Mother of God- Mater Dei- (the God of all Abrahamic religions)

[Estro Felino]

This thread is for analyzing this theological expression; I want to hear the opinions not only from Christians, but from whoever believes in the monotheistic God, so even Jews and Muslims.
This is the way we call Mary, mother of Jesus (given that Jesus is God, Mary is God's mother). A Dogma without which, I think,it is hard to define Christianity. A dogma that is present in Catholicism, Orthodoxy and Anglicanism.

Does this expression bother you? I mean...to know that God has a mother, and this mother is made of flesh. In this perspective God becomes equal to man...and it is impossible to say that God is superior to mankind. Given that Mary, represents the possibility for man to become as divine as God.

 

[te_lanus]

For me, Jesus ain't God. He's a demigod, like Hercules. Since he has a human mom and a god for a dad.

 

[paragon]

For me, Jesus ain't God, but I would love to see a well constructed cinematic scene with Jesus, Muhammad, Moses, Zoroaster, Thor, Buddha, and Achilles, in Super Smash Bros-style battle, competing in the fight to settle once and for all who the real mac daddy is.

In this perspective God becomes equal to man...and it is impossible to say that God is superior to mankind. Given that Mary, represents the possibility for man to become as divine as God.

I don't see how this is a threat to anything as Mary didn't "create" Jesus, she was merely chosen to give birth to him into this world.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it. John 1:1-5

And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began. John 17:5

Father, I want those you have given me to be with me where I am, and to see my glory, the glory you have given me because you loved me before the creation of the world.
John 17:24

 

[Pegg]

Does this expression bother you? I mean...to know that God has a mother, and this mother is made of flesh. In this perspective God becomes equal to man...and it is impossible to say that God is superior to mankind. Given that Mary, represents the possibility for man to become as divine as God.

i think its impossible that God has a mother... even Adam, the first man, didnt have a mother, yet we are expected to believe that God himself has a mother???

I dont think so. Besides, Mary was an imperfect woman, prone to sin and made the required sacrifices under the law for sins. So how could she really be Gods mother??

 

[Estro Felino]

i think its impossible that God has a mother... even Adam, the first man, didnt have a mother, yet we are expected to believe that God himself has a mother???

well...most Christians don't even believe that Adam ever existed...So...

I dont think so. Besides, Mary was an imperfect woman, prone to sin and made the required sacrifices under the law for sins. So how could she really be Gods mother??

well...that's the point. I do believe that Mary was sinless...but not because she was born that way. She used her free will and decided to stop sinning.
It is obvious that a perfect human being can incarnate God in her womb.

I don't know if you can read people's souls. I wish you could figure out how pure Mary's soul was. If you did, you would cry out of joy. It deals with immense and limitless love towards all mankind. If she could love that way, so can we

 

[Pegg]

well...most Christians don't even believe that Adam ever existed...So...

thats kind of surprising considering Jesus believed in Adam and Eve and even said that their marriage is the standard for all marriages.

But its understandable too... their is very little faith in Gods Word today. Thats unfortunate.

well...that's the point. I do believe that Mary was sinless...but not because she was born that way. She used her free will and decided to stop sinning.
It is obvious that a perfect human being can incarnate God in her womb.

When Adam sinned, God told him the consequences would be death.... sin leads us to death.

So my question is that if Mary was sinless, why did she die? Death is the result of sin and every person born from Adam is a sinner...the bible even says so:

1John 1:8 If we make the statement, “We have no sin,” we are misleading ourselves and the truth is not in us

Romans 3:23 For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God


ALL have sinned. It doesnt say " All except Mary have sinned"

Believe what the bible tells us... it is Gods Word of truth.

 

[Desert Snake]

Jesus=JHVH
Technically Mary is the mother 'G-d', however since Jesus is part human, and is worshipped in G-d form, /not the man form/, it is an expression that is 'iffy', though not completely wrong.

Peronally I would avoid the confusion, doesn't seem necessary.

 

[Desert Snake]

Jesus created the world and the heavens.
Mary is human.
Jesus/G-d through the Spirit incarnates as Jesus the man.
Jesus created Mary, in essence.
So, is Mary the mother of G-d?


Only in that Deific context.

 

[Estro Felino]

So my question is that if Mary was sinless, why did she die? Death is the result of sin and every person born from Adam is a sinner...the bible even says so:

actually we Catholics believe that Mary never died...given that she ascended into Heaven. So she has a physical body exactly as Jesus does right now.
But it doesn't really matter...given that I believe that original sin is an invention. An there is free will...so any person can decide to avoid sinning by using their own freewill.

By the way...to remain on topic...who do you think Mary is?
Would it be a tragedy to find out that she chose to incarnate God instead of being chosen?

 

[Pegg]

actually we Catholics believe that Mary never died...given that she ascended into Heaven. So she has a physical body exactly as Jesus does right now.
But it doesn't really matter...given that I believe that original sin is an invention. An there is free will...so any person can decide to avoid sinning by using their own freewill.

can you direct me to the scriptures which tell us about that ascension?

By the way...to remain on topic...who do you think Mary is?
Would it be a tragedy to find out that she chose to incarnate God instead of being chosen?

