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Featured Are you a born sinner? Is anyone?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by We Never Know, Mar 27, 2021.

  1. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    Its said we are all born sinners but yet jesus died for all of man's sins... past, present and future....so how are we born sinners if jesus already died to wash away our present and future sins?
     
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  2. Nimos

    Nimos Well-Known Member

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    I have no issues with people being born sinners... just leave me out of it :)
     
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  3. JustGeorge

    JustGeorge Well-Known Member
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    I was born as a baby.
     
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  4. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    The idea is if you don't believe it's true, he died for nothing. It's the faith that saves people. His death, in my opinion, would be an example of what christians should do for others. No all denominations agree with faith only=salvation.

    John 3:16 is a good wrap up. "To those who believe" will have everlasting life. The rest of us, no. At least according to christian theology.
     
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  5. Jimmy

    Jimmy Well-Known Member

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    He cleaned the slate
    Now it’s your life
     
  6. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    (Romans 5:12). Every one of us was affected by Adam’s sin; there are no exceptions. “One trespass resulted in condemnation for all people” (verse 18). We are all sinners, and we all share the same condemnation, because we are all children of Adam.
     
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  7. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    I do not believe anyone was born a sinner. The Bible does not even support that. If everything that God made was good, that would include humans.

    Genesis 1

    27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

    31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.


    I do not believe there was ever an original sin that came upon humanity because Adam and Eve ate an apple off a tree. I believe the whole story is fiction an d that original sin is the biggest lie ever perpetrated upon humanity. Jesus knew nothing about original sin, it was a Christian doctrine put in place to make people believe they needed Jesus if they wanted to be saved. Jesus was thus used as a pawn in the Christian game.

    I believe humans are born good but we have two natures, a lower selfish nature and a higher spiritual nature, and we have free will to choose between them. Jesus came to free us from our lower selfish nature with His teachings and that is what Jesus did for us, how we were saved. Jesus taught us to deny self and He sacrificed Himself as a symbol of self-denial, not to remove an original sin that never even existed.
     
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  8. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    (Romans 5:12). Every one of us was affected by Adam’s sin; there are no exceptions. “One trespass resulted in condemnation for all people” (verse 18). We are all sinners, and we all share the same condemnation, because we are all children of Adam.
     
  9. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    I really hope you can come to understand that is not true. I just explained why I do not believe it is true, but I will explain it further if you want me to.
     
  10. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    So do you believe parts are true but not other parts? Isn't that like pick and choose being I just showed you we all are sinners.
     
  11. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    There was no slate to clean because there was no original sin.
     
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  12. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Let's start from scratch. Why do you believe that we are all sinners?
     
  13. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    I don't. Im not religious but.... (Romans 5:12). Every one of us was affected by Adam’s sin; there are no exceptions. “One trespass resulted in condemnation for all people” (verse 18). We are all sinners, and we all share the same condemnation, because we are all children of Adam.
     
  14. Jimmy

    Jimmy Well-Known Member

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    Sin of life
     
  15. Jimmy

    Jimmy Well-Known Member

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    Well now you’re talking about the Old Testament and that’s on shaky grounds lol
     
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  16. Quagmire

    Quagmire Imaginary talking monkey
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    No, I had to learn.
     
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  17. SA Huguenot

    SA Huguenot Well-Known Member

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    Through sin, death came into Creation.
    Yes, you are born into sin, even if you are a baby and still did not sin.
    Your human body is one of corruption and death.
    It was sin that changed Adam and Eve's bodies from being immortal, to the one we hace now, a mortal body.
    Every second that ticks away, we age, and cells in our bodies dies.
    We are nothing than living corpses.
    Unlike the bodies which was occupied by Adam and Eve that did not age before they sinned.
    and this was why Satan deceived them into sinning against God.
    To remove God's friend He created for Him because no corruption can be in the presence of His Glory.
    This was why Jesus came to be made the sinoffering of us all, to have His blood cover our Sinfull nature just as the High Priest of ancient times had to sacrifice and cover the sins of Israel with Blood.
    There is a special atribute about Blood in the face of God.
    Blood covers the corrupted bodies we have to protect us from being destroyed in His presence.

    Think about this,
    Jesus was born as a human, therefore in a corrupt body like us, and He aged like us, and He died like us.
    however, he rose from the dead after his blood was spilled, and had a body with no blood, for he told Thomas, He was not a ghost, for a ghost do not have flesh and bone.
    Jesus was also very clear when he said, no flesh and blood will enter heaven.

    therefore, Adam and Eve were clothed in a bright covering of light, but they lost their immortality when they sinned, and lost this light, which was replaced by blood, but they now had a body of flesh, bone and blood.
    Jesus was killed with the same body of Bone, flesh and blood, but He changed into an immortal body of Flesh and bone only, and the blood remained here on earth. he again obtained the light which Adam and Eve were clothed with.

    Yes, I was born in sin, because of my corrupt body, even though I still did not commit any sin.

    This is the gospel, that Jesus came to change our sinfull nature, eg bodies, to be able to live forever.
    It is up to us to change our sinfull mind. That is our choice.
     
  18. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    If you are not religious why do you believe this? Can't you recognize a scam when you see it?
    Christianity wants you to accept the free gift but in order to accept it you have to admit you are a sinner.

    Romans 5 KJV

    12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

    18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.


    As a Baha’i I do not believe that Adam and Eve were real people or that there was a Garden of Eden in which they lived. I believe it was a story with metaphorical meanings.

    “We must reflect a little: if the literal meaning of this story were attributed to a wise man, certainly all would logically deny that this arrangement, this invention, could have emanated from an intelligent being. Therefore, this story of Adam and Eve who ate from the tree, and their expulsion from Paradise, must be thought of simply as a symbol. It contains divine mysteries and universal meanings, and it is capable of marvelous explanations. Only those who are initiated into mysteries, and those who are near the Court of the All-Powerful, are aware of these secrets. Hence these verses of the Bible have numerous meanings.”
    Some Answered Questions, p. 123


    To read the entire chapter: 30: ADAM AND EVE

    Baha’is do not believe in original sin, that sin was inherited from Adam and Eve, so there is no need for redemption from original sin. Baha’is believe that man was born good but has a lower material nature that has the propensity to sin. One possible meaning of the serpent in the Adam and Eve story is attachment to the human world, or the material world, as opposed to God and the spiritual world. When Adam was born and entered the human world, He came out from the paradise of freedom and fell into the world of bondage. From the spiritual world, in the height of purity and absolute goodness, He entered into the world of good and evil... This attachment to the human world, which is sin, was inherited by the descendants of Adam, and is the serpent which is always in our midst and continues and endures... It is because of this attachment that men have been deprived of essential spirituality and their exalted position.
     
  19. Jimmy

    Jimmy Well-Known Member

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    Maybe Adam is metaphorical to life itself after all there’s a lot of metaphors in the OT
     
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  20. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    Who says I accept it? Im just repeating what others accept.
     
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