realise that, but I've seen a few too many failed marriages from parents practically coercing their kids into it. One was a man who was really cut out to be a sannyasin, so he spent more time in his shrine room meditating than working. The other was worse, he was a 'differently abled' young man whom his parents tried to marry off sight unseen. Fortunately the young lady could see right through the guise immediately and fled the scene when he went for the marriage.

Yes, marriage works really well for some people. Of our 5 children, 4 are married, 2 of those won't be having kids, and the other is still single. So we love them all of course. That sort of thing is their choice, not mine. The days of the elders ruling the roost are over, I'm afraid, unless its applied with a great deal of common sense.