Luciferianism

[ArcaÐios]

Luciferianism is the belief that Lucifer is more of a Messiah than Jesus. The religion is also connected to the following, both literal and figurative, of Cain, the being believed to be the son of the serpent, Lucifer, and Eve. Luciferians don't seek help from Lucifer from their problems, but rather follow in his path in order to get what they need. It's a more worldly and carnal faith and is considered LHP because it strays from God and the reliance on the Godhead.

Lucifer comes from the Latin words "lux ferre," which means "light bearer." They believe that by leading Adam and Eve into sin, Lucifer brought humans to the light and turned us into free-thinking beings, in stead of autonomous garden-keepers.

Associating Luciferianism with LeVayan Satanism would be a horribly wrong assumption. Most Luciferians see Lucifer and the Devil, Satan, as being two separate beings. Furthermore, the realm of Heaven is seen as being God's, and Hell is Satan's, but Earth belongs to Lucifer.

Am I Luciferian? No. Thus, I may need Ðanisty's help in clarifications and whatnot, but I think I pretty much got the jist of it.

 

[kreeden]

Thank you ArcaDois . If you do have the jist of it , you have answered a couple of my questions .

 

[Ðanisty]

ArcaÐios does have jist of it. Out of curiosity, what were your questions and do you have any more? I mentioned this forum to him and he decided to post this because he noticed the LHP sub-forum was kind of dead. I hope he sticks around. He's a great guy.

 

[kreeden]

I posted a couple of questions here ... http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/satanism/25903-i-have-questions-2.html#post357963

Basically , I was talking to a friend about Satanism , and realized that I knew nothing about it , other then the Satanic Bible's version , and what Hollywood would have us believe . Oh , and a few cases out of history , in which case just about anything that wasn't Christian was Satanism ...

Another question , and I mean no offense in asking , but would it be fair to assume that Luciferianism evolved out of Christianity ? It seems as if the ideas of Heaven and Hell are about the same ? If not , why ?

 

[Ðanisty]

I'm sorry, I completely missed your response to that other thread. I thought I was checking this subforum regularly, but that one got by me...probably because I was in the process of quitting my job and wasn't looking closely enough. For simplicity, I'll copy the questions into this thread.

I'm confused by everyone saying that Satan and Lucifer are not the same entity as the Christain version , however so many talk of the " Fall " as if they are the same ? Why is that?

Different people see Lucifer differently, just as different people see God differently. Some prefer to see him as a Roman god, some prefer to see him as a Sumerian god, and I've even known some to prefer him as Eblis (sp?) which apparently is what the Muslims call him (the serpent in the garden, that is). Some see Lucifer as an angel and even then we don't all necessarily agree on his appearance, etc. For every Luciferian out there, there is a unique idea on who he is. This doesn't bother me any more than it should bother Christians that their God is seen differently by everyone who has experienced him. I believe Lucifer presents himself in ways that would be most accepted/understood/appealing, so it is no wonder we all see him differently. As a teacher, he has to approach his students in whatever manner they are open to. For me, Lucifer is the fallen angel.

Generally, when people say that he is not the same as the Christian version, they mean that Christians don't perceive him in the same way we do. I don't question the actions that took place in the bible...I simply see them differently. From my perspective, Lucifer is the hero. He saved us from ignorance in spite of the punishment he knew he'd receive from God...think Promethius of Greek mythology.

And my second question is on the concept of Lucifer being " Light ". The way I understand LeVey's views is that Satan empowers a worshipper . Is the reference to " Light " meant in the same way ? An empowering enlightment ?

Light is enlightenment. It's awareness, knowledge, gnosis, hope, etc.

Another question , and I mean no offense in asking , but would it be fair to assume that Luciferianism evolved out of Christianity ? It seems as if the ideas of Heaven and Hell are about the same ? If not , why ?

For some, it is parallel to Christianity. My understanding of Lucifer is from Christianity, but like I said already, some see him completely differently. We don't all reach our destination from the same place. Does that make sense? In other words, several paths come together at some point and put us on the road to enlightenment through Lucifer.

 

[kreeden]

No problem . Posts can get lost quite easily the way this forum shifts around .

