The Rapture

AK4 said:

Please show me in the scripture [not bible translations] that calls the great tribulation THE great tribulation. Oh long after? Just what does the word immediate mean then here?


Mt 24:29 - Immediately after the tribulation of those days

So already we can see your whole premise is off and the unscriptural heresy of this rapture doctrine is.



You are reading the scriptures with physical carnal eyes, making everything literal when in fact Jesus says “[all] My words are spirit” and that He “only spoke to the masses in parables”. I see you have fallen for the false prophets of doom scenario of the end times, no worry I was once deceived too. I can pick apart your argument with just plain questions because you are focused on the physical not the spiritual. Case in point---“war to end all wars”---do you actually believe and swallow the Christian hoax that God is actually in a battle with satan over His throne and to win souls? And if you do, do you realize that according to Christian teaching God loses the majority? Is your god that weak? Do you really believe nations is not symbolic of something else and that its literal and that every single nation will surround the corrupt abominable physical city of Jerusalem who God says is WORSE THAN Sodom, Gomorrah, and Samaria? Theres more as we go further into your post….



Think about this and let the scriptures answer for you and not mans reasonings. If you answer these questions with the scriptures it will tell you where and what heaven is, where is the His true temple, where God dwells and know that that physical carnal abominable city over there in Jerusalem is not where Gods temple is. Also
1. Where does Gods dwell?
2. Where is the temple of God?
3. Who and What is the temple of God?
4. Where is the heaven? [heaven through out scripture is almost always plural]


I would love to see a chapter and verse that says satan gets a physical body. This unscriptural lie of the church has no bearing at all in scripture.

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I would love to see a chapter and verse that says satan gets a physical body. This unscriptural lie of the church has no bearing at all in scripture.
It isn’t hard to find the earthly physical body of which body, their spiritual godhead (Satan the accuser) stands before God night and day bringing accusations against his brothers, and if you can’t see that body on earth, then you are not only spiritually blind, but physically blind also. Get rid of that accusing nature out of the body of mankind and Satan the accuser ceases to exist.

Here should be proof to show how this Christian hoax is just that, A HOAX. Do you really believe that that carnal city full of spiritual slobs of all religions is capable of being peaceful? Do you really think Jesus is coming in the way the Christian hoaxers say He will come to save a people who deny Him, don’t believe in Him and don’t follow His commands? Do you believe the hoax that they are Gods chosen people? Do you know how many verses of scripture you have to throw out for this? It just amazes me that people have fallen for the lie about the jews and the nation of Israel.
You poor sick racist, your hated of we, the children of Abraham, must be eating at your guts like a devouring cancerous tumour, It will be the end of you my friend, it will completely consume and destroy you.

You really don’t have a clue on what the fire from heaven means do you? I don’t say this to demean you, I am just saying the false prophets of Christendom have fooled everyone, even me at one time, with their literal physical renderings of scripture and created false prophesies out of stuff that is supposed to be spiritual.
Ah, but your spiritual and mysterious symbolic meaning of the fire of God’s wrath that will descend from heaven and bring an end to all physical life forms that remain on this planet, is correct, is it?

and it is at the sound of the last trumpet that according to Paul, in 1st Corinthians 15: 51-52; the elect and chosen will be translated in a moment,This is same preaching that those in Christendom do to dupe those who don’t know no better or know the spiritual to try to make their theories [false prophesying] fit.
No matey, this is the word of Lord and if you choose to call him a liar that is your prerogative. There is only a required number to be chosen as the host bodies to those who are to be reborn on earth, and you are only one of billions, who have no desire to be among that number.

Host body??? Oh now in comes the unscriptural trinity doctrine. In otherwords Jesus’ body was just a cadaver and He Himself never died. *sigh*. Also you might as well throw out some more scriptures.
And where do you see any reference to the trinity in what I have said, other than the fact that mankind, who was created in the image and likeness of God, is a triad being comprising of (1) a body of universal animated elements, (2) A soul or life force to which has been gathered all your ancestors, human and pre-human, (This is how evolution works, there wer no human spirits in the indwelling ancestral spirit of the first human beings ) and (3) “You,” the mind/spirit that develops within that body as the son of that ancestral spirit and the controlling godhead to that body.

