God in Quran and Bible

mojtaba · Sep 1, 2016

Bible, Genesis 3,

8.And they heard the voice of Jehovah God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and the man and his wife hid themselves from the presence of Jehovah God amongst the trees of the garden.
9.And Jehovah God called unto the man, and said unto him, Where art thou?

Quran,

He is with you wherever you may be, and Allah watches what you do.[ 57:4 ]

Sura Ar-Ra'd( Chapter 13 )
Allah knows what every female carries [in her womb], and what the wombs reduce and what they increase, and everything is by [precise] measure with Him, (8) the Knower of the sensible and the Unseen, the All-great, the All-sublime. (9) It is the same [to Him] whether any of you speaks secretly, or does so loudly, or whether he lurks in the night, or is open to view in daytime. (10)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bible, Exodus 31:17
For in six days Jehovah made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

Quran,
Certainly We[ i.e., Allah ] created the heavens and the earth, and whatever is between them, in six days, and any fatigue did not touch Us. [50:38]

Godobeyer · Sep 1, 2016

mojtaba said:
Bible, Genesis 3,

8.And they heard the voice of Jehovah God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and the man and his wife hid themselves from the presence of Jehovah God amongst the trees of the garden.
9.And Jehovah God called unto the man, and said unto him, Where art thou?

Quran,

He is with you wherever you may be, and Allah watches what you do.[ 57:4 ]

Sura Ar-Ra'd( Chapter 13 )
Allah knows what every female carries [in her womb], and what the wombs reduce and what they increase, and everything is by [precise] measure with Him, (8) the Knower of the sensible and the Unseen, the All-great, the All-sublime. (9) It is the same [to Him] whether any of you speaks secretly, or does so loudly, or whether he lurks in the night, or is open to view in daytime. (10)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bible, Exodus 31:17
For in six days Jehovah made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

Quran,
Certainly We[ i.e., Allah ] created the heavens and the earth, and whatever is between them, in six days, and any fatigue did not touch Us. [50:38]

Bonus

And rely upon the Ever-Living who does not die, and exalt [ Allah ] with His praise. And sufficient is He to be, with the sins of His servants, Acquainted -

https://quran.com/25/58

Unveiled Artist · Sep 1, 2016

mojtaba said:
Bible, Genesis 3,

8.And they heard the voice of Jehovah God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and the man and his wife hid themselves from the presence of Jehovah God amongst the trees of the garden.
9.And Jehovah God called unto the man, and said unto him, Where art thou?

Quran,

He is with you wherever you may be, and Allah watches what you do.[ 57:4 ]

Sura Ar-Ra'd( Chapter 13 )
Allah knows what every female carries [in her womb], and what the wombs reduce and what they increase, and everything is by [precise] measure with Him, (8) the Knower of the sensible and the Unseen, the All-great, the All-sublime. (9) It is the same [to Him] whether any of you speaks secretly, or does so loudly, or whether he lurks in the night, or is open to view in daytime. (10)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bible, Exodus 31:17
For in six days Jehovah made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

Quran,
Certainly We[ i.e., Allah ] created the heavens and the earth, and whatever is between them, in six days, and any fatigue did not touch Us. [50:38]

The Creator is in both books. The nature of the Creator in both books differ. One is written through the Prophet of the Creator, the other is written from the Son of the Creator. Two totally different roles. Plus, you got to take into account whether you're talking about Judaism or Christianity. You may have a point in Judaism, but in Christianity, there is no mirror.

What's the debate question, though?

mojtaba · Sep 1, 2016

Carlita said:
One is written through the Prophet of the Creator, the other is written from the Son of the Creator.

Why do Christians think that Prophet Jesus( peace be upon our Prophet and his progeny and him ) was the son of God?

Quran, 10:68
They say, ‘Allah has taken a son!’ Immaculate is He! He is the All-sufficient. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth. You have no authority for this [statement]. Do you attribute to Allah what you do not know?

