Jonathan Rex
Member
Why can you not have your faith without constantly challenging Christians and Jews?
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Muslims
- Thread starter Jonathan Rex
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Guitar's Cry
Disciple of Pan
Jonathan Rex said:
A statement that can be asked of any religion.
Jonathan Rex
Member
Exactly . . .
The Quran is constantly whining about Christians and Jews.
The New Testament is constantly insulting Jews.
The Jewish Tanakh (Christian Old Testament) is constantly insulting Ancient Egyptians and laying claim to being "God's Chosen People"
When will you people grow up?
Buddhists and Taoists are over in Asia minding their own business and chanting at statues (as stupid as that sounds) and you people are blowing each other up in the name of God.
The Quran is constantly whining about Christians and Jews.
The New Testament is constantly insulting Jews.
The Jewish Tanakh (Christian Old Testament) is constantly insulting Ancient Egyptians and laying claim to being "God's Chosen People"
When will you people grow up?
Buddhists and Taoists are over in Asia minding their own business and chanting at statues (as stupid as that sounds) and you people are blowing each other up in the name of God.
Guitar's Cry said:
To a much lesser extent. I am not Muslim, but I would guess that the thing they find so hard to accept about Christianity is the conflicting views about Jesus Christ in theirs and our religions. As far as they are concerned, they think we believe in three Gods; I know that can be very daunting - the missionaries in Africa came across that problem as being the biggest hurdle.
But not all Muslims "challenge" others.
Jonathan Rex
Member
michel said:
No, the thing they find conflicting about Christian beliefs is probably Psalms 82
"I have said, 'Ye are gods, ALL OF YOU are children of the Most High."
How can Jesus be the Only Begotten Son if we are all gods and children of the Most High?
Jonathan Rex
Member
That and the whole idea of being whisked off to a heaven in the clouds by Jesus when Jesus said in Luke: "The kingdom of God is not some far off place to be found. No one will say to you, 'Here it is!' or 'There it is!' for the Kingdom of God is WITHIN YOU."
If Heaven is WITHIN, how can people be whisked off into some paradise in the sky?
If Heaven is WITHIN, how can people be whisked off into some paradise in the sky?
Booko
Deviled Hen
Jonathan Rex said:
If you read what the actual Muslims say, they speak in unison on this point: the Christian trinitarian view of God is shirk.
There is also a common (but not universal) belief that Christianity has become corrupted and its texts unreliable.
*wonders how that verse reads in the original Hebrew*
You know, I really need to get a CHUMASH...it would be so useful at times like this.
Guitar's Cry
Disciple of Pan
Booko said:Uh, I really haven't known Pagans or Baha'is or those who follow First Nations traditions to do a lot of challenging.
If you get down the denominational level, there are large sections of other religions that don't go around challenging people either.
Good point. I think it is an individual thing. For instance, I do know of some pagans who do challenge other's religions. I just think that singling out the Muslims is being rather unfair when there are instances of the same thing in so many other faiths.
Jonathan Rex
Member
Booko said:
Yet Mohammed said that Muslims must accept the Book (Bible) in Sura 2?
Shirk?
Make up your mind. Either you follow the Quran or you follow your own vain desires.
Exactly the way it reads in English.
That translation can be found in the Jewish Tanakh as well.
Jonathan Rex
Member
Guitar's Cry said:
Nobody is singling out Muslims.
Everybody is acting hypocritical.
Even Mohammed and Jesus.
Mohammed: "Man and woman are equal, like two teeth on a comb."
Mohammed later: "A woman's testimony is half of a man's."
Jesus: "If you do not have a sword, sell your cloak and purchase one now, the time is at hand."
Jesus: "Peter, sheath your sword. Do you not know that those who live by the sword die by the sword?"
Guitar's Cry
Disciple of Pan
Jonathan Rex said:
"Do I contradict myself?
Very well then I contradict myself,
(I am large, I contain multitudes.)" - Walt Whitman, "Song of Myself"
Jonathan Rex
Member
The world needs to come up with a Global code of ethics and way of living. Call it "The Peace Code"
Then practice your own mode of worship in the privacy of your own home and let God sort it all out when we die, if you believe in that concept of God.