Where did you get this from? Previous world? So lets see, are you saying Jesus died once before His earthly death and then died AGAIN in His earthly appearance?
No matey, I realise that you are a bit thick, but I thought that you might have understood that the Son of Man who is the spirit that is currently developing within the body of mankind, increasing in wisdom, knowledge, and insight, from the lessons learned because of the sufferings of the body in which he develops which sufferings are caused by the sins and mistakes made by that body.

And when His body of Mankind dies, and He, the spirit that had developed within that physical body is born, (as are all spirits at the death of the body in which they develop,) into the invisible fourth dimensional world that co-exists within this three dimensional visible world, from where He is able to descend into his dead past, to pay the penalty for the sins of the body in which he had developed, chose Jesus as the first of many brothers to be risen from his dead past, to be the cornerstone of the new Temple of God on earth, which Temple is made up by other human beings from his dead past, in which he can live in this visible three dimensional world and through his new body on earth he will gain dominion of all beings that preceded him in the evolution, which includes the animal, mankind.

Do you know how many scriptures again you have just broken? Oh I get it, you like most in the Christian religion don’t truly believe that when Jesus DIED on the cross that it was really Jesus who DIED on the cross; only His cadaver body died but not Him.
And what scripture do you believe is broken here, 1st Peter 3: 18-20; He was put to death physically, but made alive spiritually and in his spiritual existence he descended through time and preached to those who were dead in relation to the days of the Roman Empire in which days Jesus lived. These were they who had been disobedient in the days when Noah was building the Boat.

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S-word said:

AK4 said:

The doom of the wicked, the perverts and murderers and all those magic men, but the salvation of the righteous, who will live in a new world, free from those who twist and distort the minds of our children with their made up mystery stories of immortal gods crawling into the wombs of virgins where a human like body, which is not of the seed of the original human being from which all humans descend. Those preachers of the mysterious inventions of their own demented minds, who cannot see the world for what it is.

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In all respect, are you not doing the same thing with some of these scenarios you have presented in this post. Youve taken many things outside the scriptures and added them to it and created a scenario that then becomes way foriegn to the scriptures. You are adding to the Word of God, in otherwords you are mixing lies with truth and thats the worse deception there is. These outside books are lies mixed with truth and then you are bringing those into the scripture.

You may be able to pick your nose and your backside matey, because unless you focus on the physical, you will never understand the spiritual, which can only be revealed through the physical.

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I dont know about focusing on the physical, maybe recognising the physical and seeing the spiritual behind it, that is what the scriptures teach. We are to focus on the spiritual not the physical. You are doing the very opposite of the command of the Lord.

Romans 1: 18; “Gods anger is revealed from heaven against all the sin and evil of the people whose evil ways prevent the truth from being known. (These we now see are the spiritualists who would attempt to divide the immortal God , from the physical universal body in which he made himself manifest)

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Well i dont know all of what the spiritualists teach but what you say may have some truth in it. But more importantly the spiritualists may be closer to the truth than those who are stuck on the physical because there is so much more written in the scriptures that tell us not to worry about the physical but only the spiritual matters.

God punishes them, because what can be known about God is plain to them, for God himself made it plain in the creation through which he reveals himself, wherein, his invisible qualities, both his eternal power and his divine nature, have been clearly seen; they are perceived in the physical creation. So these people have no excuse at all! They know God, but they do not give him the honour that belongs to him, nor do they thank him. Instead, their thoughts (The thoughts of these so-called religious spiritually eyed mystery makers) have become complete nonsense, and their empty minds are filled with darkness. They say they are wise (Just like you matey, just like you) but they are fools; instead of worshiping the immortal God, they worship images made to look like mortal man etc.”