I believe that I understand . It is as if Lucifer is the personification of the Tree of Knowledge ? Or at least , the One that guides you to the Tree ?

So , if you believe in Heaven and Hell , what do you look forward to for an afterlife ? Continued life here on Earth ? Or do you concern yourself about an afterlife ?

Do Luciferians see theirselves as being neutral in the " battle " between good and evil ? Or does the " Fallen Angel " return to the flock as Promethius did ?

Hmmm ? I guess that I reason that at some point Luciferianism has to leave the Christian concept of what the Bible says and strike out on it's own . I'm just wondering where that point lays .

 

[Ðanisty]

It is as if Lucifer is the personification of the Tree of Knowledge ? Or at least , the One that guides you to the Tree ?

As the serpent, Lucifer opened our eyes and gave us abilities beyond what God wanted. Luciferians are greatful for this. We see Eden as a prison, more or less...a place where man was kept.

So , if you believe in Heaven and Hell , what do you look forward to for an afterlife ? Continued life here on Earth ? Or do you concern yourself about an afterlife ?

I really don't concern myself with an afterlife. I know that none of us can know what's out there until we die, so I see no point really in worrying about it.

Do Luciferians see theirselves as being neutral in the " battle " between good and evil ? Or does the " Fallen Angel " return to the flock as Promethius did ?

Returning to the flock is kind of an odd way to put it. He managed to manipulate Zeus into freeing him and was accepted back, but he wore a wreath on his head to claim victory over the gods despite his sin...seems kind of mocking to me. *shrug*

Hmmm ? I guess that I reason that at some point Luciferianism has to leave the Christian concept of what the Bible says and strike out on it's own . I'm just wondering where that point lays .

Well, to be frank, there's not a lot in the bible about Lucifer. There's plenty of relevent material about God (he did plenty of aweful things to man), but Lucifer's story is fairly brief. Lucifer's victory was a fairly silent one. He set things in motion and took a backseat. Think of all that would not have happened though if Adam and Eve had never left the garden. We owe pretty much our entire history to Lucifer. Yes, we had to suffer, but by suffering we became strong. Nothing worth a damn is easy anyway.

 

[kevmicsmi]

Well, to be frank, there's not a lot in the bible about Lucifer. There's plenty of relevent material about God (he did plenty of aweful things to man), but Lucifer's story is fairly brief. Lucifer's victory was a fairly silent one. He set things in motion and took a backseat. Think of all that would not have happened though if Adam and Eve had never left the garden. We owe pretty much our entire history to Lucifer. Yes, we had to suffer, but by suffering we became strong. Nothing worth a damn is easy anyway.

couldnt it be argued that giving in to the temptation to take the fruit was easier than obeying God?

Danisty, since you believe in Adam and Eve, I m guessing you believe in the Biblical timeline of the earth, and how it was created, or am I wrong?

 

[Ðanisty]

couldnt it be argued that giving in to the temptation to take the fruit was easier than obeying God?

It could be argued that way, but I would disagree. It's always easier to do what your parents say, but much riskier and harder to go out and learn things on your own. Is it easier to say, "no, I won't do that"? Maybe, but it's much harder to actually go out there and make things happen for yourself. It's also widely regarded as more rewarding.

Danisty, since you believe in Adam and Eve, I m guessing you believe in the Biblical timeline of the earth, and how it was created, or am I wrong?

I don't believe in the timeline literally, if that's what you mean. Most Christians I've met also don't believe in it that literally. We have historical and scientific evidence which indicates otherwise. I'm not worried about reconciling that either. I believe what I believe...that the story in the bible happened, but not necessarily in the way it was written. I certainly don't regard myself or any human important enough to God for him to give us all the information. He is not beyond deception.

You also have to understand that the bible was written by Jews and Christians...not Luciferians and Satanists. If it were written by us, many things would not have been left out and many more things would have been added. I can't say for certain what those things are because history has done a very good job of erasing them, but it's only common sense to acknowledge that different people would have found importance in different stories.

 

[kreeden]

I'm afraid that I only know the basics of Promethius' story , but didn't Hercules have something to do with his release ? Oh well . That wasn't really what I was wondering about .

