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Arrow of Time

questfortruth

Well-Known Member

Thermodynamics is a macroscopic theory.
But any macroscopic level is a consequence of the microscopic
description of an extensive (macroscopic) system. Hence, if we
choose such a microscopic description
that the Entropy begins to decrease, we will violate
Thermodynamics Second Law. We cannot do it
because this Second Law is mathematically proven.

Otherwise, the Thermodynamics Second Law “Entropy Grows”
must be accompanied with
this text "the law holds absolutely for all initial states (such
states are microscopic descriptions of a large system), except just
one or two." But this is absurd. It would not be a reliable law.
Hence T-symmetry is violated on microscopic description
of an extensive system.

Another idea is this: the arrow of time
is the increase of information in an observer's brain.
Time is directed in the direction where data in
the brain is growing. That is why they say that old enough
humans fall back into childhood.

Then the reverse of time's arrow
means that the information in the brain becomes vanishing.
But that violates the definition of the time's arrow.
Hence, we cannot reverse time. So, there must be
T-asymmetry on every level of nature.

Nobody knows how our Universe came to be
because the antimatter is missing.
In the Big Bang, an equal amount of matter and antimatter
should have been, unless there is a CP symmetry violation.
But because the CPT-symmetry cannot be violated,
the violation of CP means the violation of the time-reverse
symmetry T.

Thermodynamics says that Entropy must grow
(or stay the same). This conclusion does not depend
on the initial condition of a system. Hence, we cannot fine-tune
velocities and positions of the particles in the system to decrease
Entropy. For example, we cannot achieve such a situation
when if you eat food, the food comes out of your mouth.
And when you drink water from a glass the water comes into the glass.
Therefore, even if we can reverse a
movie on the VCR recorder, we cannot reverse the progress of
the real world.
Therefore, there is time Asymmetry, the T-symmetry violation.

Such T-violation means that Hawking's Information Loss
Paradox at Black Holes is not a paradox but a law of Nature.
If we lose information, we cannot reverse the time.
But we cannot reverse time. Hence, we lose information.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/363055855_Arrow_of_Time

Let us suppose that John lands on a distant planet, where time runs backward.
Then he meets Bob on this planet. Bob's home is this alien planet.
But because time runs backward, the data inside Bob's brain constantly vanishes.
But this is impossible. Hence, there is no place where time runs backward.
Yes, the locally measured Entropy can decrease, but the arrow of time cannot
revert its direction.
 
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Ben Dhyan

Veteran Member
It's My Birthday!
Time is a concept of the mind associated with change observed by an articulate creature in its environment or reality, it is not an actual entity such as existence itself.. Existence itself is always now, measuring the continuation of existence as now using a proxy such as sun dial, pendulums, quartz crystals, etc., is what is called time.
 

questfortruth

Well-Known Member
Time is a concept of the mind associated with change observed an articulate creature in the perceived environment, it is not an actual entity such as existence itself.. Existence itself is always now, measuring the continuation of existence as now using a proxy such as sun dial, pendulums, quartz crystals, etc., is what is called time.
But formulas work well, and they give good predictions for experiments. Time is needed for formulas,
for example, in the laws of Newton.
 

Ben Dhyan

Veteran Member
It's My Birthday!
But formulas work well, and they give good predictions for experiments. Time is needed for formulas,
for example, in the laws of Newton.
Sure, time as perceived and employed by mankind was/is a great step in human evolution, what I am saying though is while this so called time concept is helpful to mankind at this level, time itself is not applicable to existence which contains everything. Why? Because existence is absolute, it just exists now, always has, always will.

Don't mind me, I am sure a healthy discussion can take place on this thread within the context of human perception and understanding of time as being real, but in the big picture, existence is timeless.
 

RestlessSoul

Well-Known Member
I am increasingly inclined to the perception that time may be the only fundamental phenomenon in the macroscopic world: All other phenomena and properties, including space, being emergent from a deeper fundamental reality.

