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Discrimination = Enlightenment?

RamaRaksha

*banned*
Does it take someone to be discriminated before they get enlightened?

When ISIS was condemning and killing christians, every newspaper here called them pure evil - why is what ISIS is doing wrong? Because we should not condemn people based on religion? But wait, isn't that what the two dominant religions teach? That God's realm is for "his" people only, everyone else gets hell? Atheists, Hindus, Buddhists blatantly condemned for their religion and dumped into hell!
Isn't ISIS an islamic organisation? Isn't common sense to realize that they are getting their ideas from what the majority religion is preaching? But the western media never went there - they were happy and content to isolate ISIS

A lot of muslims are being discriminated here in the US - they, rightly, condemn such discrimination based on their religion. We get - "one should not judge people by religion, underneath we are all the same, human beings with loved ones, families, hopes and aspirations like everyone else etc etc" - pardon me but aren't Atheists human beings? Don't Hindus have families, loved ones? Don't people of other religions also have aspirations and hopes like everyone else? But yet all these people should be dumped into hell based on their religion? Judged because of their religion?

But just because someone is discriminated that doesn't mean he or she will not turn around and abuse others. We see that with muslims - go to countries where they dominate and you see rampant discrimination based on religion. Atheists, Gays living in fear for their lives. People of minority religions living as 2nd class citizens - at any moment branded as blasphemers and burned to death!

I see a new movie coming out about Jesse Owens and the ads all speak the same language of the discriminated-enlightened - skin color doesn't matter, we are all the same underneath etc etc. An African-American colleague of mine, who i thought was my friend, the very same person who if discriminated because of his skin color would be very offended, and who i am sure has faced racism in this country, had no problem telling me that i was going to go to hell. He had no problem with blatant religious discrimination - happy to enforce it as long as he was on the other side

Sadly, the moral i have learned is that though a person may get enlightened when discriminated, it doesn't mean that he or she will apply it in other situations - back to being the majority, back to a situation where there is no discrimination and the abuse and hate come rushing back
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
One cannot ignore 'Vyavaharika' (perceived / pragmatic truth). Loving all is neither wise nor possible. That belongs to "Paramarthika' (Absolute truth). Each level of truth has to be handled as is appropriate (Yatha Yogya).
 

RamaRaksha

*banned*
One cannot ignore 'Vyavaharika' (perceived / pragmatic truth). Loving all is neither wise nor possible. That belongs to "Paramarthika' (Absolute truth). Each level of truth has to be handled as is appropriate (Yatha Yogya).
I am sorry that made no sense. You are living in this world and you want a good life for you and your family - you will have to stand up for some rights - learn the difference between good and bad and sometimes will have to fight for the good and right
 

aoji

Member
Does it take someone to be discriminated before they get enlightened?
...
Sadly, the moral i have learned is that though a person may get enlightened when discriminated, it doesn't mean that he or she will apply it in other situations - back to being the majority, back to a situation where there is no discrimination and the abuse and hate come rushing back

What's your point? Most religions have been discriminated against at one time or other, whether it be the Jews, the Puritans, the Pilgrims, the Quakers, Buddhists, etc.

As far as Muslims, go, there is a much bigger existing problem - violence. It may have cultural and societal underpinnings. The problem is whether or not Muslims can integrate within society. But that may be a big hurdle to overcome as "they" are against homosexuality, pre-marital sex, women equality, inter-racial and inter faith marriages, leaving the faith, etc. Is it really shocking to hear about a father killing his daughter because she wanted to have pre-marital sex with her boyfriend? (NYC news.) Not to me...
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
I am sorry that made no sense. You are living in this world and you want a good life for you and your family - you will have to stand up for some rights - learn the difference between good and bad and sometimes will have to fight for the good and right
Read my post again. Perhaps then you will understand. ;)
(NYC news.) Not to me...
Different cultures, different understandings. You don't like that?
 

RamaRaksha

*banned*
What's your point? Most religions have been discriminated against at one time or other, whether it be the Jews, the Puritans, the Pilgrims, the Quakers, Buddhists, etc.

As far as Muslims, go, there is a much bigger existing problem - violence. It may have cultural and societal underpinnings. The problem is whether or not Muslims can integrate within society. But that may be a big hurdle to overcome as "they" are against homosexuality, pre-marital sex, women equality, inter-racial and inter faith marriages, leaving the faith, etc. Is it really shocking to hear about a father killing his daughter because she wanted to have pre-marital sex with her boyfriend? (NYC news.) Not to me...
The point is covered in the last paragraph - that even though we hate being discriminated, when we become the majority suddenly we seem to lose those lessons. Jews were hounded out of Europe, how well are they treating the palestinians?
 

aoji

Member
... even though we hate being discriminated [against], when we become the majority suddenly we seem to lose those lessons.

Are you talking about mob mentality?, or human nature at the individual level? If it was human nature then wouldn't it be reasonable to want retribution for one's pain? At the individual level it will have to be an individual response. I have been a victim of discrimination, but why bother addressing it to a group when it was an individual that did the discrimination? If one carries this hate "on his shoulders" wouldn't it colour his world view, poison his soul? Ultimately the person being discriminated against has no power to affect change since the discriminators are still in power (say the White Man against the American Indian).

Jews were hounded out of Europe, how well are they treating the Palestinians?

Since that seems to be the real question, the wording seems to imply that you sympathize with the the Palestinian situation. Exactly what were its roots? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_State_of_Palestine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_territories It would seem that America is not sensitive to the plight of the Palestinians because they refuse to recognize the State of Israel, because they have proclaimed that their goal is the destruction of Israel, because they refuse to acknowledge that they lost two wars to Israel, and because of the terrorism against Israel.

At the present moment it is of little import in light of ISIS and the terrorism that they are waging against the rest of the world, fermenting wars in Africa and the Philippines, etc. Until such time as terrorism is renounced there can be little chance of reconciliation, imo. Yes, the Palestinian situation is tragic, but there always seems to be some tragic event in the world, like the Turkish genocide of the Armenians, the Holocaust, etc. What I find fascinating is that France has had terrorism attacks and they seemingly are anti-Semitic. While the PLO has called for a unified Arab state in the past the fact remains that Muslims still kill other Muslims. http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Late...lling-Sunni-civilians-with-Baghdad-s-blessing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shia–Sunni_relations

Your argument seems to be better directed to the Sunnis and Shiites themselves,

Sunni insurgencies, fearing that the Shiites would take revenge now that they had power, took hold, and the Iraqi army struggled to stop them with no outside support after the U.S. withdrew all troops in 2011.
...
But the fighting now boils down to a struggle for power, not theological doctrines. On Friday, Iraq's senior Shiite cleric urged all Iraqis to join the government's fight against the Sunni militants who have taken over large swathes of the country.
"People who are capable of carrying arms and fighting the terrorists in defense of their country ... should volunteer to join the security forces to achieve this sacred goal," Sheikh Abdulmehdi al-Karbalai said.
...
"Sunnis have always held power in Iraq in significant quantities," Hamoudi said. "Over the course of decades, through a series of revolutions, the decision to exclude Shi'a became much more conscious. They were feared as a group that could somehow sell the country to Iran.
http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ir...llows-centuries-shiite-sunni-mistrust-n130461
 
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