One last note about Promethius though . By using him as an excample , you greatly helped me understand your views .

I don't concern myself much about an afterlife neither . I agree with you on that point . And on the point that different people would have a different perspectives on any story . For excample , what you call Lucifer sounds very much like what I call Nature . { ok , there would naturally be differences , but the two sound quite close } .

And you are correct . Most of what we have been talking about , and I have been refering to as Christian , actually predates Christ . I was just keeping it simple ... for my sake . I just find it interesting that you hold to the Judaic creation . But I think that I can understand that as well . I just need some time to allow the concepts to settle .

I also find what you say about taking charge of your own life interesting . You don't appear to be the hard core rebel most Satanist like to appear as . Not that there is anything wrong with being a rebel . It is just that I don't think that everything in life needs to be a battle . { actually I usually see life more as a game ... yes , sometimes it is a game of power ... }

So , Lucifer set things in motion , and then took a backseat ... I like that . It shows confidence , nothing to prove . And unlike Promethius , Lucifer wasn't even the creator of man , so he acted without pride , only doing what he felt was right ?

I don't think that I could explain Luciferianism to another , but I do think that I have a better understanding of it ? Perhaps not ? But I do believe that Free Will is the greatest gift we have , and that it should be celebrated .

 

[Ðanisty]

I'm afraid that I only know the basics of Promethius' story , but didn't Hercules have something to do with his release ? Oh well . That wasn't really what I was wondering about .

Yes, he was rescued by Hercules who, ironically, is Zeus's son.

One last note about Promethius though . By using him as an excample , you greatly helped me understand your views .

I'm glad it helped. It's not exactly the same story, but the motivations and intentions are the same.

I don't concern myself much about an afterlife neither . I agree with you on that point . And on the point that different people would have a different perspectives on any story . For excample , what you call Lucifer sounds very much like what I call Nature . { ok , there would naturally be differences , but the two sound quite close } .

It's quite possible. I know some Wiccans that practice what they call Luciferian Witchcraft.

And you are correct . Most of what we have been talking about , and I have been refering to as Christian , actually predates Christ . I was just keeping it simple ... for my sake . I just find it interesting that you hold to the Judaic creation . But I think that I can understand that as well . I just need some time to allow the concepts to settle .

That is why it is a faith.

I also find what you say about taking charge of your own life interesting . You don't appear to be the hard core rebel most Satanist like to appear as . Not that there is anything wrong with being a rebel . It is just that I don't think that everything in life needs to be a battle . { actually I usually see life more as a game ... yes , sometimes it is a game of power ... }

Well, that is one of the reasons I left The Church of Satan. First and foremost, I realized that I'm not an atheist. Second, I realized that Satan is not the entity I want to follow. Sure, rebellion is useful, but rebelling just for the sake of rebelling is absolutely useless...a total waste of time and energy with nothing to show for it. This is why we find it important to differentiate between Satan and Lucifer. There's nothing wrong with Satan, but he represents more of the carnal, rebellious, angsty side of humanity whereas Lucifer represents the more intellectual side.

So , Lucifer set things in motion , and then took a backseat ... I like that . It shows confidence , nothing to prove . And unlike Promethius , Lucifer wasn't even the creator of man , so he acted without pride , only doing what he felt was right ?

Exactly! He did what was honorable simply because it was the right thing to do.

I don't think that I could explain Luciferianism to another , but I do think that I have a better understanding of it ? Perhaps not ? But I do believe that Free Will is the greatest gift we have , and that it should be celebrated .

I think you're grasping it pretty well. If ever have more questions, just ask.

 

[Revasser]

This thread's been really informative! Thanks, Ðanisty! I've really enjoyed it. If I didn't have to spread karma around, I'd immediately frubal you.

 

[kreeden]

Will do . Thank you for your time .

 

[seraphimoflucifer]

Ðanisty you have a brilliant mind

 

[David69]

I am the incarnation...

Arca...

Luciferianism is the belief that Lucifer is more of a Messiah than Jesus.

hmmm, yes but maybe Jesus is part of Lucifer as Lucifers Angel and Jesus Angel are the same IMHO just different aspects.
maybe anti christ before he realised the real self!!!

I am me, three three three!