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Can we say contradiction in your views? Hold on first let me say if i am at all wise, it all came from the Lord. I dont claim anything except for being a worm. Ive been shown principles established by the Word and thats all i do is take the "wisdom" of others and put it up against the Word of God. Its not me who is wise, it is the Word of God who makes the wise look stupid and if i can just use the principles that the Word teaches, its not me that is wise at all, its the Word of God. 99% of the time i take the words right out of peoples mouth and use it against them. Case in point----

you said (These we now see are the spiritualists who would attempt to divide the immortal God , from the physical universal body in which he made himself manifest) and then quote the very passage that shows that you are doing exactly what the verse is saying what "the wise" do. Although convienently you stopped at verse 23 and didnt continue down to 25 which says this ......"worshipping the creature [or creation] rather than the Creator". You know, Jupiter this, jupiter that, sun, moon, etc etc.

So sit back and pick your nose and your backside while I continue to reveal your total ignorance to that which is recorded in Gods word, as I continue to answer every question that you have put to me in post 32. And we got a long way to go matey, a long way to go.

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Try sticking to the scriptures and not these other books and you might stand a chance. Oh let me teach you a principle that almost all christians DONT BELIEVE as we go into this

Titus 1:2 ...God, Who does not lie,... (CLV)

Which a contradiction is a lie and if you believe the scriptures contradict then you might as give up your faith. Now that we got that principle, i await.

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S-word said:

No matey, I believe that Satan is the first born son of God the Father,

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Exactly, you lost already and contrary to the scriptures. Jesus is the firstborn son of God the Father, not satan or do you not believe the Word

"These things says the Amen [Jesus] the faithful and True Witness [Jesus] the beginning of the creation of God" (Rev. 3:14).
"the Origin of God?s creation" (James Moffatt).
"God's creative Original" (Concordant Literal New Testament).
"The Chief of the creation of God" (Young?s Translation).
"the Origin, and Beginning, and Author of God's creation"
(The Amp lified New Testament).

Again, when one has eyes to see they can see the false christian doctrines in the words that people say. In this case we have the false doctrine of lucifer and his fall which in turn produced the doctrine of freewill. And Also Again, when your premise is off, everything else that follows will be off. You have contradicted the scriptures already so everything else you say will be wrong too. What was that you said--- "So sit back and pick your nose and your backside while I continue to reveal your total ignorance to that which is recorded in Gods word". So whos ignorance is showing now and who is the "wise"?

who. Like Joseph the son of Jacob/Israel, who, in his youth wss always in his fathers face, accusing his brothers.

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Where did you get that Joseph was accusing his brothers? Thats not scriptural either. Strike two!

I believe that Satan is obedient to his father as seen in the story of Job, God allowed his son Satan to go so far and no further and he would not dare to overstep the line that his father had drawn in the sand.

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Obedient is a stretch but yes satan can only do what God has placed him on the earth to do.

The war to end all wars was not between God and his son Satan, but between the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, and the nations of the world, who would drive Israel into the sea and into oblivion if not for his intervention.

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Now if it really was a war, satan would be behind those nations warring against God so again you have failed the Word of God.

Concerning the war to end all wars; Joel 3: 14-17; “Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision: for the day of the Lord is near in the valley of decision. The sun and the moon shall be darkened, and the stars shall withdraw their shining. The Lord also shall roar out of Zion, and utter his voice from Jerusalem; and the heavens and the earth shall shake, but the Lord will be the hope of his people, and the strength of the children of Israel.
So shall ye know that I am the Lord your God dwelling in Zion, my holy mountain: then shall Jerusalem be holy and foreigners will never again conquer it. (This has not occurred as yet).

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Its figurative language, "My words are spirit". Do you not know that it still was Jesus who really speaking through the prophets and Apostles? So when it said Jesus only spoke to the multitudes in parables, even when speaking through the prophets and Apostles He was still speaking in parables.

Numbers 24: 17, “A king, like a bright star, will arise in that Nation. Like a comet he will come from Israel. He will strike the leaders of Moab and beat down all the people of Seth. He will conquer his enemies in Edom and make their land his property. While Israel continues victorious. The Nation of Israel will trample them down and wipe out the last survivors.” most Christians somehow (which is beyond my ability to comprehend) believe that this prophecy was fulfilled 2000 years ago when the Lord sent, in his name “Who I Am,” the young Israelite Jesus, to do and say only that which he was commanded by the Lord who said; “They will look upon me and see the one who they pierced, and they shall mourn for him as one mourns for an only child etc.”

