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Why is it *necessary* to believe (as a Christian) that the Bible has no errors?

Deidre

Well-Known Member
Just curious on this point. If men were responsible for taking 'God's word' and putting it to paper, could it be that somewhere along the way, there were errors? That parts of the Bible might not be free from corruption? It requires faith to believe in the overall message of the Bible, and it requires the belief in God's grace to have a relationship with Christ...and to me, experiencing the Holy Spirit is all we truly 'need,' so why is it necessary to believe that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God?

I ask this because as I'm exploring churches, their 'mission statement' is wrapped up in believing that the Bible has no errors.

What do you think? :sunflower:
 

Godobeyer

the word "Islam" means "submission" to God
Premium Member
Just curious on this point. If men were responsible for taking 'God's word' and putting it to paper, could it be that somewhere along the way, there were errors? That parts of the Bible might not be free from corruption? It requires faith to believe in the overall message of the Bible, and it requires the belief in God's grace to have a relationship with Christ...and to me, experiencing the Holy Spirit is all we truly 'need,' so why is it necessary to believe that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God?

I ask this because as I'm exploring churches, their 'mission statement' is wrapped up in believing that the Bible has no errors.

What do you think? :sunflower:
Hello dear Deidre

errors mean default , is suppose God message to human had default , or not ?
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
;):leafwind::leafwind:
Just curious on this point. If men were responsible for taking 'God's word' and putting it to paper, could it be that somewhere along the way, there were errors? That parts of the Bible might not be free from corruption? It requires faith to believe in the overall message of the Bible, and it requires the belief in God's grace to have a relationship with Christ...and to me, experiencing the Holy Spirit is all we truly 'need,' so why is it necessary to believe that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God?

I ask this because as I'm exploring churches, their 'mission statement' is wrapped up in believing that the Bible has no errors.

What do you think? :sunflower:

I don't know if I can help, though.. I thought I'd give some advice from experience and opinion as a former christian. Fundementalists (for lack of an appropriate word) seem to be more "Bible accuracy" focus. Baptist, for example, believe there is no errors in the Bible. So, I could be a little hard to find churches.

What I found helpful was in scripture, Christ doesn't speak about the "words"; and, I never read in the gospels that God's Word (Himself) and His message is depended on the words in scripture. Rather, the intent and example Christ and his followers gave are the key points to which I believe a Christian would benefit in living by. For example, Christ talked about "washing people's feet" and He gave hints to His upcoming crucifixtion. Peter, I believe, when He followed Christ, he says "I have been crucified with Christ." He wasn't literally crucified. John the baptist was beheaded yet yet believed in Christ as well. So, the literal act of sacrificing one's self to the point of death is not exactly what I read in Christ words. Rather, through Him, who is the sacrifice (so you don't have to do it), you can do the opposite, bring charity to others and life to those in need (resurrection). If we took it literally, many Christians would try to take their lives for God. That wasn't His message.

Another example would be washing the feet of Christ. While I do believe the woman (can't remember who) washed Jesus' feet, I know today, we can't literally do so. Instead, we can give ourselves in service to others. As Christ says "whatever you have done for others, you have done for me." That message alone is powerful. It's not saying worship Christ, the person. It's saying, worship in communion with others is the same as worshiping Him....and that means, worshiping the Father, which is the whole theme of the Bible: The Father through Christ (though many would disagree... so, this is only how I see it)

I know if I followed (not worshiped) Christ, I would be a great Christian because I feel I understand Christ enough to where I believe to die in Him is to die to ourselves, to our nature (I don't believe in a sinful nature; but, in scenario). To die to self (nature), to live in Christ (in the Father by communion and service) to be resurrected (reunited with the Father)

So, going back to your question, all of this I believe is the intent of the message the Bible displays. I honestly believe there are errors just as there are errors in the sutras/scriptures from the Buddha. However, I don't feel that's how Christ meant us to be "worship the book/words" but His Father. By giving yourself to others, you are following scripture--that message is without error--because you LIVE it (for emphasis) and you believe it in faith.

