Self Honesty and The Lie of Selflessness

[ThirtyThree]

I hate self honesty. It is in my opinion one of the most hideous things in existence. It strips away every bit of mystique, every ornate embellishment and it leaves only reality. It does not matter how much pride I have, when I look into the mirror of truth, I always find myself staring into the eyes of nothing more than a mortal being. Every bit of pomp is burned away, incinerated within the eternally burning light of Reason.

There is no mystique remaining and any shred of belief in altruism has become nothing more than ash carried away by the wind. This is where I realize again that heroes are nothing more than men, and supernals are just as self serving as any mortal. In fact, I will go on record and state that there is no hope for such virtue of selflessness to be found, even in most celebrated and adored gods.

These are the moments where I realize benevolence is motivated not by virtue but by self gain, and virtue is nothing more than a term to make people feel happier about their selfishly motivated acts. Altruism is nothing more than the grandest of deception. It is a great lie told regarding mortals and supernals alike, and nothing more than a fairy tale for adults.

How ugly is this self honesty? Once again, I realize, I am utterly selfish. Unconditional love, regardless of me claiming to towards my deity, was truly one of the worst types of lies I could ever have let myself believe.

I do not retain my faith because I have unconditional love for my deity. I retain my faith because it benefits me, and I serve my deity for the same reason. I do derive a sense of fulfillment and wholeness from all of this. Else why would I do it? I would be insane, surely? Then, it is also a matter of great pride for me that I continue forward, regardless of the trials I have faced and will face. This gives me a greater sense of personal value. It is simply that and nothing more. That is the cold and hard truth.

What of others reading this? Have you delved into the often brutal revealing flame that is self honesty? Do you believe selflessness is possible?

 

[Willamena]

I hate self honesty. It is in my opinion one of the most hideous things in existence. It strips away every bit of mystique, every ornate embellishment and it leaves only reality.

Depends on what you're being honest about.

 

[Nietzsche]

I hate self honesty. It is in my opinion one of the most hideous things in existence. It strips away every bit of mystique, every ornate embellishment and it leaves only reality. It does not matter how much pride I have, when I look into the mirror of truth, I always find myself staring into the eyes of nothing more than a mortal being. Every bit of pomp is burned away, incinerated within the eternally burning light of Reason.

There is no mystique remaining and any shred of belief in altruism has become nothing more than ash carried away by the wind. This is where I realize again that heroes are nothing more than men, and supernals are just as self serving as any mortal. In fact, I will go on record and state that there is no hope for such virtue of selflessness to be found, even in most celebrated and adored gods.

These are the moments where I realize benevolence is motivated not by virtue but by self gain, and virtue is nothing more than a term to make people feel happier about their selfishly motivated acts. Altruism is nothing more than the grandest of deception. It is a great lie told regarding mortals and supernals alike, and nothing more than a fairy tale for adults.

How ugly is this self honesty? Once again, I realize, I am utterly selfish. Unconditional love, regardless of me claiming to towards my deity, was truly one of the worst types of lies I could ever have let myself believe.

I do not retain my faith because I have unconditional love for my deity. I retain my faith because it benefits me, and I serve my deity for the same reason. I do derive a sense of fulfillment and wholeness from all of this. Else why would I do it? I would be insane, surely? Then, it is also a matter of great pride for me that I continue forward, regardless of the trials I have faced and will face. This gives me a greater sense of personal value. It is simply that and nothing more. That is the cold and hard truth.

What of others reading this? Have you delved into the often brutal revealing flame that is self honesty? Do you believe selflessness is possible?

Edgelord alert!

 

[ThirtyThree]

Edgelord alert!

Edgelord?

 

[Terese]

Edgelord?

He thinks you're being edgy for the sake of being edgy.

 

[ThirtyThree]

He thinks you're being edgy for the sake of being edgy.

He is incorrect then.

 

[Riverwolf]

I understand this sort of reasoning. It's not uncommon; I've heard it from time to time. But I've actually looked even further into this matter, because something about it never felt right. In doing so, I came to a few realizations.

Selfishness isn't even inherently bad. We're only taught that it's bad by an overculture that assumes an objective, binary "good/bad" morality, with "selflessness" as "objectively good" and "selfishness" as "objectively bad." But as always, nothing is binary except binary, and morality cannot, by virtue of being a psychological tendency, be objective. Selflessness and selfishness are neither inherently good nor bad. They're just ways of describing certain motivations.

There's also this idea that there's only "one truth" hidden beneath a bunch of lies. That is, "oh, you list all these good things, but it's nothing more than this bad thing; all those good things are therefore invalid." I now find this kinda silly. Why can't selfishness and selflessness exist side-by-side? I help someone, both because I selflessly want them to be fine, and selfishly want to feel good about helping people. Why must the latter negate the former?

