Bible creation was cosmic, galactic, planetary or local?

[kylixguru]

8. Sorry must have missed it. That interpretation is highly eisegetic, speculative, and symbolic. Paul addressed a question about the type of resurrected body we will have with a series of analogies. The idea in vs 35-42 is although all the bodies of animals and the heavenly bodies may be composed of essentially the same elements, God has produced a wonderful variety in their organization, strength, beauty, and color. And so will the case be with our resurrected bodies.

So are you then saying some people will be resurrected as a moon or a fish or a dog or are you in agreement that they shall be resurrected in accordance with what is symbolized in the creation account by a moon, a fish and a dog?

Paul was simply making use of the exact same metaphor that Gen 2:4 establishes. This was Paul's way of saying he understood how judgment and fore-ordination works.

I am simply making the same statement as Paul did because God gave me the same knowledge He gave to Paul. Adam as the Father (after being redeemed from hell by Son of Man) ruled and reigned as King over all Creation and He judged all souls and organized them into all of the various levels of glory that the creation account typifies and he scheduled those glories to manifest at different phases and stages of the 6000 years allotted to them to be tried and proven. The creation account was a spiritual blueprint for the creation that took Adam his whole lifetime to accomplish, with the help of His Bride Eve, the Church. That's why Gen 2:4 says "in the day".

 

[kylixguru]

In Paul's second analogy (vs 44-49) he contrasts what he calls the "natural body" with the "spiritual body" (1Co 15:44). By comparing the "first" man, Adam, to the "second" man, Christ, calling them the first and second Adams (1Co15:45). He relates the first Adam to the original creation and the second Adam to the new creation of God through the living Christ (1Co15:47). Notice how Paul uses the singular "first Adam". This renders your interpretation of plurality, as found in the term "generations", null and void.

Not if the definition of Adam as Christ is a resurrected body of flesh and bone, which Paul defined as a plurality of individuals gathered together as members of His body.

When you open your eyes to see the creation account as a spiritual organization of bodies of flesh and bone that shall all manifest in the yet to play out physical creation, then you can know the Father and how you can become a member of His body of flesh and bone. You will evolve from having scales of hardness covering you.

If you soften your heart and cast off the spirit of unbelief, you just might attain to your spiritual resurrection at the level of "man" instead of "fish" and partake of the fulness of the Father's Kingdom, which is here on the earth now awaiting its redemption to its full millennial glory.

Also, Paul is rather adeptly explaining how spiritual resurrection and physical resurrection interrelate. We are born from seed in physical flesh. Depending upon how we conduct ourselves we have determined for us a spiritual body in the judgment. We develop this over the period of our lifetime. This spiritual body is what survives the death of our physical body. At Judgment Day Adam assesses the quality and condition of our spiritual body and assigns to it a "new name" that defines what your fore-ordained parameters are in the next cycle of creation. This determines what lineage your future physical body comes from and you are back full circle to live that life and be judged again at the end of that cycle, and so on and so on.

It takes Adam his whole life, after his redemption, to complete this great and marvelous work. Adam is raised up and does it all over again each cycle of Creation. Each cycle of Creation is begotten from the previous cycle, therefore they are patterned after one another just like a human child is patterned after their progenitors.

Therefore, each cycle of Creation has a new Adam, a new Savior, a new Holy Ghost, etc. as the di-vine grows from age to age receiving more and more personages into spiritual union. Every personage of the Godhead has the accumulation of all the wisdom and intelligence obtained with each new cycle.

This is why we find bits and pieces of what is called the Pagan Christs. This very same cycle of creation has been playing out numerous times in this planet's past.

 

[kylixguru]

Due to time constraints and commitments, this will be my last reply to you on this thread. I believe I've proved my point, about Gen 2:4, loud and clear to any who are honest and true to God's literal word. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like you will be one of them. Until next time.

You have fought valiantly, except for your extreme hubris and baseless accusation and smear of me personally, to convince everyone of the exception you wish to make for "generations" in Genesis 2:4.
Sadly for you, that exception makes you entirely miss the majesty of what God's Creation account is really saying.

 

[jtartar]

I'm sparking up a new thread from this comment in another thread:

The context you drew attention to, that Cain built a city and got wives from elsewhere, suggests that there is something underlying the creation narrative that did not omit the possibility that people were in existence contemporary to and even prior to Adam.

If this is true, this rules out the possibility that the creation narrative pertains to a cosmic, a galactic or even a planetary scope. I would like to purport that the creation narrative pertains to a specific local area and a specific tribe of people only, as you seem to be alluding to above.

