Koans

[Bishka]

Does anybody have some good koans for me? OR a book that has some? I've recently come across them and fell in love with the idea.

Thanks!

 

[Engyo]

Hmmmmm, koans aren't a teaching tool in my particular tradition but they can be fun. I will look around.

 

[kai]

beckysoup what is a koan?

 

[Engyo]

beckysoup what is a koan?

Kai -

If I may, a koan is a sort of teaching riddle. they often don't seem to make sense at first, and must be pondered; eventually one gains the sense of what message the Koan is trying to impart. Certain koans have entered popular culture, as in "What is the sound of one hand clapping?" They can range from fairly simple to wildly improbable, but the aim is always to prompt the student to some awakening.

 

[kai]

thank you Engyo i have never heard of them before.

 

[michel]

Does anybody have some good koans for me? OR a book that has some? I've recently come across them and fell in love with the idea.

Thanks!

Try http://www.chinapage.com/zen/koan1.html

http://www.nozen.com/koans.htm

http://www.ibiblio.org/zen/cgi-bin/koan-index.pl

 

[Jaymes]

If it's okay for me to butt in, I have a couple of questions about koans.

Do all koans have an answer? Do they only have one answer? Can the answers always be vocalized/expressed?

 

[Smoke]

Does anybody have some good koans for me? OR a book that has some? I've recently come across them and fell in love with the idea.

You might enjoy Dropping Ashes on the Buddha, by Seung Sahn. It's not made up entirely of koans -- being Korean, Seung Sahn said kong-an -- but it has a few, and addresses that way of teaching. It's one of my favorites.

 

[Smoke]

Do all koans have an answer? Do they only have one answer? Can the answers always be vocalized/expressed?

A koan isn't always a question, and when it is, it doesn't have one definitive answer; whether the answer is appropriate or not is up to the discernment of the teacher. The point is spiritual insight, and not rational discourse.

Some examples:

Ikkyu, the Zen master, was very clever even as a boy. His teacher had a precious teacup, a rare antique. Ikkyu happened to break this cup and was greatly perplexed. Hearing the footsteps of his teacher, he held the pieces of the cup behind him. When the master appeared, Ikkyu asked: "Why do people have to die?"

"This is natural," explained the older man. "Everything has to die and has just so long to live."

Ikkyu, producing the shattered cup, added: "It was time for your cup to die."

* * * * * * * *

Two traveling monks reached a river where they met a young woman. Wary of the current, she asked if they could carry her across. One of the monks hesitated, but the other quickly picked her up onto his shoulders, transported her across the water, and put her down on the other bank. She thanked him and departed.

As the monks continued on their way, the one was brooding and preoccupied. Unable to hold his silence, he spoke out. "Brother, our spiritual training teaches us to avoid any contact with women, but you picked that one up on your shoulders and carried her!"

"Brother," the second monk replied, "I set her down on the other side, while you are still carrying her."

​

Cecil Adams gives an example of a "correct" answer to the question type of koan, the well-known "What is the sound of one hand clapping?"

Unsophisticated persons are generally inclined to answer with something like "half a clap," which signifies that they have not yet achieved Buddha nature. After several years of dedicated meditating, however, they learn the correct response, which is to face the questioner, assume an appropriate Buddhist posture, and without a word thrust one hand forward.
​

Of course, if you learn this by reading Cecil Adams, it hasn't done you any good.

​

 

[kai]

ok i have checked out some of the links and i see more arrows from the quiver of confusion, what is a koan supposed to be? is it some kind of esoteric riddle to confuse the mundane? why did i poke my nose into beckysoups thread ,i will get no sleep tonight trying to decypher koan after koan

 

[Bishka]

I actually bought a book of koans last night, can't remember the full title, but it had something about 100 koans - and flute in it. It came highly recommend, so I'm excited! Should be coming soon!

 

[MysticSang'ha]

That's great, Becky! Happy reading! :hug:




By the way, how I interpret the sound of one hand clapping is that it is the same sound as the universe, the same sound as our mind, the same sound as a flower's blooming, and so on.............so all I do is smile when I think of that koan, which is one of my favorites. It was the very first I'd ever heard and so introduced me to the art.




Peace,
Mystic

 

[Silicon Hero]

A Koan is a really hard riddle no? Am I right on that?

 

[Bishka]

A Koan is a really hard riddle no? Am I right on that?

Depends who you talk to.

To me (not a Buddhist, but a practioner of some aspects of Zen Buddhism), I don't think it is a riddle, to me it's more of a question that can never me answered except to the person who is answering it.

My answer is my answer and I couldn't give it, because it would not be your answer.

 

[Scarlett Wampus]

What is this mind? Who is hearing these sounds? Do not mistake any state for self-realization, but continue to ask yourself even more intensely, what is it that hears?
- Bassui

To me the above shows what Koan work is about: deconditioning through deep enquiry.

 

[Smoke]

Depends who you talk to.

To me (not a Buddhist, but a practioner of some aspects of Zen Buddhism), I don't think it is a riddle, to me it's more of a question that can never me answered except to the person who is answering it.

For example, my answer is my answer and I couldn't give it, because it would not be your answer.

That's the best concise explanation I have ever read. Well done! :clap2:

(I have no frubals to give at the moment, but I'll try to remember to come back.)

 

[Bishka]

That's the best concise explanation I have ever read. Well done! :clap2:

(I have no frubals to give at the moment, but I'll try to remember to come back.)

Thanks.

My Zen Shorts ( a children's Zen book) came today! It's very well done!

 

[koan]

The idea of the Koan is to manyfold. 1. to cut the mind off from general thought ( e.g.don't think about it, just do it ) 2. to be a concentraion for meditation. 3. to breakthrough false logic so as to reach enlightenment.