The only answer I can find is that it doesn't. They can, and do, exist together. Self gain can certainly be one of the motivations of an altruistic act, but that doesn't change the fact that an altruistic act was performed at no expense or detriment of the one acted upon.

Humans are social animals. Other social animals display altruism all the time, if nothing else to their own "tribe". It's mutually beneficial, and allows us all to survive. Animals that lack altruism also tend to be solitary.

The only time selfishness is a problem is when it ignores the well-being of others. When we seek self-gratification at the unwilling expense of other people. But likewise, selflessness that completely ignores the self's well-being is also a problem, because... well, what good am I to others if I'm not in a healthy position to help them?

As for the pomp and mystique, well... come on. Look at the night sky. Look at all those stars. If you're far away enough from city lights, try to find the Milky Way. Know that we are all, quite literally, made of the same stuff. We are Stardust.

 

[Thief]

I hate self honesty. It is in my opinion one of the most hideous things in existence. It strips away every bit of mystique, every ornate embellishment and it leaves only reality. It does not matter how much pride I have, when I look into the mirror of truth, I always find myself staring into the eyes of nothing more than a mortal being. Every bit of pomp is burned away, incinerated within the eternally burning light of Reason.

There is no mystique remaining and any shred of belief in altruism has become nothing more than ash carried away by the wind. This is where I realize again that heroes are nothing more than men, and supernals are just as self serving as any mortal. In fact, I will go on record and state that there is no hope for such virtue of selflessness to be found, even in most celebrated and adored gods.

These are the moments where I realize benevolence is motivated not by virtue but by self gain, and virtue is nothing more than a term to make people feel happier about their selfishly motivated acts. Altruism is nothing more than the grandest of deception. It is a great lie told regarding mortals and supernals alike, and nothing more than a fairy tale for adults.

How ugly is this self honesty? Once again, I realize, I am utterly selfish. Unconditional love, regardless of me claiming to towards my deity, was truly one of the worst types of lies I could ever have let myself believe.

I do not retain my faith because I have unconditional love for my deity. I retain my faith because it benefits me, and I serve my deity for the same reason. I do derive a sense of fulfillment and wholeness from all of this. Else why would I do it? I would be insane, surely? Then, it is also a matter of great pride for me that I continue forward, regardless of the trials I have faced and will face. This gives me a greater sense of personal value. It is simply that and nothing more. That is the cold and hard truth.

What of others reading this? Have you delved into the often brutal revealing flame that is self honesty? Do you believe selflessness is possible?

your first line leans to the notion...you prefer to lie to yourself and not fix the fault.
your second line supports by the rejection.

mystique is preferred?

I believe in God and heaven.
we came into this world naked
we leave...even more so.

here in this life our thoughts and feelings are shielded.
no one knows but that you speak of it.....or post it

in the next life....I believe...
God and heaven can see through us as if we are made of glass
all that was ever done in secret shall be made known

you will still be yourself....but the ability to hide from others will be gone

 

[Corthos]

I understand this sort of reasoning. It's not uncommon; I've heard it from time to time. But I've actually looked even further into this matter, because something about it never felt right. In doing so, I came to a few realizations.

Selfishness isn't even inherently bad. We're only taught that it's bad by an overculture that assumes an objective, binary "good/bad" morality, with "selflessness" as "objectively good" and "selfishness" as "objectively bad." But as always, nothing is binary except binary, and morality cannot, by virtue of being a psychological tendency, be objective. Selflessness and selfishness are neither inherently good nor bad. They're just ways of describing certain motivations.

There's also this idea that there's only "one truth" hidden beneath a bunch of lies. That is, "oh, you list all these good things, but it's nothing more than this bad thing; all those good things are therefore invalid." I now find this kinda silly. Why can't selfishness and selflessness exist side-by-side? I help someone, both because I selflessly want them to be fine, and selfishly want to feel good about helping people. Why must the latter negate the former?

The only answer I can find is that it doesn't. They can, and do, exist together. Self gain can certainly be one of the motivations of an altruistic act, but that doesn't change the fact that an altruistic act was performed at no expense or detriment of the one acted upon.

Humans are social animals. Other social animals display altruism all the time, if nothing else to their own "tribe". It's mutually beneficial, and allows us all to survive. Animals that lack altruism also tend to be solitary.

The only time selfishness is a problem is when it ignores the well-being of others. When we seek self-gratification at the unwilling expense of other people. But likewise, selflessness that completely ignores the self's well-being is also a problem, because... well, what good am I to others if I'm not in a healthy position to help them?

As for the pomp and mystique, well... come on. Look at the night sky. Look at all those stars. If you're far away enough from city lights, try to find the Milky Way. Know that we are all, quite literally, made of the same stuff. We are Stardust.

