Wiccan rituals and practice

I've read on other forums how some people do not know the history of things like casting a circle or necessarily why they need to do it. Some answers I've seen say its from ceremonial magic and other things, so is Wicca a mix of old and new, and do Wiccans on here know the history of practice like circle casting?

(btw, I'm Muslim, and interested in learning about other religions)

Assalamu alaikum Islamicway, I will try to help answer your question. While there may be several explanations for the reason of casting a circle the primary ones are:

1. In so doing you link the directions and their the elements each represent (or are represented by) and as a circle focus their attention/power toward the center where the alter/workspace should be.
2. It allows there to be a delineation in the minds eye of those participating between the rest of the world/time and those moments that are spent inside the circle and whatever purpose is expected to be focused on there.
3. Lastly it is often thought to contain the energy of whatever work has been contained therein until it is released at the end of the ritual for maximum effect.

That is the quick answer anyway. I hope it is of some help.

Assalamu alaikum wa rahmatuallah!

Thank you, that's a helpful explanation. From what you've said, it reminds me of the statement that the circle is also a sacred space that is created between two worlds. When you say energy do you mean magic or something else?

Blessed be! (I think that's the expression used by Wiccans)

Merry Meet Islamicway,

islamicway said:

Thank you, that's a helpful explanation.

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I am glad to be of help.

islamicway said:

From what you've said, it reminds me of the statement that the circle is also a sacred space that is created between two worlds. When you say energy do you mean magic or something else?

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Very much so. Sometimes there are phrases such as "A place that is not a place and a time that is not a time." or something along those lines. The energy of which I was speaking is what is often referred to as magic. As it is said in the Qu'ranWiccans often believe that God/Goddess/Both have bestowed all of creation with the ability to change creation. Often it is thought that the only think that is stopping that from happening is the illusion (disbelief) that it will not happen. By performing rituals/circles many Wiccans belief that it not only brings them closer to the Divine, but also puts them in the right "head space" to allow belief, intent and dedication to overcome illusion/disbelief. So it can be argued that the symbolism of the circle and its rituals are an attempt to change those participating in it themselves and in so doing bringing change. As there are many types/branches of Wicca there are other views that may not agree with what I have just said, but I believe that enough do to make it a fair assessment.

islamicway said:

Blessed be! (I think that's the expression used by Wiccans)

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That is right. They also use Merry Part (MP) sometimes also (usually used when Merry Meet was used as the original greeting)
Khuda Hafiz

islamicway said:

I've read on other forums how some people do not know the history of things like casting a circle or necessarily why they need to do it. Some answers I've seen say its from ceremonial magic and other things, so is Wicca a mix of old and new, and do Wiccans on here know the history of practice like circle casting?

(btw, I'm Muslim, and interested in learning about other religions)

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Hi

The use of a circle in magic goes back quite far. Medieval magicians in Europe certainly used circles and some say that the stone circles were used in magic. I'm not certain of the latter as there's some disagreement as to the exact function of stone circles. The reasons for using a circle varies between groups/magicians, but Wayfarer has already explained the most common beliefs.

You could say that Wicca (along with most, if not all Neopagan religions) is a blend of old and new in that it essentially employs a modern take on some older practices. The Horned God in Wicca for example is fairly similar to the Celtic god Cernunnos, and the Mother Goddess shares some traits with a variety of older Goddesses. Neither of them are truly historically accurate though.

Of course there are also some groups of Wiccans and other Neopagans who try to remain as true to historical practices as possible.

WayFarer said:

Merry Meet Islamicway,

I am glad to be of help.


Very much so. Sometimes there are phrases such as "A place that is not a place and a time that is not a time." or something along those lines. The energy of which I was speaking is what is often referred to as magic. As it is said in the Qu'ran

Indeed, Allah will not change the condition of a people until they change what is in themselves. (13:11)
​

Wiccans often believe that God/Goddess/Both have bestowed all of creation with the ability to change creation. Often it is thought that the only think that is stopping that from happening is the illusion (disbelief) that it will not happen. By performing rituals/circles many Wiccans belief that it not only brings them closer to the Divine, but also puts them in the right "head space" to allow belief, intent and dedication to overcome illusion/disbelief. So it can be argued that the symbolism of the circle and its rituals are an attempt to change those participating in it themselves and in so doing bringing change. As there are many types/branches of Wicca there are other views that may not agree with what I have just said, but I believe that enough do to make it a fair assessment.

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The Quran definitely does mention the idea of God helps those who help themselves, and responsibility and individuals taking their own actions is a very important in Islam.

This is very interesting information. The whole idea of being in the right mode for worship is a common notion in religions I find, such as Wu'du for prayer in Islam.

