Atma and Jeevatma

[Krishna7]

What is the difference between atma and jeevatma?

 

[Aupmanyav]

Depends on the philosophy that a Hindu is following. It varies from 'there is only one' to 'there are many'.
(Madhvacharya - One Jeeva is different from another)

 

[Valjean]

I see it as similar to nirguna vs saguna Brahman.

I can look at a person either as an individual jivatman or as the indivisible breath of Reality itself.

 

[Shantanu]

I see it as similar to nirguna vs saguna Brahman.

I can look at a person either as an individual jivatman or as the indivisible breath of Reality itself.

Do you know what: God Paramatma is Nirguna Brahman only until one surrenders to Him and then only does He become Saguna Brahman. That is the meeting place of the jiva and jivatman with God.

 

[Krishna7]

It is said that god resides in all of us as Atma. But when we die, it is our Jeevatma
that either suffers hell or enjoys the heavens. I am confused here between atma
and Jeevatma?

 

[Aupmanyav]

Make a search in the forum. Members have discussed this frequently and even recently. Perhaps that would make things clear to you.

 

[ameyAtmA]

It is said that god resides in all of us as Atma. But when we die, it is our Jeevatma
that either suffers hell or enjoys the heavens. I am confused here between atma
and Jeevatma?

Namaste Krishna7

Yes, the first part : aham AtmA guDAkesha jeevabhUtAshayasthitah: (BG 10.20) --
AtmA = all-pervading universal AtmA

jeevAtmA = jeev + AtmA = local individual wrapping of mind, intellect, ego, with the substratum of the universal AtmA without which it can never be sentient.

Therefore, the AtmA (BG 10.20) is referred to by the followers of a dual-non-dual or dual philosophies as paramAtmA.

Therefore, never refer to jeevAtmA as AtmA, for clarity of communication.
Bhakti (vibhakti) which partitions the One AtmA for the sake of loving exchange, revolves around the pair jeevAtmA-paramAtmA as bhakta-BhagavAn, devotee-God.

Hope that helps.

 

[Shantanu]

It is said that god resides in all of us as Atma. But when we die, it is our Jeevatma
that either suffers hell or enjoys the heavens. I am confused here between atma
and Jeevatma?

If God lived in all of us as Atma we would all be Gods living impeccably.

 

[Valjean]

If God lived in all of us as Atma we would all be Gods living impeccably.

But atma pervades everything and everyone. We are all gods -- dreaming different realities.

 

[Shantanu]

But atma pervades everything and everyone. We are all gods -- dreaming different realities.

It is true that we are all gods of the guna consciousness, but we are not all the Supreme God, Sri Krishna (Durga in the feminine form): to attain that God-hood you need to surrender to that God by transcending the gunas.

 

[Valjean]

It is true that we are all gods of the guna consciousness, but we are not all the Supreme God, Sri Krishna (Durga in the feminine form): to attain that God-hood you need to surrender to that God by transcending the gunas.

True, expanded consciousness is the ultimate goal of Hinduism. It's the "waking up" to the fact that you've been experiencing an illusion all along. Once awake, the dream is over -- the world, the gods, the cycle of life and death -- all over.

Personifying Brahman with features, that is: creating gods, is all well and good if it helps in our spiritual development, but we must understand, intellectually, that these gods, these saguna entities, are still part of the dream. They're tools.
Once awake, we've transcended them; jivatman has merged with Atman/Brahman.

 

[Shantanu]

True, expanded consciousness is the ultimate goal of Hinduism. It's the "waking up" to the fact that you've been experiencing an illusion all along. Once awake, the dream is over -- the world, the gods, the cycle of life and death -- all over.

Personifying Brahman with features, that is: creating gods, is all well and good if it helps in our spiritual development, but we must understand, intellectually, that these gods, these saguna entities, are still part of the dream. They're tools.
Once awake, we've transcended them; jivatman has merged with Atman/Brahman.

I only have the consciousness that is required to survive on planet Earth with dignity, I no longer need any spiritual development as God.

 

[Valjean]

I only have the consciousness that is required to survive on planet Earth with dignity, I no longer need any spiritual development as God.

Quite reasonable, of course, but if this be the case you cannot be considered a practicing or aspiring Hindu.

 

[Shantanu]

Quite reasonable, of course, but if this be the case you cannot be considered a practicing or aspiring Hindu.

I am a satya-advaitist who realised that I am God, by judging my actions and classifying these as infallible and perfect to deserve the title of being God. The only thing I aspired to was to survive with dignity. I learnt this from my association with God who showed me the way to attain that dignified state by my dharmic actions.

 

[ajay0]

But atma pervades everything and everyone. We are all gods -- dreaming different realities.

This is very well put.

Even the deluded and weak ones will realize Brahman , though they will have to go through greater errors and consequent suffering in the process.

 

[Shantanu]

Even the deluded and weak ones will realize Brahman , though they will have to go through greater errors and consequent suffering in the process.

In the Hinduism DIR such comments are unwelcome because they insinuate that others that you vary from are deluded. Non Hindus should be respectful of the views of Hindus if they wish to post here.

 

[ajay0]

What is the difference between atma and jeevatma?

I have given an answer to this in this post of mine.

The Actor (Advaita Vedanta/Nondualism Only)


A great saying by Upasni Mahara in this regardj...

There is Atma in everybody. This Atma, enveloped in desires, is called Jivatma. It is the Jivatma that remains conscious of and about the actions, the pleasures and the pain. It is the Jivatma, with the help of the mind, the reasoning and the gross body, that does the various actions, and becomes the receiver of the fruits thereof - the pleasures and pain. It is the Jivatma that calls himself the 'Doer' of all the good and bad actions. It is the Jivatma that gets everything done through his servant - the body and mind - and enjoys or suffers the pleasures and pain himself. Such a Jiva is a Rajoguni Jiva. - Upasni Maharaj

 

[Shantanu]

I have given an answer to this in this post of mine.

The Actor (Advaita Vedanta/Nondualism Only)


A great saying by Upasni Mahara in this regardj...

There is Atma in everybody. This Atma, enveloped in desires, is called Jivatma. It is the Jivatma that remains conscious of and about the actions, the pleasures and the pain. It is the Jivatma, with the help of the mind, the reasoning and the gross body, that does the various actions, and becomes the receiver of the fruits thereof - the pleasures and pain. It is the Jivatma that calls himself the 'Doer' of all the good and bad actions. It is the Jivatma that gets everything done through his servant - the body and mind - and enjoys or suffers the pleasures and pain himself. Such a Jiva is a Rajoguni Jiva. - Upasni Maharaj

No Jiva and jivatman are two different things.

 

[Krishna7]

I am totally satisfied with the reply given by ajayO. Thanks.