Carlita said:
Plus, you got to take into account whether you're talking about Judaism or Christianity. You may have a point in Judaism, but in Christianity, there is no mirror.

Christians believe in those verses, don't they?

Both of the Christians and Jews believe in them, right?

Carlita said:
What's the debate question, though?

How can Jews and Christians accept such incorrect things about God?

Unveiled Artist · Sep 2, 2016

Here is the thing:

mojtaba said:
Why do Christians think that Prophet Jesus( peace be upon our Prophet and his progeny and him ) was the son of God?

They don't think he is a Prophet.

He is the Son of god because the majority of Christians say that he is god and is the physical image of him.

They also say he is miraculously born, lived as god, and although his flesh died, he rose in spirit (and some say flesh to) back to his father.

Aka the trinity: Muslims and Jews do not believe in the trinity if I'm not mistaken? Mainstream Christianity is built on it.

mojtaba said:
Quran, 10:68
They say, ‘Allah has taken a son!’ Immaculate is He! He is the All-sufficient. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth. You have no authority for this [statement]. Do you attribute to Allah what you do not know?

mojtaba said:
Christians believe in those verses, don't they?

Both of the Christians and Jews believe in them, right?

Do Muslims believe that Jesus is Allah?

If so, mainstream Christians agree. If not, the verses don't apply.

Jews don't believe in the trinity. I would personally believe it an insult for a Jew to believe Christ is god if he where to follow his beliefs. Given, if that is what Judaism believes. I am sure I'm quite correct.

mojtaba said:
How can Jews and Christians accept such incorrect things about God?

They are incorrect to you. They are not to Jews from their respective faith. They are not to Christians in their respective faith.

I personally believe all three are incorrect. However, I would never state them as facts to anyone. It is a fact to me; and, that is how I see reality. A Jew's view, Christian's view, and Muslim's view are no different. Just I don't see many Jews evangelistic as protestant Christians and some Muslims.

mojtaba · Sep 2, 2016

Carlita said:
Here is the thing:

They don't think he is a Prophet.

He is the Son of god because the majority of Christians say that he is god and is the physical image of him.

They also say he is miraculously born, lived as god, and although his flesh died, he rose in spirit (and some say flesh to) back to his father.

Aka the trinity: Muslims and Jews do not believe in the trinity if I'm not mistaken? Mainstream Christianity is built on it.

Yes. I am awar of what dear Christians think about Jesus(pbuh).
But If he(pbuh) miraculously born, i.e. he born without any father, Prophet Adam(pbuh) was created more miraculously than him, i.e. without any mother and father, so why do not Christians say Adam is God?

All the Prophets were the manifestations of God. And in general, all the creatures are the manifestations of God. They need God in their existance, traits, and actions. But, the level of manifestation is different in different beings. So that there are different creatures. But, manifestations are not God Himself, they are manifestations of God. A manifestation needs God in his throught aspects, but God Himself, does not need to anything. For example, your image in the mirror is your manifestation and needs to you in all the aspects, but you never need to it at all, and you are not the image itself, and the image is not you, it is itself and you are yourself. So, God manifestations(His creatures) need God, but God does not need them. God is not them and they are not God, but, because they have whatever they have from God, so they are not seprate from Him.

Prophet Jesus was one of the high level manifestations of God. But this does not mean he was God. He(pbuh) grew up like us, had food like us, walked like us. So, why should we accept that he was God, not human?! Yes, Prophets had the knowledge of unseen, which ordinary people do not have, but their knowledge was also from God. God willed to they know the unseen, then they knew. So, they did not have the knowledge of unseen essentially. They also needed God in this aspect.

Carlita said:
Do Muslims believe that Jesus is Allah?

If so, mainstream Christians agree. If not, the verses don't apply.

Jews don't believe in the trinity. I would personally believe it an insult for a Jew to believe Christ is god if he where to follow his beliefs. Given, if that is what Judaism believes. I am sure I'm quite correct.