That is right. They also use Merry Part (MP) sometimes also (usually used when Merry Meet was used as the original greeting)
Khuda Hafiz

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I've heard of that one too! May Allah bless.

Shyanekh said:

Hi

The use of a circle in magic goes back quite far. Medieval magicians in Europe certainly used circles and some say that the stone circles were used in magic. I'm not certain of the latter as there's some disagreement as to the exact function of stone circles. The reasons for using a circle varies between groups/magicians, but Wayfarer has already explained the most common beliefs.

You could say that Wicca (along with most, if not all Neopagan religions) is a blend of old and new in that it essentially employs a modern take on some older practices. The Horned God in Wicca for example is fairly similar to the Celtic god Cernunnos, and the Mother Goddess shares some traits with a variety of older Goddesses. Neither of them are truly historically accurate though.

Of course there are also some groups of Wiccans and other Neopagans who try to remain as true to historical practices as possible.

Click to expand...

Salam, thank you for explaining this.
I've read about Sabbats in Wicca and they seem to have roots in ancient practices also, such as Winter Solstice celebrations around the world (e.g. Saturnalia) and some Celtic folklore and beliefs.

Are those other Wiccans and Neopagan the Reconstructionists, they literally reconstruct the practices?

WayFarer said:

Wiccans often believe that God/Goddess/Both have bestowed all of creation with the ability to change creation. Often it is thought that the only think that is stopping that from happening is the illusion (disbelief) that it will not happen. By performing rituals/circles many Wiccans belief that it not only brings them closer to the Divine, but also puts them in the right "head space" to allow belief, intent and dedication to overcome illusion/disbelief. So it can be argued that the symbolism of the circle and its rituals are an attempt to change those participating in it themselves and in so doing bringing change. As there are many types/branches of Wicca there are other views that may not agree with what I have just said, but I believe that enough do to make it a fair assessment.

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I think your summary is magnificent. I don't think I've ever heard it expressed this way, but it sounds right-on. I have never heard the highlighted part before, but it makes sense. Are these insights something you arrived at on your own, or did someone teach you these things?

islamicway said:

Salam, thank you for explaining this.
I've read about Sabbats in Wicca and they seem to have roots in ancient practices also, such as Winter Solstice celebrations around the world (e.g. Saturnalia) and some Celtic folklore and beliefs.

Are those other Wiccans and Neopagan the Reconstructionists, they literally reconstruct the practices?

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Yes, the emphasis on the seasons changing is largely inspired by ancient practices from a variety of religions. However, as you said, Wicca tends to draw quite heavily on Celtic practices.

Yep Reconstructionists try to perform the historical practices as accurately as possible. Obviously they aren't perfectly accurate as many of the older practices are quite obscure, bits may have been lost or untranslatable and some of them simply aren't viable in a modern setting. Still, they tend to come the closest to following the original religions.

Tom Terrific said:

I think your summary is magnificent. I don't think I've ever heard it expressed this way, but it sounds right-on. I have never heard the highlighted part before, but it makes sense. Are these insights something you arrived at on your own, or did someone teach you these things?

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Thank you Tom, you are very kind. It was though (competitive) study and experimentation that lead me to that conclusion. As I am sure you have been told and/or have read that one of the key requirements for spellwork is need. Need (in combination with focus) helps weaken the disbelief that everyone tends to inherit when growing up. It is the components of the spellwork/ritual that helps reinforce focus.

(I wish I knew if I typed "think" or the spellcheck did that to me again. Since the spellcheck doesn't seem to mind I thing I will blame it. )

WayFarer said:

Thank you Tom, you are very kind. It was though (competitive) study and experimentation that lead me to that conclusion. As I am sure you have been told and/or have read that one of the key requirements for spellwork is need. Need (in combination with focus) helps weaken the disbelief that everyone tends to inherit when growing up. It is the components of the spellwork/ritual that helps reinforce focus.

(I wish I knew if I typed "think" or the spellcheck did that to me again. Since the spellcheck doesn't seem to mind I thing I will blame it. )

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I call myself a Witch because i worship a Witch goddess and I accept spellwork as a legitimate aspect of religious faith and practice. I have done spells in the past (successfully), but they have never been a major part of my practice of my faith.

It may seem presumptuous for someone with limited practical experience to suggest an idea that seems to fly in the face of orthodoxy; but I have never felt comfortable with the characterization of need as an essential component of spellwork. I think it's because it smells like a cop-out, e.g. "If it doesn't work, it's because I didn't really need it in the first place." Furthermore, I think desire is a much better reason for effecting change; ultimately, we don't need anything but the divine itself.