I imagine people have tried to explore this line of reasoning before so I would like to hear about those attempts, how far you got and why you reached the conclusion you did. I'll share some of my discoveries in pursuit of exploring this line of reasoning for your consideration and especially for your substantive critique.

What if the flecks of dust Adam's body was made from were actually people formerly in an uninspired state? Adam's body then would have been formed by flecks of dust (people) having the "breath of life" blown into their nostrils. Therefore, Adam was the group of people who attained to a state of mind we would call enlightenment, spiritual resurrection, spiritual birth, being born again, etc. acting in union as a distinct body.

If that is the case then it is possible that the other aspects of the creation narrative could also apply to how people are organized into various spiritual bodies. Thus, it is a narrative that uses symbols to say how one tribal group would undergo a period of time as a full cycle plays out, that also appears to be cyclic in nature that will have a new beginning out of the former cycle's ending.

So, is there some indication in the text itself that provides any clues that the creation account actually pertains to people? The answer seems to me to be: Yes.

What do you make of the passage in Genesis 2:4 that right after the days of creation are described with all of their elements it says: "These are the generations..."?

Doesn't it seem plausible that we are not talking about a cosmic, galactic or even planetary thing if it says all of that stuff actually pertains to generations, which are people?

Kylixguru,
You are making what the Bible says much more complex than it is meant to be. Remember that Jesus said that the scriptures can be understood by BABES, although it cannot be understood by the wise and the intellectual ones, Luke 10:21.
At the very start of the Bible, when it says; In the beginning God created the Heavens and the earth, there is a principle to be understood, it is called THE GAP THEORY. This is the time from which God created the heavens, and when He started to prepare the earth for life. God created the heavens billions of years before He created the earth. Science has determined that the heavens are 12 to 15 billion years old, and the earth 4 to 5 billion years old. This is the Gap that confuses many people.
The first chapter is a prolegomenon, or a preface, the second chapter. Especially is this true about thhe creation of mankind. In the first chapter God says In the firstchlet us make man in out image, Gen 1:26-28. At Gen 2:7 God actually creates the man out of the dust from the ground. Later He creates the woman out of Adam's rib.
In the first chapter God gave the mandate for mankind to reproduce and fill the earth subdue it.
In the second chapter God told Adam not to eat of one tree in the middle of the garden, that he would die if he did. He and Eve ate of that tree and so our original parents rebelled against God, they became sinners, this caused a flaw in their makeup, which flaw they passed on to all their offspring, so mankind started to die, Rom 5:12.
God did not want all of mankind, forever to be estranged from Him, so he sent His son to bea Ransom for us so that we could have the promises that Adam and Eve had, IF we have faith in that Ransom and obey God as best we can.
If you listen to the Bible and do not listen to the Philosophies of men, it is not hard to understand. Of course the truth of God's word is very valuable and must be searched for, Prov 2:2-9.

 

[kylixguru]

Kylixguru,
You are making what the Bible says much more complex than it is meant to be. Remember that Jesus said that the scriptures can be understood by BABES, although it cannot be understood by the wise and the intellectual ones, Luke 10:21.
At the very start of the Bible, when it says; In the beginning God created the Heavens and the earth, there is a principle to be understood, it is called THE GAP THEORY. This is the time from which God created the heavens, and when He started to prepare the earth for life. God created the heavens billions of years before He created the earth. Science has determined that the heavens are 12 to 15 billion years old, and the earth 4 to 5 billion years old. This is the Gap that confuses many people.
The first chapter is a prolegomenon, or a preface, the second chapter. Especially is this true about thhe creation of mankind. In the first chapter God says In the firstchlet us make man in out image, Gen 1:26-28. At Gen 2:7 God actually creates the man out of the dust from the ground. Later He creates the woman out of Adam's rib.
In the first chapter God gave the mandate for mankind to reproduce and fill the earth subdue it.
In the second chapter God told Adam not to eat of one tree in the middle of the garden, that he would die if he did. He and Eve ate of that tree and so our original parents rebelled against God, they became sinners, this caused a flaw in their makeup, which flaw they passed on to all their offspring, so mankind started to die, Rom 5:12.
God did not want all of mankind, forever to be estranged from Him, so he sent His son to bea Ransom for us so that we could have the promises that Adam and Eve had, IF we have faith in that Ransom and obey God as best we can.
If you listen to the Bible and do not listen to the Philosophies of men, it is not hard to understand. Of course the truth of God's word is very valuable and must be searched for, Prov 2:2-9.

Your manner of interpretation breaks some of my fundamental rules of discipline.
If the bible doesn't say billions of years, it isn't talking about something involving billions of years.
The gap theory has too many gaps and it is something I wouldn't dare try and foist upon my children.