Ted Jacobson, theoretical physicist at the University of Maryland, has been doing work on how space itself may be derived from Schrodinger's equation, as part of his research into quantum gravity and dark energy. Sean Carroll (Caltech) writes about this in his recent book, Something Deeply Hidden. The approach apparently, is that in order to try to reconcile GR with QM, instead of attempting to quantise gravity, there may be value in starting with the fundamentals and trying to derive relativity from the wave function. Seemingly by measuring the quantum entropy in a field, it is possible to derive a two dimensional space boundary from; this is related to the holographic principle whereby information apparently lost crossing the event horizon of a black hole (in violation of quantum principles) may be encoded in the lower dimensional boundary of the black hole. Thus spatial dimensions are emergent properties of quantum phenomena.

Space, it seems, may be an emergent property of the macroscopic reality we appear to inhabit, but where does that leave time, particularly in the context of the four dimensional spacetime manifold posited by special relativity? Is it possible that time, and it's three convergent arrows, the thermodynamic, cosmological, and psychological*, is the one fundamental characteristic of the macroscopic world, as the speed of light is it's one invariable metric? If the universal wave function is the great reality from which all emergent phenomena are derived, and Schrodinger's equation describes the evolution of the wave function over time, does it not follow that time is fundamental, whereas space, being derived from rather than endemic to the wave function, perhaps is not? This is very much a patchwork of incomplete theories. Needs more time (but there's a lot of that).

* S Hawking, A Brief History of Time
 

JDMS

Academic Workhorse
I'm not sure how entropy fits into this. It's basic chemistry knowledge that the entropy of the universe always increases, but the entropy of a system can decrease.

Maybe I'm missing something.
 
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JDMS

Academic Workhorse
the RATE OF entropy CHANGE measured locally (not a total entropy of universe) can be positive, negative and zero.

Ah yes my mistake, but still, the entropy of a system CAN DECREASE, which you seem to have said it cannot in your OP?
 

Ben Dhyan

Veteran Member
It's My Birthday!
You speak in Christian terms. It is eternity in afterlife.
What you call afterlife is existence transcendent to the perception that this human life is real. It is not and that is why it is known as maya,.and why Jesus said that no human has ever seen Heaven, Heaven/afterlife is real, it is not just a temporary brain's thought process that is meant to represent reality. Reality is forever on the other side of the brain's thought processes. That includes the concept of time!
 

questfortruth

Well-Known Member
Reality is forever on the other side of the brain's thought processes. That includes the concept of time!
Any brain is more complex than Universe. Hence, if Bob feels or thinks something, it surely can be real thing. Because his brain is more important than entire Universe.

More in: Was Earth Flat?
 
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Ben Dhyan

Veteran Member
It's My Birthday!
Any brain is more complex than Universe. Hence, if Bob feels or thinks something, it surely can be real thing. Because his brain is more important than entire Universe.

More in: Was Earth Flat?
Hold on a second, a brain is a part of the universe, how can the part be more complex and important than the whole? Is a hair on your head more complex and important than your whole body?

Secondly, thoughts have no reality except as being a bunch of neuron firing patterns that to your mind, represent some reality, but they are not that reality, more like a image of the real, or a signpost point to the real. Think of an apple, is the thought of the apple edible? No of course not, the apple is real and on the other side of the brain's conceptual representation of it.

God's reality is on the other side of any and all thoughts about it, and that includes the human concept of time.
 

questfortruth

Well-Known Member
how can the part be more complex and important than the whole?
For example. My home is part of Universe. But Universe is divided into two areas: my home and outside world. My home can be more complex than the outside world. So, brain is more complex than the remaining parts of Universe.
 

Ben Dhyan

Veteran Member
It's My Birthday!
For example. My home is part of Universe. But Universe is divided into two areas: my home and outside world. My home can be more complex than the outside world. So, brain is more complex than the remaining parts of Universe.
Ok, you caught me. :D
 
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