Wombat
Active Member
Its a disembodied Virtual Realm, you visit my home via the Net, I cannot display hospitality, I cannot offer you a chair or a beverage. There are no big end moral/ethical considerations here, no physicality...if you're drowning I cant ponder wether or not to jump in to save you...if I offend you, you can't hit me.
So, what can I do at the low end of morality- manners and courtesy, in the light of the awareness that they are culturally determined?
And at what points do our sense of manners/courtesy coincide...........or culturally collide?
Forum manners/courtesy as I understand them (interested in hearing your thoughts)-
1/ Seeking to be heard and understood employ active and reflective listening in the form of pertinent questions to ensure the other is heard and understood. Seek to elicit elaboration and explanation of the others points/pov.
2/ Seek to identify the others core points, issues, intent and questions and respond to them as honestly and directly as possible. Avoid evasiveness, obfuscation, Straw Men, misrepresentation, falsification and Add Hom in the stead of dialogue/discussion.
3/ Play the points/issues not the individual...argue against or attack the integrity of the idea expressed not the integrity of the individual expressing it. If you feel the need to do a victory dance do it at the conclusion of the discussion over the grave of the others deceased pov...not at the inception/middle of discussion over anothers character.
4/ If youre going to put a pov/beliefs out there in a public forum- expect them to be questioned and challenged...sometimes vigorously. While you may find questions directed at your expressed pov/beliefs to be challenging or confronting this does not mean the questioner is challenging or being rude to you as a person.
5/ This is a disembodied Virtual Realm. One of the few things you can give to the other is a straight pertinent answer to a straight pertinent question. There can be a number of dynamics at play in refusing to respond to a pertinent question, among them- Withholding empowerment- You want something (an answer) from me? Well Im not going to give it to you. Thus the withholder is empowered and in control (even at the expense of credibility as pov goes down the tube)...or...Withholding as Ad Hom- simply F$#% you! You dont deserve an answer...and I cant/wont even say why.
(I am referring here to circumstances in which discussion has already been entered into...not to the legitimate option of declining to respond to a post you are not interested in or dont have time for)
As I said at the outset, conceptions and perceptions of manners/courtesy are culturally determined...so too are notions of insult, rudeness, bad manners, discourteousness.
In Australia swearing at someone can be an attempt to insult them...but, strangely enough, swearing at someone is just as often (if not more often) a display of affection/mateship. Quite often the most (apparently) abusive and profane language is employed to demonstrate-We are mates, we can say absolutely anything to or about each other and not get upset.
Given this cultural context and conditioning there are no insults/ad homs or personalised jibes that are going to offend me.....but....
The Australian Indigenous population had a longstanding tradition that the most insulting act you could perform towards another human being was to consciously and deliberately turn your back on them, to not see or hear them...it was a signal that the other had done something so embarrassing, offensive and shameful to the community that they- ceased to exist in the eyes of the tribe. This approach has permeated much of mainstream Australian culture and a key/core component of the rare extreem of backturning is explaining >exactly why< you are turning your back prior to doing so.
In the context of online Forum discussions such as these that means you have licence to employ any ad hom you deem appropriate in my direction ...but if you make a statement/knowledge claim and are asked a question regarding it then respond without answering the question (repeat pattern) and/or take offence at something I have said but cant/wont explain what it is...I am likely to conclude that the turning of the back signals- F$%# you...You have ceased to exist.
From my cultural perspective to be engaged in discussion and having pertinent questions repeatedly ignored (especially those questions seeking understanding and elaboration of the others pov)...well, that's about as bad mannered, rude, inconciderate and nasty as it can get.
Perhaps....at the low end of the 'moral issue' considerations there is manners and courtesy dependent on mutual understanding........
and reflecting therein something inherently and vitally spiritual?
So, what can I do at the low end of morality- manners and courtesy, in the light of the awareness that they are culturally determined?
And at what points do our sense of manners/courtesy coincide...........or culturally collide?
Forum manners/courtesy as I understand them (interested in hearing your thoughts)-
1/ Seeking to be heard and understood employ active and reflective listening in the form of pertinent questions to ensure the other is heard and understood. Seek to elicit elaboration and explanation of the others points/pov.
2/ Seek to identify the others core points, issues, intent and questions and respond to them as honestly and directly as possible. Avoid evasiveness, obfuscation, Straw Men, misrepresentation, falsification and Add Hom in the stead of dialogue/discussion.
3/ Play the points/issues not the individual...argue against or attack the integrity of the idea expressed not the integrity of the individual expressing it. If you feel the need to do a victory dance do it at the conclusion of the discussion over the grave of the others deceased pov...not at the inception/middle of discussion over anothers character.
4/ If youre going to put a pov/beliefs out there in a public forum- expect them to be questioned and challenged...sometimes vigorously. While you may find questions directed at your expressed pov/beliefs to be challenging or confronting this does not mean the questioner is challenging or being rude to you as a person.
5/ This is a disembodied Virtual Realm. One of the few things you can give to the other is a straight pertinent answer to a straight pertinent question. There can be a number of dynamics at play in refusing to respond to a pertinent question, among them- Withholding empowerment- You want something (an answer) from me? Well Im not going to give it to you. Thus the withholder is empowered and in control (even at the expense of credibility as pov goes down the tube)...or...Withholding as Ad Hom- simply F$#% you! You dont deserve an answer...and I cant/wont even say why.
(I am referring here to circumstances in which discussion has already been entered into...not to the legitimate option of declining to respond to a post you are not interested in or dont have time for)
As I said at the outset, conceptions and perceptions of manners/courtesy are culturally determined...so too are notions of insult, rudeness, bad manners, discourteousness.
In Australia swearing at someone can be an attempt to insult them...but, strangely enough, swearing at someone is just as often (if not more often) a display of affection/mateship. Quite often the most (apparently) abusive and profane language is employed to demonstrate-We are mates, we can say absolutely anything to or about each other and not get upset.
Given this cultural context and conditioning there are no insults/ad homs or personalised jibes that are going to offend me.....but....
The Australian Indigenous population had a longstanding tradition that the most insulting act you could perform towards another human being was to consciously and deliberately turn your back on them, to not see or hear them...it was a signal that the other had done something so embarrassing, offensive and shameful to the community that they- ceased to exist in the eyes of the tribe. This approach has permeated much of mainstream Australian culture and a key/core component of the rare extreem of backturning is explaining >exactly why< you are turning your back prior to doing so.
In the context of online Forum discussions such as these that means you have licence to employ any ad hom you deem appropriate in my direction ...but if you make a statement/knowledge claim and are asked a question regarding it then respond without answering the question (repeat pattern) and/or take offence at something I have said but cant/wont explain what it is...I am likely to conclude that the turning of the back signals- F$%# you...You have ceased to exist.
From my cultural perspective to be engaged in discussion and having pertinent questions repeatedly ignored (especially those questions seeking understanding and elaboration of the others pov)...well, that's about as bad mannered, rude, inconciderate and nasty as it can get.
Perhaps....at the low end of the 'moral issue' considerations there is manners and courtesy dependent on mutual understanding........
and reflecting therein something inherently and vitally spiritual?