conversion

[samanthaca]

Hi, I have a question preferably if their are any rabbis here, I was wondering if its true that messianic Jews generally dont support idea of conversion and dont perfrom them. If this is true, can you explain their reasoning, especially considering mainstream Judaism, even Orthodox, do perform conversion. It seems like messianic Jews would want to align themselves as much as possible with how most Jews think if they want to be taken more seriously? If they dont do conversions, why not, and is it basicaly because they are Christians 'in disguise'?

 

[Zardoz]

Shalom

If one is familiar with the teachings of Paul, then one sees he's the source of this erroneous position.

I would guess it depends on the type of Messianic Jew for whether or not we agree. I completely reject Paul and all he stands for, so no, I accept Gerim. I actually assist Gerim in their journey in my Reform temple where I daven.

 

[Zardoz]

Oh, ya...

I was senior leadership in a large Messianic congregation for many years. I doubt any congregation would convert anyone. They are almost exclusively bankrolled by evangelical christians, and they won't tolerate such things. Not all members are that way, but he who controls the purse-strings controls policy. The Jews there are under the thumb of Edom, as we all are.

I am no longer associated with them.

 

[samanthaca]

Zardoz,

thanks for your reply...thats what I was wondering, if it has soemthing to do with wanting acceptance from evangelicals. I kind of knew it might have to do with it, but i dont know the reason *why* christians would even care one way or another if someone wants to be a messianic jew? can you please with all your knowledge explain WHY the christians would be against it?

if even Orthodox jews who know scripture pretty much better than anyone, find basis for a conversion, why would some pastor be against it?

its so disappointing if thats the case, bc I thought MJs consider themselves to be Jewish and so why are they trying to placate evangelicals?

thank you,

 

[Zardoz]

... I kind of knew it might have to do with it, but i dont know the reason *why* christians would even care one way or another if someone wants to be a messianic jew? can you please with all your knowledge explain WHY the christians would be against it?..,

Sure, I can explain. It's all from Paul's teachings. Here's an example:

1 Corinthians 7:18-24

18 Was any man called being circumcised? Let him not become uncircumcised. Hath any been called in uncircumcision? Let him not be circumcised.
19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing; but the keeping of the commandments of God.
20 Let each man abide in that calling wherein he was called.

That's just one example, there's many more. That's where Christians get that attitude from.

BTW, In every Branch of Judaism I know, there is no requirement for Gentiles to convert to Judaism to be 'saved' or 'blessed' or be 'worthy of heaven' or even to be considered 'righteous'. The only reason to convert is to join in the priesthood of Israel.