I am seeking all opinions on the presence of the Serpent in the Garden of Eden. My specific question is this: Did the Serpent tempt Eve with the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge because he wanted Eve and Adam to fall as revenge for God's preference of man over His angels? All corrections and opinions welcome. My goal is a better understanding of how members here interpret this incident.
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The Serpent in the Garden of Eden
- Thread starter RRex
- Start date
My opinion is this: there was no serpent to temp Adam or Eve.
The story narrative simply explains, in simple children's terms, the differences between two opposing values: Good and evil.
Adam an Eve were gifted with the ability to reason, to make choices.
The test by which that is determined is the making of the right choices, based on what is good and or what is evil.
How would they know which was which?
When it is said that God told Adam that of all the trees in the garden, one of them in particular, they could not eat of. The day he did, he would surely die.
That was the inner voice of the Spirit of God, or better understood as the moral conscience.
The moral conscience is the "Adam" in the "Eve". Explained: Spirit breath of God (Adam) into the clay, earthen vessel, "Eve".
A marriage between heaven and earth resulting in a living soul.
Gen_5:2 Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
Since both male and female are both called "Adam" in the singular, defines both as possessing a spirit and flesh in the same body or, in other words, a living souls.
Adam, being the spirit and moral guidance of the human body "Eve" reflects the superior quality of the human being; be it male or female.
While Eve, being the clay vessel , earthen origin, reflects the weaker partner of the human being, be it male or female.
That is why there is no gender difference in Gods eyes.
Getting back to the "presence of Satan" in the garden.
The fleshly world is the playing field by which all human temptation is derived from.
1Jn_2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
Reasoning then is, that Satan is of the world and lusting after things of the world...... defiles us.
Blessings, AJ
The story narrative simply explains, in simple children's terms, the differences between two opposing values: Good and evil.
Adam an Eve were gifted with the ability to reason, to make choices.
The test by which that is determined is the making of the right choices, based on what is good and or what is evil.
How would they know which was which?
When it is said that God told Adam that of all the trees in the garden, one of them in particular, they could not eat of. The day he did, he would surely die.
That was the inner voice of the Spirit of God, or better understood as the moral conscience.
The moral conscience is the "Adam" in the "Eve". Explained: Spirit breath of God (Adam) into the clay, earthen vessel, "Eve".
A marriage between heaven and earth resulting in a living soul.
Gen_5:2 Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
Since both male and female are both called "Adam" in the singular, defines both as possessing a spirit and flesh in the same body or, in other words, a living souls.
Adam, being the spirit and moral guidance of the human body "Eve" reflects the superior quality of the human being; be it male or female.
While Eve, being the clay vessel , earthen origin, reflects the weaker partner of the human being, be it male or female.
That is why there is no gender difference in Gods eyes.
Getting back to the "presence of Satan" in the garden.
The fleshly world is the playing field by which all human temptation is derived from.
1Jn_2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
Reasoning then is, that Satan is of the world and lusting after things of the world...... defiles us.
Blessings, AJ
Native
Free Natural Philosopher & Comparative Mythologist
Hello RRex,
Forget this interpretation! The Story of Creation is a description of the creation as our early ancestors saw and percieved this via inspirations and this and it has NOTHING to do with "what is evil or good", because the entire creation is good - if we humans follow the natural creation.
The ancient world view contains knowledge of our galaxy, the Milky Way and the Solar System. The Milky Way can be observed around the entire Earth and the Milky Way is mentioned in several cultural myths of creation as "a great serpent". In the Norse Mytology it is called the Midgaard Serpent because it encircles the Earth, the "middle center" where we all live, "The Garden of Eden".
Forget the patriarchal dualism in the Bible and otherwhere and look at the creation stories as a cosmological description instead. Take a look at my personal Mytho-Cosmological website http://www.native-science.net/index.html
Best Wishes
Ivar
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Thanda
Well-Known Member
My belief is that Satan is the serpent. He tempted Adam and Eve to disobey God because he wants to draw people away from God since God cast him out of heaven.
We humans lived in heaven as Angels of God in the preexistence. God presented a plan about how we could grow and become like him. But the plan carried the risk that if we chose evil over good we would not be able to live in God's presence. Lucifer presented a plan in which no one would be lost. The essence of his plan was that people would be denied the ability to chose. God rejected this plan and Lucifer was angry. Those who agreed with him strove against those who agreed with God. Eventually, he was cast out of heaven, him and all those who would follow him. One third of the hosts of heaven followed him. We humans are part of the two thirds that rejected him and agreed with God. He hates us and wants us to fall.
EtuMalku
Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
The Fall represents mankind's and nature's fall into materialism. This Fall shields us from the spiritual world and opens an Abyss between Man and the Divine.
The Right Hand Path aims to restore the original harmonic relation between Man and the Divine.
The Left Hand Path fulfills and deepens the Fall. The Dark Adept continues the Fall from the failed and collapsed Tree of Life to reach individual divinity.