I think Mary was the daughter of Heli, a jewish priest of the tribe of Levi, as the bible says. And the bible writers view her as a normal woman:

Galatians 4:4 But when the full limit of the time arrived, God sent his Son, who was born of a woman and who was under law

 

[Thana]

This thread is for analyzing this theological expression; I want to hear the opinions not only from Christians, but from whoever believes in the monotheistic God, so even Jews and Muslims.
This is the way we call Mary, mother of Jesus (given that Jesus is God, Mary is God's mother). A Dogma without which, I think,it is hard to define Christianity. A dogma that is present in Catholicism, Orthodoxy and Anglicanism.

Does this expression bother you? I mean...to know that God has a mother, and this mother is made of flesh. In this perspective God becomes equal to man...and it is impossible to say that God is superior to mankind. Given that Mary, represents the possibility for man to become as divine as God.

Mary is about as special as anyone else. She birthed Jesus, yes, But that wasn't because of her or because she even wanted too. It was a part of God's plan, It was His will alone and if anyone deserves worshipping for it then it'd be Him.

Putting too much importance and significance on Mary distracts you from the importance and significance of Jesus.

Honestly, I have never been able to understand the Catholics obsession with a woman barely mentioned in the Bible, But I digress.

 

[Estro Felino]

Mary is about as special as anyone else. She birthed Jesus, yes, But that wasn't because of her or because she even wanted too. It was a part of God's plan, It was His will alone and if anyone deserves worshipping for it then it'd be Him.

as I strongly believe in free will, it is very difficult for me to believe that a human being can be chosen. God has never chosen anyone. So Mary used her own free will when she decided to love all mankind. I don't know how it happened...but Love became flesh. But of course her love was a merit of hers, not God's.

Putting too much importance and significance on Mary distracts you from the importance and significance of Jesus.

I totally agree with you. That's why I always say to Catholics not to believe in Mary as a deity. A female deity has never existed. And God is neither a male, nor a female deity. Mary was a woman, and she was as human as you and me.

Honestly, I have never been able to understand the Catholics obsession with a woman barely mentioned in the Bible, But I digress.

well..it is very simple. we believe that she is an example for us. All saints are examples; but it is absolutely wrong to worship them as deities. Saints are just proof that any of us can become pure and sinless

by the way....nice questions: I hope other people join this debate. And I do respect all the people's standpoints because I don't possess the absolute truth

 

[Pegg]

as I strongly believe in free will, it is very difficult for me to believe that a human being can be chosen. God has never chosen anyone. So Mary used her own free will when she decided to love all mankind. I don't know how it happened...but Love became flesh. But of course her love was a merit of hers, not God's.

didnt' he choose Moses to speak to Pharoah? And then he chose Aaron to be the high priest.
He also chose Joshua to be the successor of Moses. He chose the first king of Isreal, Saul. He chose prophets to deliver a message...even when they didnt really want to, such as Jonah.

What makes you say he doesnt choose people for certain things?

 

[Estro Felino]

What makes you say he doesnt choose people for certain things?

well...because we are all equal in his eyes. so he doesn't love saints more than the worst of the criminals. he loves everyone.

but given that we have free will, there are people who love and people who hate. so...the people who have deliberately decided to hate, kill God in their hearts.
And God has nothing to do with that.
so therefore, in history I am not able to see God's choices. Only men's choices.

 

[te_lanus]

A female deity has never existed. And God is neither a male, nor a female deity.

Up to the exile God had a wife. And in early christian thougjt the Holy Spirit was seen as a woman

 

[paragon]

Jesus created the world and the heavens.
Mary is human.
Jesus/G-d through the Spirit incarnates as Jesus the man.
Jesus created Mary, in essence.
So, is Mary the mother of G-d?


Only in that Deific context.

Dear Lord, Jesus is asexual!

 

[Pegg]

well...because we are all equal in his eyes. so he doesn't love saints more than the worst of the criminals. he loves everyone.

but given that we have free will, there are people who love and people who hate. so...the people who have deliberately decided to hate, kill God in their hearts.
And God has nothing to do with that.
so therefore, in history I am not able to see God's choices. Only men's choices.

If you read the bible, you will see how God has dealt with mankind and how he has blessed some for making the right choices in life. And how he has chosen people for special tasks and to represent him before others.

Its a shame the catholic church dont encourage bible reading... you will learn a lot about God by doing so.

 

[Estro Felino]

If you read the bible, you will see how God has dealt with mankind and how he has blessed some for making the right choices in life. And how he has chosen people for special tasks and to represent him before others.

I do read the Bible. But I know that it was written by men...and you mustn't take it literally. The Genesis is a allegorical tale which tries to explain the meaning of life and the purpose of our existence.

Its a shame the catholic church don't encourage bible reading... you will learn a lot about God by doing so.

Of course it does. But as I said...the Bible is an instrument that help us understand that God is love.

 

[ShivaFan]

I feel sort of sad that I cannot reply to your interesting post, since I am a Hindu and not a Christian, Muslim or a monotheist like branches of some Hinduism such as ISKCON. Since, regardless of the reasons or the arguments back and forth about whether the Ultimate One can have a Mother or not (of course there is a Mother! Even the Ultimate cannot resist home cooking!), there is no doubt to me whatever Halo or "Angel" or force etc. that is obviously very real in some of those Eastern Orthodox or Catholic devotions to the Mother Goddess, it is real power.

 

[Estro Felino]

I feel sort of sad that I cannot reply to your interesting post,

of course you can.