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Do you love God?
- Thread starter Starlight
- Start date
DNB
Christian
Could be - a higher esteem, or something of the other?
Ajax
Active Member
The logic you gave me is seriously flawed for the following reasons.
No general instructions given from God can be temporal. God has repeatedly quoted in the Bible that he does not change his mind. Apart from this, God being described as omniscient and his ability to see the future, contradicts your logic and the need to change his instructions. Also at least two thirds of the world population did not and do not comprehend holiness and are unwilling to obey, so why doesn't he punish them or order to be killed?
Again very wrong. The Law was never been abrogated. Even Jesus confirmed this....
Mat 5:18 "For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the law until all is accomplished."
Third time wrong...Were the slaves wicked? Were the disobedient kids excessively wicked? Were the Egyptian babies excessively wicked? Were all the people, animals and plants he killed during the flood wicked? You must be kidding..
Today we have people sacrificing to other deities, atheists, etc. Why doesn't he kill them?
Speak for yourself please...
On the other hand when kids die Christians say it was God's mercy to have them next to Him..Weird thinking..
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DNB
Christian
God changes His mind for our sake, not for His.
Christ fulfilled the Law which held us all condemned, therefore it can be abrogated
You're not understanding anything that's being said.
stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Your question: "Do you love God?"
In a relationship 2 people say "I love you"
Both should use the same definition of "love"
Otherwise saying "I love you" is kind of useless
Your scenario (question) defines love as God's love:
God: Hence "love" definition is according to God
God is said to "love" unconditionally and selfless
Hence "love" = unconditional love in this context
That makes your question easy to answer
I do not "love" God, as @stvdv is incapable to love totally selfless and unconditionally
Note:
A) I in this context is @stvdv
B) IF I truly "love" God THEN the least I want to do is follow all His Commandments to a T; e.g.
1) Married till death do us part (easy for me)
2) Eat only the best, purest food and no excess
3) Love thy neighbor as thyself
So, why eat only "best, cleanest satwic food?"
1) I don't want to part (early death) from te one I truly love (God).
2)+3) IF I love myself, my goal is to "eat to live" (longest possible) and NOT to "live to eat" (indulging anything). Even Science has proven that many foods shorten our lifespan if eaten.
Here, at 2)+3), I fail miserably already.
Hence, I'll never say "I love God"
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Ajax
Active Member
Nope, according to many verses in scripture God does not change his mind for anyone, simply because he is omniscient and sees/knows the future.
James 1:17 "Every good endowment and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change."
This... "God changes His mind for our sake" looks like a crude made up story to justify the differences between the God of OT, versus Jesus and the same God of NT..
Again a big NO.. Has heaven and earth passed away? No, therefore according to Jesus nothing has been changed, let alone abrogated.
"Think not that I have come to abolish the law and the prophets..."
It seems to me that you... don't want to understand anything.
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I used to enjoy Mr. Deity. Not sure it was love, but I liked that.
does it count?
ciao
- viole
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
God loves unconditionally and selflessly but where did God day we have to love Him as He loves us?
We are not God so we are not capable of loving God as God loves us.
DNB
Christian
the covenant
No, he is the son of God - 1,000% human
Yes, he lacks depth of thought, perception, and wisdom - fear of God is the beginning of wisdom
DNB
Christian
You don't understand anything that you read - can you not can't how many times God changed His mind in the Bible, or granted a change of plan due to the pleading of His faithfulNope, according to many verses in scripture God does not change his mind for anyone, simply because he is omniscient and sees/knows the future.
James 1:17 "Every good endowment and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change."
This... "God changes His mind for our sake" looks like a crude made up story to justify the differences between the God of OT, versus Jesus and the same God of NT..
Again a big NO.. Has heaven and earth passed away? No, therefore according to Jesus nothing has been changed, let alone abrogated.
"Think not that I have come to abolish the law and the prophets..."
It seems to me that you... don't want to understand anything.
Sure... keep the rules is good.
The Rich and the Kingdom of God
17 As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him. “Good teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”18 “Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. “No one is good—except God alone. 19 You know the commandments: ‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.’[d]”
Agreed. Reaffirmed that keeping the rules is good.
And await.
Nothing to fear if a person is honest about keeping the rules.
Ajax
Active Member
Really? This simply proves the contradictions and the lies in the OT...Both OT and NT agree that God does not change his mind. God is changeless. That is perhaps the simplest way to define the doctrine of Divine Immutability. For the most part, such a definition is non-controversial in Christendom as a whole and has been readily affirmed by Christians for two thousand years..
I've given you all the verses.
Even if you use logic -which you don't want to use- there is no way that an omniscient deity which knows and can see simultaneously past, present and future can change what it knows and sees. It's not that difficult.
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Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Past, present and future only applies to this material world, so it only exists for humans in this material world.
There is no past present and future for God since God is not subject to time. God knows and sees past, present and future simultaneously.
Since the omniscient deity knows and sees simultaneously past, present and future He does not have to 'change' what He knows and sees.
In other words, God knows and sees everything that we consider past, present and future all at once.
How can you love someone you never knew?
At best you can love a simulacrum of what you think that person ought to have been.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
How can people love someone they met on a dating site who they never met?
They know that person through words.
Likewise, believers 'believe' that they know God through the revealed word in scriptures, although I question that.
I suspect in many cases, if/when you actually meet that person, they won't be who you thought they were.
When we want a relationship with a person we tend to be overoptimistic about their characteristics.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
They may or may not be who you thought they would be.
That really applies to God! Believers want a relationship with God so they are overly optimistic about His characteristics.
God is everything they want Him to be and nothing else.
Ajax
Active Member
That's exactly what I have been saying.
Your example is not really an ...example. First of all nobody falls in love on the first date, when they don't know each other. Secondly you have discussions face to face with the other person and can judge whether it is worth your love or not. Unlike God, seeing and discussing with someone helps you decide.
That is like asking "Do you love existence" ---- and what is this God = who .. which God .. looking fore a name here .. and what about this God do you love so much ... Is your God named Jealousy .. and what would someone love about an irrational flip flopping genocidal maniac with the most petty and nasty of human weaknesses .... Do you love all of that ... or is "Jealousy" not the name of the God you love ?