No. We believe that Prophet Jesus(pbuh) is the servant of God. Indeed, he is one of the best God's servants.

Carlita said:
They are incorrect to you. They are not to Jews from their respective faith. They are not to Christians in their respective faith.

My intellect can not accept that God as only being Who is needless by essence, walks in the garden and a thing can hid himself from Him. Such god is needful and can not be God. A needful being needs to a being who is stronger than him and then provides his needs. But, God is the only needless being, so we can not say that He likes a human could be unawar of a thing. Because unawarness imoplies weakness and weakness itself implies necessity.

Carlita said:
I personally believe all three are incorrect. However, I would never state them as facts to anyone. It is a fact to me; and, that is how I see reality. A Jew's view, Christian's view, and Muslim's view are no different. Just I don't see many Jews evangelistic as protestant Christians and some Muslims.

Are you atheist?

Unveiled Artist · Sep 2, 2016

mojtaba said:
But If he(pbuh) miraculously born, i.e. he born without any father, Prophet Adam(pbuh) created more miraculously than him, i.e. without any mother and father, so why do not Christians say Adam is God?

They don't say Adam is God. They say Jesus (some) is the last Adam. They say Jesus is God. Jesus was the only one born miraculously. Adam did not have that title nor is he put up in that way. If anything, he and his wife where the cause of the sin Christians now feel they need to get rid of.

mojtaba said:
God is not them and they are not God, but, because they have whatever they have from God, so they are not separate from Him.

Christians disagree with you. Mainstream Christian believes Jesus is god; and, they don't see him as just a manifestation. They see him AS god himself.

That is where Muslims and Christians part. Trying to coincide the two is like saying an apple is an orange all because they are both fruits.

mojtaba said:
Prophet Jesus was one of the high level manifestations of God. But this does not mean he was God

Mainstream Christianity says: Jesus was not a manifestation of god. He IS god. He is the physical image of an invisible god. There is no separation other than he being flesh. They interpret "image of" as IS for some reason. That's what they believe.

mojtaba said:
No. We believe that Prophet Jesus(pbuh) is the servant of God. Indeed, he is one of the best God's servants.

That is where you and Christians part. Why try to compare the two and make them coincide with each other all because you both believe in the god of Abraham (both fruits)?

mojtaba said:
Are you atheist?

Yes: I know no deities exist.

There is no other definition in my handbook; so, please don't make the conversation bias based on other people's definition of a simple word.

mojtaba · Sep 2, 2016

Carlita said:
They don't say Adam is God. They say Jesus (some) is the last Adam. They say Jesus is God. Jesus was the only one born miraculously. Adam did not have that title nor is he put up in that way. If anything, he and his wife where the cause of the sin Christians now feel they need to get rid of.

Thank you.

Yes. I am awar of the fundamental beliefs of Chrisrians. I know that they believe that Adam was not God. But, I meant that why they believe that only Jesus born miraculously, while Adam was created without both mother and father?

Adam like Jesus was born miraculously, but why is not he God, and only Jesus is God? While Jesus(pbuh) at least had a mother, but Adam(pbuh) have neither mother nor father.

Carlita said:
Christians disagree with you. Mainstream Christian believes Jesus is god; and, they don't see him as just a manifestation. They see him AS god himself.

Why?
Jesus was born from a woman. He had food, walked on the ways, he will be died( or died ). Why was he God? God does not need anything, so that He is not born from a woman, does not eat, does not walk, does not die, etc.
What dear Christians believe in, is not important for me, why they believe in so and so thing is important for me. Is there any reason for believing that Jesus is God?

Carlita said:
That is where Muslims and Christians part. Trying to coincide the two is like saying an apple is an orange all because they are both fruits.

I do not want to try to coincide the two beliefs. I do not believe in what Christians believe in. Because I do not find any reason for believing that Jesus is God Himself. If they have any reason, I am completely ready to listen to it.