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Yes christians are foolish in their reasonings.

See Zechariah 14. The Lord will come to fight for his people Israel as he has fought in times past and from within the inner most sanctuary of his tabernacle (The kingdom of God is within you) which temporary tabernacle is the body of mankind, he will fight the enemies of Israel; those Nations who surround Jerusalem in their attempt to drive God's chosen people into the sea. The Lord will throw them into a state of total confusion, and the weapons of destruction with which they would destroy Israel, he will cause them to turn upon their own allies and they shall suffer a terrible disease, the soft tissue such as their eyes and tongues will melt in their sockets, and their radiated flesh cooked to the bone will slide from their bodies while still standing. Then all the surviving Nations will send their representatives each year to Jerusalem in the land of Israel, to worship and pay tribute to the Lord who will rule the whole world with justice and woe betide those who refuse to do so.
Then all the godless people of this world, and all those, who in their cathedrals, of stone, marble or crystal, who sing and dance with their eyes and hands raised to the heavens in worship of a god they neither know or understand, will bow down and worship my God.

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You been watching too many Left Behind series. As one can tell you are only focused on the physical. Heres another question for you to answer, what is God more interested in changing, the physical things out there that is mentioned in such verses or the changing of the ways of mankind on how they think and act? Cant you tell all those things are symbols symbolising things and not literal. You basically claimed the spiritualists are "spiritualizing away" a spiritual book when it is you and people like you who are trying to "materialise" a spiritual book or make the spiritual physical. Thats why people and the church is so confused.

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S-word said:

The weak imaginary god of the so-called Christians, who crawled into the womb of some supposed virgin, where He, who they reckon was an immortal god and co-creator of the cosmos, couldn’t even create a human like body for himself, but had to get his father who they reckon was the other co-creator of the cosmos to prepare a body for him. Their imaginary god couldn’t beat a fly with a broom stick, let alone the true Co-creator, “The Destroyer,” who is symbolised by the serpent and who destroys the old, only in order to make way for the new, much the same a “Shiva”.

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Oh my, co-Creator? Lets just go with that for now. Yes trinitarians think that Jesus always existed or some even say He first came into existence at Mary. Both are wrong. You say "couldn’t even create a human like body for himself, but had to get his father ". Yes, yes everything Jesus got was from the Father. These are His own words PLUS Jesus prayed to His Father that the Father "give Him back the glory He had BEFORE the world was". Jesus didnt first get a body at Mary, no, He emptied Himself of what He had FOR A LITTLE WHILE [this is what the greek indicates]so He could be lower than the angels so He could die. You demean Him and His God just the same way they do.

And yes, the nations that will surround Jerusalem, are not symbolic of something else, but are the literal nations that will surround Jerusalem,

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Oh so we might as well throw out the scriptures saying Jerusalem descending from heaven [who is to return "descending from heaven? According to you, its a literal city and not Jesus.], the scriptures saying that the real Jerusalem is in heaven that is the mother of those who believe, etc etc. Heres a hint, how many "nations" surrounded "Jerusalem" before, during and after the cross? How many "nations" right are at "war" surrounding "Jerusalem"? Now if you are still stuck in the physical then you will no idea what im talking about will you?

which city, the Lord has punished severely for her former indiscretions and has forgiven her prostitution with the gods of the other nations

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Oh man, another person who has fallen for the jew hoax. The literal, physical nation of isreal is not the "Israel of God". These among many other verses like it should help you figure out who is the "Israel of God" and who is the "Kingdom of God"


Ro 9:6 -But {it is} not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are {descended} from Israel;
Ga 6:16 - And those who will walk by this rule, peace and mercy {be} upon them, and upon the Israel of God.

1Pe 2:9 -But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

and is prepared to protect his bride and will, “When”? In the great tribulation, after which, the nations of the earth that survive, will send their representatives, to go up to Jerusalem each year to worship and pay tribute to my Lord and King, who rose Jesus from death and will rule the whole world with justice.

