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America’s Wildly Successful Socialist Experiment

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
Let's hear it for American Democratic Socialism in action:
  • Salary cap for those on top meaning those in Europe can make more than the USA
  • More worker rights than similar people in Europe have
  • Minimum wage
  • Business cooperation rather than cutthroat competition
  • Success is "hailed but curtailed". Failure is rewarded by a form of affirmative action
If American and European (organizations) were politicians, Europe would be Donald Trump, and the U.S. would be Bernie Sanders.

 

Debater Slayer

Vipassana
Staff member
Premium Member
The U.S. has lagged behind several European countries in human development indices for years now. Using an ultra-monetized sport--like soccer--as an example that Europe is becoming "more American" seems far-fetched and unrealistic to me. If it is indeed true that European soccer is copying the American MO in some aspects, that still leaves out far more relevant aspects of life where the U.S. is outdone and put in the shade by several other developed countries.

A person who, say, has significant debt due to medical bills or a practically unlivable minimum wage won't benefit from Europe's following the economic footsteps of the U.S. in a sport. Nor does a person working overtime in two jobs to barely make ends meet get any share of profit from such things.

American exceptionalism needs to die not just because the world is becoming increasingly globalized but also because it is deeply unrealistic, naive, and in some ways blindly prejudiced. As far as I can see, proponents of American exceptionalism who glorify the way the U.S. does things need to wake up before their wishful thinking brings down their country even more than it already has--if they care at all about their country.
 

Debater Slayer

Vipassana
Staff member
Premium Member
Also...

From the article said:
As with politics and culture, Europe is adapting to an American world, copying its successes and wealth. [...]

Mass shootings due to flawed gun laws, abortion bans, student debt, death or life-long debt from lack of health insurance, and three-trillion-dollar wars--among other things--say hi.

So much for "successes" that Europe is supposedly copying. The guy who wrote that article sounds like a delusional and rabid nationalist in some parts. It's actually sad.
 

Regiomontanus

Ματαιοδοξία ματαιοδοξιών! Όλα είναι ματαιοδοξία.
Also...



Mass shootings due to flawed gun laws, abortion bans, student debt, death or life-long debt from lack of health insurance, and three-trillion-dollar wars--among other things--say hi.

So much for "successes" that Europe is supposedly copying. The guy who wrote that article sounds like a delusional and rabid nationalist in some parts. It's actually sad.


I find it interesting that you include abortion bans with mass shootings, wars, and lack of health care.

The one protects innocent life, the others are all destructive of it.
 

bobhikes

Nondetermined
Premium Member
Let's hear it for American Democratic Socialism in action:
  • Salary cap for those on top meaning those in Europe can make more than the USA
  • More worker rights than similar people in Europe have
  • Minimum wage
  • Business cooperation rather than cutthroat competition
  • Success is "hailed but curtailed". Failure is rewarded by a form of affirmative action
If American and European (organizations) were politicians, Europe would be Donald Trump, and the U.S. would be Bernie Sanders.


I double checked but this wasnt in the jokes section. You need to do your homework or at least post your sources.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Let's hear it for American Democratic Socialism in action:
  • Salary cap for those on top meaning those in Europe can make more than the USA
  • More worker rights than similar people in Europe have
  • Minimum wage
  • Business cooperation rather than cutthroat competition
  • Success is "hailed but curtailed". Failure is rewarded by a form of affirmative action
If American and European (organizations) were politicians, Europe would be Donald Trump, and the U.S. would be Bernie Sanders.

No thank you.

By 'success' you mean the nanny state, with a considerable loss of personal and economic freedom.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
No thank you.

By 'success' you mean the nanny state, with a considerable loss of personal and economic freedom.
So you're against how football is organized and want us to adopt the rules soccer follows because football is "socialist" and thus "nanny state"ism.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
So you're against how football is organized and want us to adopt the rules soccer follows because football is "socialist" and thus "nanny state"ism.

There are other ways you can go about things rather than strong-arming people and businesses by force on issues involving personal choice and free commerce.
 

bobhikes

Nondetermined
Premium Member
I did post my source.

Why under a spoiler? So I read it and it is all about sports which is a controlled environment with limited resources in a country with far more financial resources for the sport. It is more like a dictatorship than a social experiment but it is more social than capitalistic. As the social side of it goes, it is being used to control costs and leverage money making deals which are already on the extreme end of societal standards. They are using it to protect themselves from their uncontrol able greed. Without limiting the greed involved the sport would fail, to many teams in big cities with large cash flows would get all the money and the small city's would become fodder failing rapidly. Top fan supported players would be given insanely large contracts (that's saying a lot based on the contracts of today) and the grunts that do all the work but aren't fan supports would get nothing (Tackles, Guards, Punters....). So yes it proves socialism will work at the top of the pay scale, but it is not a good comparison to the real world. The cost's are being eaten from a most unending barrel of money. In the real world the regular tax payers are going to have to eat the costs, only the top 1% have an unending barrel of money. As to the experiment, I believe it is showing signs of breaking and in the near future may change its financial format completely.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
Why under a spoiler? So I read it and it is all about sports which is a controlled environment

The point I wanted to make was the "socialism" covers a lot more situations and ideologies than many on the right think. If people want to critique some forms, fine, I could easily agree with them especially what we see in Venezuela and in other nations in the past - I'm utterly against them.

So rather than use the word to generate fear and anger, let's have a reasoned debate (I know, I know).
 
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