Carlita said:
Mainstream Christianity says: Jesus was not a manifestation of god. He IS god. He is the physical image of an invisible god. There is no separation other than he being flesh. They interpret "image of" as IS for some reason. That's what they believe.

What is their reason?

Carlita said:
That is where you and Christians part. Why try to compare the two and make them coincide with each other all because you both believe in the god of Abraham (both fruits)?

God of Abraham(a.s.) does not walk in garden. No one can hid himself/herself from Him(swt). Any fatigue does not touch Him, so that He never rests. But Bible( distorted Torah and Gosple ) says another things.

Unveiled Artist · Sep 2, 2016

To understand the Christian faith and by that answer your questions, you need to know not only what they believe and why. So, I dont know if you understand what Christianity beliefs are or you know but just cant connect the dots. If the former, thats why Im telling you what and why. If the latter, you may not ever understand because you havent experienced what it means to be a Christian whether convert or indoctrinated doesnt mean one experienced the christian faith.

mojtaba said:
But, I meant that why they believe that only Jesus born miraculously, while Adam was created without both mother and father?

Adam and Eve were created by god
Jesus was created by Mary but gave birth without a biological father.

Just clairifying your statements.

mojtaba said:
Adam like Jesus was born miraculously, but why is not he God, and only Jesus is God? While Jesus(pbuh) at least had a mother, but Adam(pbuh) have neither mother nor father.

Jesus didnt have a biological father

Adam was human to populate the world that is why he is fu human

Jesus is the savior of humanity. Mainstream says only god saves. Thats why he is god. They say humans cant save anyone (even if it ks god's will-though thats what I understand it and non mainstream believe)

mojtaba said:
Why?
Jesus was born from a woman. He had food, walked on the ways, he will be died( or died ). Why was he God?

The idea is he is a miracle
He did miracles only god does
Only god can save

His flesh just makes him a "visible" image of an invisible god

mojtaba said:
What dear Christians believe in, is not important for me, why they believe in so and so thing is important for me. Is there any reason for believing that Jesus is God?

What they believe, once clarified to you, answers why they believe it. Now, if youre askkng "how"...what is the logicistics behind these beliefs, this is the closest i came up with:

Jesus is god (supposedly) because he "did" do miracles. Can a human do miracles?

What they dont understand is Moses did miracles. It wasnt from him it was from god. Same as Jesus. But thats my understanding.

To them, a human cannot save. Do you understans why humans cannot do what god does? If you do, that is why jesus is god. If he were human, he cant do god things. Si ce he did, they say he is god. Thats why.

mojtaba said:
God of Abraham(a.s.) does not walk in garden. No one can hid himself/herself from Him(swt). Any fatigue does not touch Him, so that He never rests. But Bible( distorted Torah and Gosple ) says another things.

Everyone must hide from god. Moses couldnt look god in the eyes.

Hence "why" jesus is flesh so christians can see him etc.

I dont agree with any of what I said. The bible says differently. But thats the logic behind it regardless if its true or false

mojtaba · Sep 3, 2016

Carlita said:
To understand the Christian faith and by that answer your questions, you need to know not only what they believe and why. So, I dont know if you understand what Christianity beliefs are or you know but just cant connect the dots. If the former, thats why Im telling you what and why. If the latter, you may not ever understand because you havent experienced what it means to be a Christian whether convert or indoctrinated doesnt mean one experienced the christian faith.

Adam and Eve were created by god
Jesus was created by Mary but gave birth without a biological father.

Just clairifying your statements.

Jesus didnt have a biological father

Adam was human to populate the world that is why he is fu human

Jesus is the savior of humanity. Mainstream says only god saves. Thats why he is god. They say humans cant save anyone (even if it ks god's will-though thats what I understand it and non mainstream believe)

The idea is he is a miracle
He did miracles only god does
Only god can save

His flesh just makes him a "visible" image of an invisible god

What they believe, once clarified to you, answers why they believe it. Now, if youre askkng "how"...what is the logicistics behind these beliefs, this is the closest i came up with:

Jesus is god (supposedly) because he "did" do miracles. Can a human do miracles?