Beautiful, and eloquently put. Thank you for that. =)

 

[Jumi]

I believe self-honesty is key to self-knowledge. Just be careful with it around people who would use it against you.

 

[allfoak]

What of others reading this? Have you delved into the often brutal revealing flame that is self honesty? Do you believe selflessness is possible?

All of life is a paradox.

The most selfish and selfless act man can engage in, is to love his enemy.


We must love our enemy until they become our friend.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

How ugly is this self honesty? Once again, I realize, I am utterly selfish.

Self-honesty can be very uncomfortable at times, but it is a great deal better than dishonesty or living in a self-deluded fantasy.

 

[Thief]

All of life is a paradox.

The most selfish and selfless act man can engage in, is to love his enemy.


We must love our enemy until they become our friend.

not sure if that was the actual intent.

there is no greater love than to lay down your life for another....a famous quote...

seems selfless

but to love your enemy as you do yourself is not a matter of friendship or affection
it may only be a code of behavior.

what if your enemy has the upper hand and you are about to die for cause of it?

 

[allfoak]

what if your enemy has the upper hand and you are about to die for cause of it?

What if you are the cause of your enemy getting the upper hand?
If we do not live a peaceful life then our enemy will always have the upper hand.

I must be selfish to be selfless.

 

[Thief]

What if you are the cause of your enemy getting the upper hand?
If we do not live a peaceful life then our enemy will always have the upper hand.

I must be selfish to be selfless.

being peaceful guarantees nothing.
I get it....philosophically....

Peace first.

and I believe the peace of heaven is guarded....by the angelic....with sword in hand.

but here is this world....being peaceful might do no more than make you a target.

 

[allfoak]

but here is this world....being peaceful might do no more than make you a target.

Thus the paradox of life.
One must live a peaceful life while defending the sanctity of life.

 

[allfoak]

That's incorrect. The selflessness is simply more difficult to achieve. I think you'll realize this.

Selflessness and selfishness are measurements of my state of being are they not?
This means that they are in fact the same thing.
There can never be one or the other but only a balance of the two.

This balance is what i call wholeness.

 

[Jiddanand]

I hate self honesty. It is in my opinion one of the most hideous things in existence. It strips away every bit of mystique, every ornate embellishment and it leaves only reality. It does not matter how much pride I have, when I look into the mirror of truth, I always find myself staring into the eyes of nothing more than a mortal being. Every bit of pomp is burned away, incinerated within the eternally burning light of Reason.

There is no mystique remaining and any shred of belief in altruism has become nothing more than ash carried away by the wind. This is where I realize again that heroes are nothing more than men, and supernals are just as self serving as any mortal. In fact, I will go on record and state that there is no hope for such virtue of selflessness to be found, even in most celebrated and adored gods.

These are the moments where I realize benevolence is motivated not by virtue but by self gain, and virtue is nothing more than a term to make people feel happier about their selfishly motivated acts. Altruism is nothing more than the grandest of deception. It is a great lie told regarding mortals and supernals alike, and nothing more than a fairy tale for adults.

How ugly is this self honesty? Once again, I realize, I am utterly selfish. Unconditional love, regardless of me claiming to towards my deity, was truly one of the worst types of lies I could ever have let myself believe.

I do not retain my faith because I have unconditional love for my deity. I retain my faith because it benefits me, and I serve my deity for the same reason. I do derive a sense of fulfillment and wholeness from all of this. Else why would I do it? I would be insane, surely? Then, it is also a matter of great pride for me that I continue forward, regardless of the trials I have faced and will face. This gives me a greater sense of personal value. It is simply that and nothing more. That is the cold and hard truth.

What of others reading this? Have you delved into the often brutal revealing flame that is self honesty? Do you believe selflessness is possible?

I hope you are 33. Good. But for you I have to say that the there is a thing known as self satisfaction, and not the self honesty. Those who teach honesty are obviously more dishonest.

 

[Desert Snake]

Selflessness and selfishness are measurements of my state of being are they not?
This means that they are in fact the same thing.
There can never be one or the other but only a balance of the two.

This balance is what i call wholeness.

That's fine.

~cheers

 

[allfoak]

That's fine. The only issue is, what prevents some one, from being completely selfish, and using the same justification? It might seem like a silly question, but if you present an equation such as you have, then you open yourself up to that argument.
The reason is, you are saying that they are the same thing.

You are absolutely right.
Both are completely legitimate pursuits but neither can be fully pursued and be lukewarm.
Once the commitment is made there is no turning back.
Both pursuits will accomplish the goal of self knowledge.

Most go from one end of the scale to the other everyday all day making no commitments to anything.
Self knowledge regardless of how it is achieved will eventually lead to wholeness.
One cannot live one polarity without knowing the other exists.
And we cannot know one polarity without experiencing the other.

All of life is a paradox.