That is true for you; there are no errors. That is the bible's intent; so, in that respect, there are no errors as long as you are in His Spirit, you are fine.

As for churches, that's a toss up. For me personally, taking out Catholic history, I feel they have the better view of interpreting scripture Othorodox not Roman). That's me. Another church is Jehovah's Witness. They read the Bible extensively and maybe you'll find the intent behind the words by study. Baptist are bible focused.. but, to me, they kind of seem like they worship the book. Their intention is good. Who else?

I know people might say "be your own Church" and that is not what I read and felt Jesus taught. So, I wish you blessings on your search in finding a true Church who not only follows the Bible in words but does in His Word.

Nam
:leafwind:

;)And thank you for reading all of this. Hope it helps
 

Saint Frankenstein

Gone
Premium Member
Depends on what you mean by "errors". I don't believe that the Bible has any errors but I don't take everything literally. For example, it doesn't personally really matter to me if much of the stuff in the OT actually happened. What matters most to me is the message of the story. That's the most important thing in any mythology and folklore from any culture in the world - the meaning of the story and the deeper truths it points at. Mythology speaks to the abstract, symbolic part of our mind. It's dreams, visions and the subconscious. It's all very Jungian. Many people have missed that point with the sacred writings of the Abrahamic religions, and that's sad because it reduces the power of those stories, imo.
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
I know christians exist who belive every thing written in the Bible is literally true.
But I do not know if I have ever met one face to face.
So I rather suspect that in the UK at least they are few and far between.
Most of the Bible has things to teach us, but little if any of it relies on literal accuracy.
 

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
Just curious on this point. If men were responsible for taking 'God's word' and putting it to paper, could it be that somewhere along the way, there were errors? That parts of the Bible might not be free from corruption? It requires faith to believe in the overall message of the Bible, and it requires the belief in God's grace to have a relationship with Christ...and to me, experiencing the Holy Spirit is all we truly 'need,' so why is it necessary to believe that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God?

I ask this because as I'm exploring churches, their 'mission statement' is wrapped up in believing that the Bible has no errors.

What do you think? :sunflower:
Just as a response to the actual question posed in the title of your thread, I don't think all Christians believe in Bible infallibility. I know that we Mormons don't. On the other hand, that fact alone is enough to make Bible inerrantists declare that Mormons aren't "real Christians." If people who are convinced that the Bible is 100% accurate and complete had any idea whatsoever how it has evolved over the years, it would make their heads spin.
 

Sees

Dragonslayer
I think people take verses like 2 Timothy 3:16 -

"All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,"

aka

"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:"

and switch God-breathed/inspired as well useful/profitable for other things so it becomes an authoritative deity-like thing on it's own. In other words the finger pointing at the moon becomes Divine, perfect, flawless...they argue about the wrinkles, length of nail, etc. and never glimpse the Moon.

I think there is such a thing as great Christians who hardly know any of the Bible. Some of the ones I've known who are more saintly, Christ-like, vibrant, oozing compassion and good energy than most. Doesn't mean as much coming from a Heathen but still :p
 

Deathbydefault

Apistevist Asexual Atheist
Depends on what you mean by "errors".
Many things can be considered errors in the bible.
Errors in morals, when clashing them with your own.
Contradictions, or mistakes.
Mis-translations, such as "thou shall not kill" and "turn the other cheek".
 

anonymous9887

bible reader
Just curious on this point. If men were responsible for taking 'God's word' and putting it to paper, could it be that somewhere along the way, there were errors? That parts of the Bible might not be free from corruption? It requires faith to believe in the overall message of the Bible, and it requires the belief in God's grace to have a relationship with Christ...and to me, experiencing the Holy Spirit is all we truly 'need,' so why is it necessary to believe that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God?