As you have characterized its function in successful spellcasting, I see no reason why something else that performs the same function would not work just as well. I like faith/trust or knowledge/certainty -- which are probably the same thing -- better, inasmuch as they are, shall we say, more wholesomely rooted in desire.

I have another twist on spellwork that I had never heard from another "Witchcraft" source until recently, when I heard that Patricia Telesco had said something very similar. I don't want to put words in her mouth, so I will merely speak for myself here.

The whole idea of spellcasting as "manipulation" of reality is, I think, misconceived. It has often been said that casting spells on people without their permission constitutes "black magic" because it is manipulative, which I rephrase as disrespect of the equal dignity of another consciousness. Well, if this is true of one form of consciousness, why doesn't it apply to all? Isn't treating anything as one's property to be done with as one likes to disrespect it? Isn't that the attitude for which the Judeo-Christian tradition is excoriated by green-minded folks ("Fill the earth and subdue it," Gen. 1:28), and which has allegedly led to the fouling of so many places and species?

What is black in the mundane is also black in the magical, for there is truly no dividing line between them.

So, then, what is magic? I think it is co-creation (this is what I heard Telesco had said). The forces with which Witches work are not servants, but partners. It's like a dance in which the Witch leads and the forces work willingly for the joy of creation. In my opinion, that is Witchcraft.

I'd be interested in your reflections on these ideas.

Tom Terrific said:

I think desire is a much better reason for effecting change; ultimately, we don't need anything but the divine itself.

As you have characterized its function in successful spellcasting, I see no reason why something else that performs the same function would not work just as well. I like faith/trust or knowledge/certainty -- which are probably the same thing -- better, inasmuch as they are, shall we say, more wholesomely rooted in desire.

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I agree completely. Several groups in fact agree that magick/witchcraft/spellcasting/psychic powers are stumbling blocks on the path that was designed to bring you closer to the Divine. They can become distractions that one can get caught up in and loose sight of what is important. (It is why you will sometimes hear that you should not do magick for yourself.) Sometimes this is thought of as a two part test. First to see if you are strong enough (in faith and focus) to facilitate change, the second is to see if you are strong enough (wise) to move beyond the desire to.

Tom Terrific said:

So, then, what is magic? I think it is co-creation (this is what I heard Telesco had said). The forces with which Witches work are not servants, but partners. It's like a dance in which the Witch leads and the forces work willingly for the joy of creation. In my opinion, that is Witchcraft.

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Again I agree, but like a dance you can loose track of the time. You can loose yourself and your focus in the joys of that co-creation. Or even worse you can think that '"I" caused this to happen!' and over-inflate your ego. That is why it can be considered a test or challenge.

WayFarer said:

Again I agree, but like a dance you can loose track of the time. You can loose yourself and your focus in the joys of that co-creation. Or even worse you can think that '"I" caused this to happen!' and over-inflate your ego. That is why it can be considered a test or challenge.

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I appreciate your feedback very much. Thanks.

I understand that magic can be a temptation in the ways you have indicated, but the existence of temptation does not invalidate the activity being used by temptation as an opportunity.

There is no intrinsic difference between digging an irrigation ditch -- to channel water for your crops -- and guiding the flow of natural energies via "magic" to effect change in that way. In both cases, the worker is redirecting force in order to reap a benefit. The same temptations are available to the farmer who digs his irrigation ditch as are available to the Witch. This does not invalidate the digging of irrigation ditches; it merely recognizes the potential for temptation exists.

The farmer who digs his own irrigation ditch could stick his thumbs in his overalls and beam over his cleverness, but he'd be pretty silly to do so; and the Witch who does the same over her energy work would be just as silly. But eschewing such work because of the temptation that one might abuse it does not seem right to me. Temptation is everywhere; the settings in which it appears are simply that: settings.

Anyhow, that's how it seems to me.

Thanks again.

Tom Terrific said:

The farmer who digs his own irrigation ditch could stick his thumbs in his overalls and beam over his cleverness, but he'd be pretty silly to do so; and the Witch who does the same over her energy work would be just as silly. But eschewing such work because of the temptation that one might abuse it does not seem right to me. Temptation is everywhere; the settings in which it appears are simply that: settings.

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The difference is that by digging the ditch the farmer is clearly the one who did the work. By using spellwork/magick that person may take full credit for the result without giving credit where credit is due. The temptation resides more in loosing sight of the origin of those powers and instead taking personal credit for their works. (spiritual vs egotistical)

I hope I was of some help. Thank you for your point of view and excellent questions.

Merry Meet, y'all!


So... do y'all eat children and stuff!! O___O;;

I'm kidding. I practiced Wicca for one year in my teenage years... Just wanted to pop by and say hi!