I Have Become Pro Choice!

[kevmicsmi]

Ok, actually I have always been . At least on this matter.
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/opinion_columnists/article/0,2777,DRMN_23972_4565731,00.html

Can anyone give me a good reason not to allow choice and competition in school via vouchers? I cant think of one. If schools actually had to educate to stay in business, I believe it would immensely improve the efficiency of our schools. What do you think?

Ps. Ok I know I probably misspelled something, so I welcome the ironic post on my lack of education

 

[SoyLeche]

John Stossel has been going after Teacher's Unions for quite a while. Here are a lot of his articles:

http://www.townhall.com/opinion/contributors/JohnStossel.html

 

[kevmicsmi]

John Stossel has been going after Teacher's Unions for quite a while. Here are a lot of his articles:

http://www.townhall.com/opinion/contributors/JohnStossel.html

Frubals for that link. Great article!

 

[jeffrey]

My wife home school's so you know how we feel about public education. I'm all for vouchers. It could only improve things if the public schools face competition.

 

[kevmicsmi]

My wife home school's so you know how we feel about public education. I'm all for vouchers. It could only improve things if the public schools face competition.

:clap couldnt agree more!

 

[Pah]

...Can anyone give me a good reason not to allow choice and competition in school via vouchers? I cant think of one. If schools actually had to educate to stay in business, I believe it would immensely improve the efficiency of our schools. What do you think?

I assume that means state-run schools and the vouchers can be used in private schools.

It's completly ridiculous. I should finance that by my tax burden? That stupid principle would allow vouchers to the Ivy League for those who think it is an entitlement. Superior education is not a right; it is priviledged through fiscal and scholastic merit. If there is a problem with sub-standard schools or teachers, bring them to the standard.

 

[SoyLeche]

I assume that means state-run schools and the vouchers can be used in private schools.

It's completly ridiculous. I should finance that by my tax burden? That stupid principle would allow vouchers to the Ivy League for those who think it is an entitlement. Superior education is not a right; it is priviledged through fiscal and scholastic merit. If there is a problem with sub-standard schools or teachers, bring them to the standard.

That's has been what the education system has been saying for decades. Competition will get them to standard better than anything else.

Oh, and your taxes are already going towards substandard schools.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Drat! I was lured into this thread under false pretenses!

Why you little....

http://www.akg.hu/szub/kepek/32simpsons_bart&homer.jpg

 

[Pah]

That's has been what the education system has been saying for decades. Competition will get them to standard better than anything else.

Oh, and your taxes are already going towards substandard schools.

So instead of fixing the problem I should have to pay more and the problem remains? I am only accountable for general, standard education not for anything better. If I'm not getting what I'm paying for, I want that fixed. Parents should bear the burden of anything above standard - not the tax base.

Geez, I don't even have school aged kids and you want my taxes to send other's kids to "better" schools? Not in my mind, not in my obligations! I'll help you, the populace, to get a standard education for children but not to get special treatment.

 

[SoyLeche]

So instead of fixing the problem I should have to pay more and the problem remains? I am only accountable for general, standard education not for anything better. If I'm not getting what I'm paying for, I want that fixed. Parents should bear the burden of anything above standard - not the tax base.

Geez, I don't even have school aged kids and you want my taxes to send other's kids to "better" schools? Not in my mind, not in my obligations! I'll help you, the populace, to get a standard education for children but not to get special treatment.

I think I'd rather have the government get out of education all together.

 

[Quiddity]

So instead of fixing the problem I should have to pay more and the problem remains? I am only accountable for general, standard education not for anything better. If I'm not getting what I'm paying for, I want that fixed. Parents should bear the burden of anything above standard - not the tax base.

Geez, I don't even have school aged kids and you want my taxes to send other's kids to "better" schools? Not in my mind, not in my obligations! I'll help you, the populace, to get a standard education for children but not to get special treatment.

Woohooo, Pah is pushing toward a standard.....:woohoo:

 

[jamaesi]

This might be considered offtopic, but standardised testing makes me giggle when schools and what is being taught is not standardised.

Perhaps that might work to make schools a little more equal.

 

[kevmicsmi]

I assume that means state-run schools and the vouchers can be used in private schools.