I ask this because as I'm exploring churches, their 'mission statement' is wrapped up in believing that the Bible has no errors.

What do you think? :sunflower:
Speaking as a believing christian I accept that the bible does have scribal errors, but it is obvious and can be caught and corrected, but the originals had no mistakes only the copies have mistakes.
If it had mistakes on the originals, then we could not trust the message.
 

Deidre

Well-Known Member
Depends on what you mean by "errors". I don't believe that the Bible has any errors but I don't take everything literally. For example, it doesn't personally really matter to me if much of the stuff in the OT actually happened. What matters most to me is the message of the story. That's the most important thing in any mythology and folklore from any culture in the world - the meaning of the story and the deeper truths it points at. Mythology speaks to the abstract, symbolic part of our mind. It's dreams, visions and the subconscious. It's all very Jungian. Many people have missed that point with the sacred writings of the Abrahamic religions, and that's sad because it reduces the power of those stories, imo.

I finally understand this, well said! The Gospels have no errors, and what I mean by errors is ...human corruption, or human ''tampering'' with the overall message. Things possibly left out or added in, to ''create'' a message. But, I like how you worded this, and now that I have 'new eyes' to read Scripture as of late since having a faith experience with the Holy Spirit, your message resonates, as with a year ago, it might not have. lol Thank you. :)
 

Deidre

Well-Known Member
Just as a response to the actual question posed in the title of your thread, I don't think all Christians believe in Bible infallibility. I know that we Mormons don't. On the other hand, that fact alone is enough to make Bible inerrantists declare that Mormons aren't "real Christians." If people who are convinced that the Bible is 100% accurate and complete had any idea whatsoever how it has evolved over the years, it would make their heads spin.

Interesting! Can you expand on this a bit more? (the bold part)
 

Saint Frankenstein

Gone
Premium Member
I finally understand this, well said! The Gospels have no errors, and what I mean by errors is ...human corruption, or human ''tampering'' with the overall message. Things possibly left out or added in, to ''create'' a message. But, I like how you worded this, and now that I have 'new eyes' to read Scripture as of late since having a faith experience with the Holy Spirit, your message resonates, as with a year ago, it might not have. lol Thank you. :)
You are quite welcome. God bless you, sister.

As for the Gospels, I do believe that the life of Christ literally happened, along with the miracles, because He is God and He came to fulfill a mission. But the OT is another matter since it goes way back into history and was complied over a very long period of time.
 

Deidre

Well-Known Member
You are quite welcome. God bless you, sister.

As for the Gospels, I do believe that the life of Christ literally happened, along with the miracles, because He is God and He came to fulfill a mission. But the OT is another matter since it goes way back into history and was complied over a very long period of time.

Me, too. I finally see what others see. You can live a life of following religion, and not necessarily following Jesus. And not that it's anything out of malice, but you just don't know what you don't know. To be born again was something I never quite understood in the faith, until it happened to me a few weeks ago, and instantly, things changed. Instantly, my life has changed, and I cannot imagine ever departing from the faith again. Jesus is remarkable, and He does bring us Light. For He is Light. :heart:
 

Rise

Well-Known Member
Just curious on this point. If men were responsible for taking 'God's word' and putting it to paper, could it be that somewhere along the way, there were errors? That parts of the Bible might not be free from corruption?

A complete scroll of Isaiah, all 66 chapters, was found in the dead sea scroll collection which is dated to around 200BC.
The second oldest text we have of Isaiah is from the 10th century.
Want to guess how much difference there is? Virtually none. The differences are mainly issues of spelling that don't change the meaning of the text.

We have fragments of most new testament books from the 2nd century, within about 100 years of Christ, which attest to the accuracy of what we have today.
99% of the variations we find between new testament greek manuscripts over the course of more than a thousand years are just issues of spelling and grammar, most of which aren't even translatable into english. Of that 1%, a smaller percentage of verses and words are questionable and could be significant to the reading of the text - however, despite that, our understanding of who Jesus is and what He did does not hinge on those few verses.