What they dont understand is Moses did miracles. It wasnt from him it was from god. Same as Jesus. But thats my understanding.

To them, a human cannot save. Do you understans why humans cannot do what god does? If you do, that is why jesus is god. If he were human, he cant do god things. Si ce he did, they say he is god. Thats why.

Everyone must hide from god. Moses couldnt look god in the eyes.

Hence "why" jesus is flesh so christians can see him etc.

I dont agree with any of what I said. The bible says differently. But thats the logic behind it regardless if its true or false

If God wills, a human can do what God can do. Moses(pbuh) did miracles[ what Christians accept it ], Prophet Muhammad(pbuh&hpp) did as well. Prophet Muhammad(pbuh&hp) revived the dead, too. Jesus(pbuh) like them, did miracles by the leave and power of God. Doing miracles does not prove the Godhood of a human. Jesus(pbuh) was needful to food, to a mother to give birth to and then grow up him. He(pbuh) needed to his flesh and body. No, I can not accept that such this person is God, Who is indeed needless by essence thoroughly. If there was not Lady Mary(pbuh), would there Jesus(pbuh)?

Yes, only God can save humans. So, He(swt) will send a human to save other humans by him. Can not He Almighty do the saving with a human who does miracles by the leave of God? How does believing in the Savior force us to believe in the Godhood of the Savior?

Thanks.

ukok102nak · Sep 3, 2016

if we may say so the following passage that we will post this time shall tell something
about the verses from the bible
that youve posted

mojtaba said:
Bible, Genesis 3,

8.And they heard the voice of Jehovah God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and the man and his wife hid themselves from the presence of Jehovah God amongst the trees of the garden.
9.And Jehovah God called unto the man, and said unto him, Where art thou?

we compaired the verses from this one
as it is written
:read:
Genesis 1:26
And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth.

Genesis 5:2
Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.

as we also add this verse
:read: (as it is written)
Ezekiel 28:13
You have been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was your covering, the ruby, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of your timbrels and of your pipes was prepared in you in the day that you were created.
14 You are the anointed cherub that covers; and I have set you so: you were upon the holy mountain of God; you have walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.

Ezekiel 31:9
I have made him fair by the multitude of his branches: so that all the trees of Eden, that were in the garden of God, envied him.

mojtaba said:
Quran,

He is with you wherever you may be, and Allah watches what you do.[ 57:4 ]

Sura Ar-Ra'd( Chapter 13 )
Allah knows what every female carries [in her womb], and what the wombs reduce and what they increase, and everything is by [precise] measure with Him, (8) the Knower of the sensible and the Unseen, the All-great, the All-sublime. (9) It is the same [to Him] whether any of you speaks secretly, or does so loudly, or whether he lurks in the night, or is open to view in daytime. (10)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

mojtaba said:
Bible, Exodus 31:17
For in six days Jehovah made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

now about this verse which has a similarity unto the one above
so as it is written
:read:
Matthew 11:25
At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank you, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hid these things from the wise and prudent, and have revealed them unto babes.
26 Even so, Father: for so it seemed good in your sight.
27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knows the Son, but the Father; neither knows any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.
28 Come unto me, all you that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and all of you shall find rest unto your souls.
30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

mojtaba said:
Quran,
Certainly We[ i.e., Allah ] created the heavens and the earth, and whatever is between them, in six days, and any fatigue did not touch Us. [50:38]

by the way
we dont know the rest of the story of any translations given unto said verses
this we may say
for now

:ty:

godbless
unto all always

God in Quran and Bible

mojtaba

Active Member

Godobeyer

the word "Islam" means "submission" to God

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member

mojtaba

Active Member

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member

mojtaba

Active Member

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member

mojtaba

Active Member

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member

mojtaba

Active Member

ukok102nak

Active Member