It's completly ridiculous. I should finance that by my tax burden? That stupid principle would allow vouchers to the Ivy League for those who think it is an entitlement. Superior education is not a right; it is priviledged through fiscal and scholastic merit. If there is a problem with sub-standard schools or teachers, bring them to the standard.

By competition maybe? So you would rather subsidize crappy education like we have now, rather than letting parents choose public or private schools, whatever they feel best, and letting the free market raise the standards of our education.

 

[kevmicsmi]

So instead of fixing the problem I should have to pay more and the problem remains? I am only accountable for general, standard education not for anything better. If I'm not getting what I'm paying for, I want that fixed. Parents should bear the burden of anything above standard - not the tax base.

Geez, I don't even have school aged kids and you want my taxes to send other's kids to "better" schools? Not in my mind, not in my obligations! I'll help you, the populace, to get a standard education for children but not to get special treatment.

Who says you have to pay more? Its a simple system. In colorado about $8500 a year is used per student. If I take my child out of school A, and put him into school B, that $8500 goes to school B. How do you end up paying more? Its really pretty simple.....Wait a minute, were you educated in a public school?:biglaugh:

 

[kevmicsmi]

This might be considered offtopic, but standardised testing makes me giggle when schools and what is being taught is not standardised.

Perhaps that might work to make schools a little more equal.

Great point. The only true standard that will hold schools accountable is money. When bad schools start losing students, they will improve, or die out. Either option is fine by me.

 

[Ðanisty]

Who says you have to pay more? Its a simple system. In colorado about $8500 a year is used per student. If I take my child out of school A, and put him into school B, that $8500 goes to school B. How do you end up paying more? Its really pretty simple.....Wait a minute, were you educated in a public school?:biglaugh:

So what you're saying is that the voucher system takes money away from public schools. And this is supposed to improve public schools how?

 

[SoyLeche]

So what you're saying is that the voucher system takes money away from public schools. And this is supposed to improve public schools how?

By making them compete for students. Read the John Stossel articles I linked to before. Most of the countries with better school systems than ours spend a lot less on them then we do.

 

[lunamoth]

Vouchers seems like a subtle form of a ponzi scheme to me. I mean, if the pie (the money) is not getting bigger, but a bigger slice is going to the better schools, then what will happen to the poorer schools except get poorer and worse. And don't tell me that they will have to get better to die out. The number of students stays the same, so those who end up in the poorer schools are just out of luck, I guess.

Pah is right--bring the schools up to the standard. No TV for those kids in failing schools.

2 c,
lunamoth

 

[Pah]

By competition maybe? So you would rather subsidize crappy education like we have now, rather than letting parents choose public or private schools, whatever they feel best, and letting the free market raise the standards of our education.

It's not a free market when both voucher and basic schooling is paid by taxes. Geez!!!:tsk:

I have already said fix the problem not subsidize crappy education. I resent that it seems you either did not read my posts or that you are being deliberately antagonistic.

Parents already have the choice of private or public education and a third one thrown in - education at home. In places where vouchers were tested, I don't believe there was a susidy for home schooling.

Tell me something - anyone. Would you support a tax break for those who hire a personal security force? How about the cost of a long driveway that adds to the road system? Re-inbursement for a sophisticated hobby weather station? Vigilantism? Those minuteman boarder patrols should be paid by MY taxes?

Should the entire state of New Mexico receive a voucher? It was dead last in the school years 2002 - 2004!

Great point. The only true standard that will hold schools accountable is money. When bad schools start losing students, they will improve, or die out. Either option is fine by me.

Accountability is also political. The school system is further liable for state sanction and removal of elected officials.

You phrasing is increduluous. "The only standard is money" ????? How about an enforced academic standard.

 

[Pah]

Who says you have to pay more? Its a simple system. In colorado about $8500 a year is used per student. If I take my child out of school A, and put him into school B, that $8500 goes to school B. How do you end up paying more? Its really pretty simple.....Wait a minute, were you educated in a public school?:biglaugh:

You are being insulting and I resent that barb as well!


School A will still get nearly $8500 per student. The new school gets whatever the tuition is. The parents pay for a percentage of the tuition and continues to pay taxes that support the public school system. Throw those in, kevmicsmni, and your "simple" doesn't look simple any more.