Furthermore, for hundreds of years Christianity was a persecuted minority that had no power to alter scripture and force those changes on other Christian communities. These textual traditions developed in parallel to each other, across the Roman empire, over hundreds of years, despite persecution, yet they all are remarkably close considering the circumstances.

It requires faith to believe in the overall message of the Bible, and it requires the belief in God's grace to have a relationship with Christ...and to me, experiencing the Holy Spirit is all we truly 'need,'

Could you please explain what you mean by "experiencing the Holy Spirit"?

The Holy Spirit is a gift given to those who are in Christ (Acts 2:38) As we see in John 15, in a rather complex way of restating the same thing in many different ways to help emphasize the point, this relationship involves more than just some kind of feeling or experience. It involves obedience. It is through obedience to God's word that we abide in Him. This is what loving God is. As Jesus said, those who love him will keep his instructions (John 14:23), which leads to God abiding in us.
That is why the first and greatest commandment to Israel was given that they must love the Lord God with all their heart, soul, and strength (Dueteronomy 6:5).

Jesus re-interates this for us in Matthew 22:
Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”


so why is it necessary to believe that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God?


God is the same yesterday, today, and forever (Hebrews 13:8). There is no variation of him or shadow cast in turning (James 1:17). He is not a man that he should lie (Numbers 23:19).

To put it another way: God speaks truth and His truth never changes.
The reason is: God defines what truth is. He is truth.

What God speaks or reveals to you directly by the Holy Spirit today will never contradict something He has already revealed or said in the past. He will not give you a vision of a future that contradicts the plan he has already revealed. He will not tell you to do something that violates His character and nature, going against the moral truth He has revealed to us already.

When God reveals prophetic truth to us it will happen - Guaranteed. Some said in the 19th century that Israel had to be a nation again at some point because God's word said it would be before the end times. They were thought of as crazy for taking this literally. Until almost a century later it happened. Prior to that, people were prone to spiritualize and allegorize the prophecies because they couldn't imagine how Israel could ever re-emerge as a nation.

It's not just abstract parable. It's truth you can count on. Jesus did literally heal people. He said he would send us the Holy Spirit so that we would do greater works than He. Today we see people healed, even the dead raised, around the world, by the Holy Spirit in the name of Jesus.

In the same way, God reveals moral truth to us and that will never change. His truth, His Word, is a rock - that firm foundation we are told to build our house on, because everything else will eventually be swept away by the storms.

That is why the bible is critical. Through it we not only can see what truth is, but we can learn to discern whether or not it is the Holy Spirit really speaking to us. Without that biblical grounding on what truth is, it's easy for people to be led into deception - 2 Corinthians 11:14 , Galatians 1:8 , 1 Timothy 4:1

Although the Bible does say that the Holy Spirit leads us into all truth, from a practical standpoint most people need to have their mind renewed (Romans 12:2) and their senses trained to discern good from evil (Hebrews 5:14), in order to avoid being misled by things that are not the Holy Spirit. Ephesians 5:26, Ephesians 4:22-24.

Jesus said that His sheep know His voice and follow Him. This is true, however, if someone has spent their life following their own lusts or demonic voices, they need to learn to recognize the voice of Jesus leading them. The bible is a part of that process.

Part of what the Holy Spirit will lead someone to do is to pick up a bible and start renewing their mind to the truth contained within, as a way of calibrating you to God's truth. The easiest way to recognize a counterfeit when you come across it is always to spend your time studying what is true. That's how they would train people to recognize counterfeit money, by having them study real dollars to such an extent that they can instantly just know something is out of alignment when encountering a countefeit bill.
 
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Deidre

Well-Known Member
Found this on another website earlier, and it resonates.