The Serpent, represents the divine force of creation that is able to carry out the idea of creation. It sinks down to man's level and awakens the power of creation and the sexual energy in man (Kundalini). Through Egypt the Serpent is introduced into mythology and therefore into our collective unconsciousness as the power enabling us to attain sovereignty in physical form.
Religion in early Egypt which combined Zabaism or Sabianism (the worship of the sun, moon and stars) and Ophiolatreia. The Serpent was known as Cneph and was the primordial, eternal spirit whose symbol was a serpent, his image that of a serpent with an egg in its mouth.
The oldest known representation of two snakes entwined around a rod is that of the Sumerian fertility, healing and god of magick, Ningizzida shown with another serpent deity Dumuzi. Ningizzida was the ancestor of Gilgamesh, who according to the epic dived to the bottom of the waters to retrieve the plant of life. But while he rested from his labor, a serpent came and ate the plant. The snake became immortal, and Gilgamesh was destined to die.
Here lies the foundation of the Serpent, its myth origin and the Abrahamic demonizing of it.
The Right Hand Path aims to restore the original harmonic relation between Man and the Divine.
The Left Hand Path fulfills and deepens the Fall. The Dark Adept continues the Fall from the failed and collapsed Tree of Life to reach individual divinity.
The Serpent, represents the divine force of creation that is able to carry out the idea of creation. It sinks down to man's level and awakens the power of creation and the sexual energy in man (Kundalini). Through Egypt the Serpent is introduced into mythology and therefore into our collective unconsciousness as the power enabling us to attain sovereignty in physical form.
Religion in early Egypt which combined Zabaism or Sabianism (the worship of the sun, moon and stars) and Ophiolatreia. The Serpent was known as Cneph and was the primordial, eternal spirit whose symbol was a serpent, his image that of a serpent with an egg in its mouth.
The oldest known representation of two snakes entwined around a rod is that of the Sumerian fertility, healing and god of magick, Ningizzida shown with another serpent deity Dumuzi. Ningizzida was the ancestor of Gilgamesh, who according to the epic dived to the bottom of the waters to retrieve the plant of life. But while he rested from his labor, a serpent came and ate the plant. The snake became immortal, and Gilgamesh was destined to die.
Here lies the foundation of the Serpent, its myth origin and the Abrahamic demonizing of it.
If this is so, why was the snake/serpent never associated with the Satan in the Hebrew texts? The snake is clearly a Satan/Shaitan(accusor), but it is extremely rare to find Jews who correlate the snake with the depiction of The Satan found in Christianity, the worker of evil and prince of darkness.
Thanda
Well-Known Member
I don't know what Jews believe about the serpent. But we have the following in Revelation 12:
7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
Yes. that old serpent. That can be literally anything. There's no definable connection between that and the Eden Snake. However, what I'm asking is why did it take so long to define the snake as The Satan? Did the story change when Christianity came around?
Thanda
Well-Known Member
Like I said, I don't know what Jews believe about the serpent in the Garden. Perhaps @Tumah could assist us with a Jewish explanation of what the snake represents. But according to my believe the story in the Garden was told in a poetic form (like the story of Job) and so a lot of allegory was used.
McBell
mantra-chanting henotheistic snake handler
I wonder how many people would have made "that old serpent" in Revelation the serpent from Genesis BEFORE the Bible was compiled....
Thanda
Well-Known Member
Probably many. The guy who wrote "that old serpent" likely had access to the book of Genesis.
EtuMalku
Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
As I've already posted here . . . Sumer beat Christianity to the punch on the Serpent, Garden, Fall thingy
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
The serpent was arguably just created being an animal itself. Was it not?
It leads to one asking just how in the world did the serpent ever get the knowledge of good and evil in order to even pose the question to Eve?
One would think upon reading the narrative that the serpent itself had first eaten from the tree, and without any consequence, never was thrown out of the garden unlike unlucky Adam and Eve were.
Something fishy was definitely going on If you ask me. Not quite right at all ....
the serpent was a wise person.
the word serpent is taken from the root word for a soothsay/seer/prophet
the noun
https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=H5175&t=KJV
from the verb
https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/lexicon.cfm?strongs=H5172&t=KJV
the messiah is a nachash
http://www.themystica.com/mystica/articles/n/nachash.html
same as the naassene of the jewish, the nagas of hinduism and buddhism, the naja of egyptian, or the uraeus
http://jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/6723-gnosticism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naassenes
Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves.
Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
Thank you for all replies so far.
I guess no one really answered my question yet though.
Do you think the Serpent did it for revenge against man?
I will follow up on your replies tomorrow.
The Shining One, the barer of God's light, the anointed covering Cherub, the one perfect in beauty and wisdom tested man in Eden because He wanted to prove God was wrong about man's value. He wanted to prove God was unjust to make all of the Malakim bow to the new creation. By this, He could prove He was right to have challenged God's authority in the first place and that He deserves to rule in place of God. In other words, it was an attempt to prove God wrong. This attempt brought Him closer to success because the world fell with man and the battle continues to this day. The only question left is whether or not God is just or unjust in the matter.
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the elohim of chapter 1 and 2 genesis is not the same as the god most high that melchizedek served.
ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
I am very aware of what supernals (Elohim) are.