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Is the recent Trump impeachment the most politically motivated ever?

Discussion in 'North American Politics' started by whirlingmerc, Jan 26, 2020.

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  1. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

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    No specific laws listed as broken. Previous impeachments listed specific laws.
    Divided along party lines. No previous impeachment was like that.
     
  2. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    Incorrect, previous impeachments were for even such things as "drunkenness". For the President the standards is "high crimes and misdemeanors". If you try to interpret that literally you will get the wrong answer.

    This is an excellent article to read:

    The Common Misconception About ‘High Crimes and Misdemeanors’

    "But this is not, in fact, what the Constitution requires. “High crimes and misdemeanors” is not, and has never been, limited to indictable criminality. Nonetheless, despite centuries of learning on the point, there the phrase sits, begging to be taken at its delusory face value.

    Accordingly, in nearly every significant American impeachment since 1788, the defenders of the impeached official—whether president, judge, senator, or Cabinet officer—have argued that their man can’t properly be removed, because what he did wasn’t actually a statutory crime. This process has already begun for President Donald Trump. Among the first things the president’s personal lawyer Jay Sekulow said in a September 27, 2019, CBS interview about the Ukraine affair was that the phone call between Trump and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky involved “no violation of law, rule, regulation, or statute.”"

    Think of "high crimes" as crimes that the everyday person cannot perform. As a result there are no specific laws against them. So did Donald Trump perform "high crimes". Yes he did. If you want to go over them we can. That there are no specific laws against them does not really matter.
     
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  3. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    It's sad how under and misinformed Americans are about impeachment. And the history of it, and how politically charged it has been before, such as Clinton's impeachment when Lindsay Graham himself said you don't have to commit and actual crime to be impeached. And it's amazing, that although many of us remember watching Clinton's impeachment, so many people have went on believing he wasn't impeached.
    Clearly US Government/Civics courses in high school and keeping informed later are failing. Miserably so.
     
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  4. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

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    I knew many people who though Clinton was reducing the national debt when he just slowed the increase

    Then again... most Clinton supports didn't realize Hillary care made use of your own finds paying a doctor to be illegal
     
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  5. ecco

    ecco Well-Known Member

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    Alan Dershowitz made the same argument during Clinton's impeachment. Now he says there must be an actual crime. When Fox pressed him on his flip-flop, he said he had done a lot more studying since Clinton and he is certain he is right this time.
     
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  6. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    If one goes to the roots of the term one finds that no specific crimes need to be committed. The term is "high crimes". Meaning wrong doings that only people in high places can commit. There never was foreseen a need to be specific in these matters.
     
  7. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    The ongoing impeachment circus is a disgrace, but I'm glad it happened because it exposes the socialist Democrat mentality and lack of capability for everybody to see.

    And you're right, the list of infractions for which President Trump is being accused is noticeably absent from a formal standpoint.
     
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  8. Lyndon

    Lyndon "Peace is the answer" quote: GOD, 2014
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    Trump is one of the most corrupt Presidents in history, no one has had as many staff members convicted of crimes, of course there is solid grounds for impeachment, you'd have to be some kind of dufus not to see that!!
     
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  9. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    What are they? You haven't mentioned it yet.

    Phone call, Ukraine, that's about it.

    Did the wicked witch tell you the clam up until the time is right? ;Op
     
  10. Lyndon

    Lyndon "Peace is the answer" quote: GOD, 2014
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    It seems you obviously haven't been paying attention to the charges against Trump, but then that's about what I would expect.
     
    #10 Lyndon, Jan 27, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2020
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  11. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    I'm not worried about the charges , but what I would like to see is the real evidence. The 'smoking gun' as it were.
     
  12. Lyndon

    Lyndon "Peace is the answer" quote: GOD, 2014
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    Like I said it appears you haven't been paying attention!!

     
  13. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    To what? You haven't said anything yet! :0p

    Allegations and testimony are not real evidence.
     
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  14. Lyndon

    Lyndon "Peace is the answer" quote: GOD, 2014
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    oh brother!!
     
  15. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Of course he's right this time. He'll be wrong again if it's another dem to get impeached. But right again.
     
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  16. Lyndon

    Lyndon "Peace is the answer" quote: GOD, 2014
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    Dershowitz was hooked up big time with Epstein.
     
  17. fantome profane

    fantome profane Have you read the Whistleblower complaint?
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    That is just absurd.
     
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  18. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    No it isn't. It's just incomplete making all this nonsense a waste of time.
     
  19. Stanyon

    Stanyon WWDWD?

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    Clinton was impeached for perjury and obstruction of justice.
     
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  20. Stevicus

    Stevicus Veteran Member
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    There probably is some political motivation in impeachment, although it's hard to say whether it's the "most politically motivated ever."

    I recall a few decades ago when Governor Mecham was elected with only about 40% of the popular vote. There were calls for a recall election almost right away, but after enough signatures were gathered and the recall election was set to go, the legislature pulled the rug out from under the voters and impeached him almost immediately. I think there was a political motivation there, in order to cancel the recall election.

    In the case of Trump, I'm not sure about the timing - since the 2020 presidential campaign has already begun, and it appears that many are afraid the Democrats are going to lose. It's extremely unlikely that they'll get a conviction, due to a GOP majority in the Senate, and the Democrats knew this going in. So, they've gone through the motions and engaged in this exercise in futility for some political motive. Maybe it's similar to what happened in AZ, where they want to get rid of him before the voters get a chance to decide. Or they could be targeting some GOP senators who are vulnerable and could be knocked out at the next election.

    I don't think the Democrats truly believe they're going to actually remove Trump from office, but there may still be a method to their madness. Perhaps they'll retake control of the Senate, or maybe they believe the impeachment process will convince enough swing voters to not vote for Trump in November.
     
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