Is The thought as bad as the deed?

[Majikthise]

Thinking that a bad thought is as bad as an action is a good way to go crazy, IMO.

Truth.

 

[Scuba Pete]

I've been accused of worse!

 

[Lycan]

I would say that bad thoughts are the beginning of EVERY bad action.

But a bad action is not at the end of EVERY bad thought. So I don't think it is the "thought" itself that causes the action, but a combination of several things like the amount of self control you possess, your mental stability, conscience, the context of the thought, etc.

 

[michel]

Thanks for your input, guys; guess theres a lot there for me to digest.
Eat on Michel!!!!

 

[john5746]

I think they are equally important because they both cause suffering.

I disagree - thinking about killing someone is nothing like doing it.

Never? I would say that bad thoughts are the beginning of EVERY bad action. Also, why is being an angry person not a seen as "bad" if it does not harm another person, when we all agree it harms the person who is angry?

Notice the word if. IF the thought doesn't result in an action, which is the case for most thoughts. Also, I never said a bad thought or an angry person was OK, just better than harming another person.

 

[Green Gaia]

I disagree - thinking about killing someone is nothing like doing it.

To the person who may or may not be killed, but the person having the bad thoughts is still harmed.

Notice the word if. IF the thought doesn't result in an action, which is the case for most thoughts. Also, I never said a bad thought or an angry person was OK, just better than harming another person.

From the point of view of society, I would agree. But bad thoughts harm, even if no action is involved. That's the point I'm trying to make.

 

[retrorich]

Is The thought as bad as the deed?

Absolutely not.

You may fantasize about killing someone. But if you refrain from doing so, that person is allowed to go on living.

You may not be able to stop yourself from having adulterous sexual thoughts about a friend's wife. But if do not put those thoughts into action, no one is hurt.

 

[michel]

Is The thought as bad as the deed?

Absolutely not.

You may fantasize about killing someone. But if you refrain from doing so, that person is allowed to go on living.

You may not be able to stop yourself from having adulterous sexual thoughts about a friend's wife. But if do not put those thoughts into action, no one is hurt.

But you see Rich, that unfortunately doesn't 'work' for me - If I have such a thought, I hurt, from the 'guilt trip'

 

[Sunstone]

As long as you fight a thought, it keeps coming back, strong as ever.

 

[retrorich]

But you see Rich, that unfortunately doesn't 'work' for me - If I have such a thought, I hurt, from the 'guilt trip'

If you think "improper" thoughts, but don't put them into action, you have no reason to feel guilty. We cannot control our thoughts. We can (hopefully) control our actions.

 

[Green Gaia]

We cannot control our thoughts.

What? Of course we can control our thoughts! It is the second factor of the Noble Eightfold Path which is called Right Thought, sometimes translated as Right Intention. In it the Buddha advises us to rid our minds of three things - lust, ill-will and cruelty. If we don't - and we allow one, both or all of them to invade our minds - then it will only lead to dissatisfaction and suffering.

The Buddha taught that we should protect ourselves from thoughts of ill-will. There are two reasons for this. Ill-will can lead to the suffering of others but it also leads to our own suffering. There are very few of us who have not harbored thoughts of ill-will at some time. Often such thoughts stem from a feeling that someone has hurt us or someone we care for, and our knee-jerk reaction is to desire revenge. Ill-will, however, is like a cankerous worm that eats away at one's insides and destroys all peace of mind. To have thoughts of ill-will is to be unhappy.

The only way we can really find happy states of mind is when our mindset is one of loving-kindness. To be permeated with this feeling means that it is impossible to hate - even those who do us harm. Its not surprising that loving-kindness is something that the Buddha frequently urged his followers to develop.

 

[Scuba Pete]

We cannot control our thoughts.

I have to agree with Maize but for different reasons. We have two lions living inside of us: Good and Evil. The one you feed will get stronger. Then it can always overpower the other one.

Romans 7:14 We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it. 21 So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God's law; 23 but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. 24 What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? 25 Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God's law, but in the sinful nature a slave to the law of sin.

Feed your spirtual nature by doing this..

Philippians 4:8 Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable--if anything is excellent or praiseworthy--think about such things. 9 Whatever you have learned or received or heard from me, or seen in me--put it into practice. And the God of peace will be with you.

 

[anders]

Thoughts harm no one. Not even the thinker, if (s)he realizes that having a bad thought and resisting any evil impulses that might develop from it rather proves that the thinker is the master, not the thoughts. It might even be beneficial to a person's spiritual growth to have bad thoughts, analyze them and find out that they are wrong. In that way, the person in question will be prepared for situations in which such thoughts might occur, and will not act according to them.

 

[retrorich]

What? Of course we can control our thoughts!

Oh really? Then I challenge you to NOT think about an elephant for the next five seconds.

 

[cfer]

I would say the thought is not bad in and of itself. I have many thoughts pop into my head on a daily basis, good and bad. I don't have any control of what pops into my head. I DO have control over how long I think/dwell on those thoughts, though, and usually the longer I dwell on a bad thought, the more it consumes me, sometimes to the point of actually acting on the bad thought.

So I see it as just having the thought isn't bad, but dwelling on it is.

So no, the thought itself is never as bad as the deed itself. But the longer you dwell on the thought, the more dangerous it becomes, to the point of becoming AS dangerous as the deed.

 

[No*s]

Oh really? Then I challenge you to NOT think about an elephant for the next five seconds.

You know...this is the first time I ever read a challenge like that without thinking about the beast in question. I'm not sure that's a good thing either lol.

 

[Sunstone]

I think negative thoughts do more harm when we struggle with them, fight them, rather than just let them go.

 

[Druidus]

It is the mark of an intelligent man to be able to think a thought, and yet not agree with it. To be able to see things, indeed, even act them out in your head, and yet, not ever do them in reality, is a virtue. Think what you want, your mind is your sanctuary. Not even my Deities, or the Source, can take that away from me, even if they wanted. Unless, of course, you view the world with a different philosophy, which states that the only reason we exist is because God imagines us, and that whatever we imagine is real as well, albeit in a different world. Then, if you thought something wrong, you would feel it had actually happened. Although I don't believe it, that is an interesting philosophy, in that we are all Gods, existing within the short imagination of another God.

 

[cfer]

I think negative thoughts do more harm when we struggle with them, fight them, rather than just let them go.

Exactly! As humans we are going to have negative thoughts. It's part of our nature. It's best to just let them run their course and then be done with them. Most of the time they die out as quickly as they came up. The more you dwell on them, the more you struggle with them. Just let them happen, move on and forget 'em.

 

[Scuba Pete]

You can only beat that challenge by filling your mind with something else... like IPUs.

Struggle with them! Don't let them rule you. Feed your good thoughts so they can grow. Simply allowing your bad thoughts to continue unabated is foolish and will lead to agony.