God has given us His Spirit so that we can experience intimacy with Him and enjoy all He has for us. The Holy Spirit is the source of our deepest satisfaction.

  1. The Holy Spirit is God’s permanent presence with us. (John 14:16, 17)
  2. The Holy Spirit enables us to understand and experience all God has given us. (1 Corinthians 2:12).
The Holy Spirit enables us to experience many things:

  1. A genuine new spiritual life (John 3:1–8)
  2. The assurance of being a child of God (Romans 8:15, 16)
  3. The infinite love of God (Romans 5:5; Ephesians 3:18, 19).
 

Kirran

Premium Member
Another non-Christian perspective, but it seems to me that accepting the common historical viewpoint that the Old Testament emerged as a compilation of the writings of the Israelites on their national identity and their perspective on the divine as those things evolved and that the New Testament is a compilation of the anecdotal records of the life of Christ by his disciples in no way diminishes the Bible's validity as a scripture. I have similar views on Hindu scriptures. But looking at a scripture like this allows you to find inspiration in it, the inspiration that surely exists there, and the great knowledge and wisdom contained therein on the nature of the human experience, on how to live you life and on the nature/experience of the divine, without having to squeeze all the stuff that doesn't inspire you into some box to fit into some framework, or fool yourself into thinking you believe something you don't, and so on. Out-and-out literalism seems straight-up unhelpful for spiritual progress, development and insight, in my opinion.
 

Smart_Guy

...
Premium Member
Just curious on this point. If men were responsible for taking 'God's word' and putting it to paper, could it be that somewhere along the way, there were errors? That parts of the Bible might not be free from corruption? It requires faith to believe in the overall message of the Bible, and it requires the belief in God's grace to have a relationship with Christ...and to me, experiencing the Holy Spirit is all we truly 'need,' so why is it necessary to believe that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God?

I ask this because as I'm exploring churches, their 'mission statement' is wrapped up in believing that the Bible has no errors.

What do you think? :sunflower:

Yeah, I'd like to have an answer too. The Quran does specifically claim that it has no errors so I believe Muslims should believe that, or at least in some of their views. But I'm not sure about the Bible. Is there perhaps a verse in it that says anything about it?
 

Kirran

Premium Member
Yeah, I'd like to have an answer too. The Quran does specifically claim that it has no errors so I believe Muslims should believe that, or at least in some of their views. But I'm not sure about the Bible. Is there perhaps a verse in it that says anything about it?

But how do you know the verse that says there are no errors is not an error? :p

After all, it was a compilation of different versions of the orally-transmitted teachings conveyed by Muhammad, organised by an early caliph (Umar?). So while certainly it makes perfect sense to me that a great deal of powerful truth is contained within these teachings, I don't see why it is necessary to take as read that the whole thing is composed of such, rather than being the record of the oral narrative which contained those teachings.

There's probably a Muslim or two somewhere around the world who agrees with me - after all, you get some variation among 1.6 billion human beings :D
 

Smart_Guy

...
Premium Member
But how do you know the verse that says there are no errors is not an error? :p

I can't. I just chose to believe it without imposing it on others :)

Besides, having it there is better than never having it at all. Also, when was the last time the Quran was changed/altered can we pen point? How many version do we have now? But that's a different subject and we should not hello-jack or spam this thread.

After all, it was a compilation of different versions of the orally-transmitted teachings conveyed by Muhammad, organised by an early caliph (Umar?). So while certainly it makes perfect sense to me that a great deal of powerful truth is contained within these teachings, I don't see why it is necessary to take as read that the whole thing is composed of such, rather than being the record of the oral narrative which contained those teachings.

There's probably a Muslim or two somewhere around the world who agrees with me - after all, you get some variation among 1.6 billion human beings :D

Oh well, a Muslim or two is nothing compared to the rest 1.6 billion to take their word as credible :p

These are views, not public opinion absolute facts. I fully respect anyone's choice in believing them as I'd love it for myself too :)
 
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