Then practice your own mode of worship in the privacy of your own home and let God sort it all out when we die, if you believe in that concept of God.
Jonathan Rex
Member
Right, right.
I get frustrated with the mess that man has made of religion.
I'll try to chill it out.
I get frustrated with the mess that man has made of religion.
I'll try to chill it out.
Jonathan Rex
Member
Guitar's Cry said:
"Oh you shunned persons, I at least do not shun you,
I come forthwith in your midst, I will be your poet,
I will be more to you than any of the rest." - Native Moments (Whitman)
Jonathan Rex
Member
I'm used to agressive back and forth exchanges.
The point is, Jesus (Yeshua) was a man. He was a human being.
Mohammed was a man. He was a human being.
Buddha, Krishna, Lao Tzu . . . all of them were men.
They were wise men.
They were enlightened men.
But they were men.
If Mohammed was perfect then he wouldn't have married a nine year old.
If Jesus was perfect then he wouldn't have lost his temper in the temple and took a whip to people.
If Buddha was perfect, it wouldn't have taken him 9 years of nearly starving to death to realize that it wasn't beneficial.
Much of my tone is sarcasm, which does not carry through on a message board.
When I say, "As rediculous as that sounds" about the statues I'm being sardonic.
I don't necessarily mean it is rediculous. Talking to most people is no different than talking to a stone. The feedback is about the same. Praying to a statue is no different than praying to walls and calling it the house of God.
The point is, this: When you're constantly attacking another person, this is how it feels. The way I talked to you is how it feels to be them when you tell them that their religion is wrong and that they're committing shirk and going to hell. I don't remember the last time a Christian buried a woman up to her chest and threw rocks at her face until she died. It happened in the Middle East last week.
This nonsense needs to stop. There is no justification for it.
The point is, Jesus (Yeshua) was a man. He was a human being.
Mohammed was a man. He was a human being.
Buddha, Krishna, Lao Tzu . . . all of them were men.
They were wise men.
They were enlightened men.
But they were men.
If Mohammed was perfect then he wouldn't have married a nine year old.
If Jesus was perfect then he wouldn't have lost his temper in the temple and took a whip to people.
If Buddha was perfect, it wouldn't have taken him 9 years of nearly starving to death to realize that it wasn't beneficial.
Much of my tone is sarcasm, which does not carry through on a message board.
When I say, "As rediculous as that sounds" about the statues I'm being sardonic.
I don't necessarily mean it is rediculous. Talking to most people is no different than talking to a stone. The feedback is about the same. Praying to a statue is no different than praying to walls and calling it the house of God.
The point is, this: When you're constantly attacking another person, this is how it feels. The way I talked to you is how it feels to be them when you tell them that their religion is wrong and that they're committing shirk and going to hell. I don't remember the last time a Christian buried a woman up to her chest and threw rocks at her face until she died. It happened in the Middle East last week.
This nonsense needs to stop. There is no justification for it.
Jonathan Rex
Member
Sorry, this double posted.
Jonathan Rex said:
Actually............not all is shangri-la over in the Far East. In the one case alone with Buddhists in that region, schisms have occurred right and left due to political supports for one leader or the next. This is especially the case in the last decade or so in far east Russia, where one sect gained political power over others, and sad to say it was the Gelukpa tradition that I follow.
I always hesitate to paint the whole of Buddhism with such a lofty and saintly brush when we in the U.S. are usually quite ignorant of socio-political upheavals within the Buddhist community.
So, I could say the same thing about Christians quietly worshipping their Saviour and providing aid to the needy in places like...........oh..........Sri Lanka? You know, where those bad stupid Buddhists are attacking them right and left?
Please, to everyone who does it, stop elevating one religion over all others. That includes mine.
I thought this was a discussion forum, too. Might I suggest taking this into debate since it seemed that was where the OP clearly wanted to go?
Peace,
Mystic
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