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Now if the verses that say this is literal, well we might as well throw out the words of the One who is to judge the nations

John 4:19 The woman saith unto him, Sir, I perceive that thou art a prophet. 20 Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship. 21 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father. 22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. [who is the Jew in Gods eyes? Try studying more and you should find the answer] 23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth:

Literally going up to some earthly Jerusalem to worship is not worshipping in spirit. Its as about as bad as saying we must literal take the communion and that be worship. You have got to learn what spirit/spiritual is.

The Divine animating principle that pervades the entire universal body, was in, or rather, was the infinitely dense, infinitely hot, infinitesimally small singularity of origin that was spatially separated by the Big Bang and has become the entire universe and all therein. It is that universal animating life force/soul, to which all the information that is gathered through the senses of all the living creatures that it evolves into, and it rules the world at any given point in time, through the most high species that it has become. Before mankind, the eternal spirit ruled the world for 3 million odd years from within the body of the most high, which at that time was the dinosaurs; the upright walking reptile.

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Remember about worshipping the creation? You might want to read the first chapter of Romans again.

The kingdom of God is within you, we, the human body are his temporary tent/tabernacle, where He dwells behind the veil to the inner most sanctuary of his tabernacle until his son has built for him his new Temple of Light, of which Jesus, was the first fruits to be chosen from the dead past of the “Son of Man,” who is the first born Son of God. Jesus is the cornerstone to the new Temple in which God will dwell on earth among mankind and not within.

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Man i tell you, you are completely trashing and distorting some scriptures. How can God who we "live, move and have our being" EVER not be within us? [oh can you see it, theres that freewill doctrine sneaking in again]

Jesus,...God’s son, ... came down from the eighth eternal heaven of light, which is in the far distant future of we, who live according to three dimensional time.
And the spirit/words that will quicken our mortal bodies, came down from He, in the eighth eternal heaven of unapproachable light, in who, we of his dead past dwell, but who, in our time, is the spirit that is developing within the body of mankind in this the seventh heaven in his ascent to the eighth eternal heaven, for as he dwells in us, in our three dimensional time, so too, we dwell in him, in his fourth dimensional time.

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Where do you get this stuff? Eight eternal heaven? Huh? Do you realise eternal is not scriptural either? All those extra biblical things you are reading are clouding the truth from you.

And that Manna/words that came down through space and time, were spoken through his obedient servant Jesus, who we once knew as a man and who, according to Acts 3:13; has been given divine glory by the God of our ancestors, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and who is now incontestably divine.

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You dont know that that was Jesus who was/is the God of our ancestors, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob? You need to study the NT more, try starting out in Hebrews for this one.
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where he witnessed the universe roll up as a scroll, where the elements became so excited they burnt up and fell as massive columns of fire beyond all measure in height and depth into the great Abyss/Black Hole, where all that existed was condensed back to the infinitely dense, infinitely hot, infinitesimally small singularity, where the Son of Man, the Most High in the creation said, “Let there be Light” as he witnessed the resurrection of the universal body in which He, the supreme personality of Godhead, had developed.

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This he does, by releasing from the least to the greatest, those elect and chosen spirits from which he was formed, and Enoch, who was the first to be reborn on earth in the man Jesus,

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S-word said:

From the Book of Enoch the Prophet 37: 4; “Til the present day such wisdom has never been given by the Lord of spirits as I have received according to my insight, according to the good pleasure of the Lord of spirits by whom the lot of eternal life has been given to me.”
This is verified by Genesis 5: 24: He spent his life in fellowship with God, and then he disappeared, because God had translated him. Hebrew 11: 5; “It was faith that kept Enoch from dying. Instead, he was taken up to God, and no one could find him, because God had taken him up (Into the future.)

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Maybe you need to reread all of that chapter because you make the same mistake as the many who also read and dont PAY ATTENTION TO ALL THE WORDS. Did you miss this part about Enoch

"These ALL DIED [including Enoch 11:5] IN FAITH, NOT having received the promises...And THESE ALL, having obtained a good report throught faith, received NOT THE PROMISE: God having provided some better thing for US, that THEY without US should NOT be made perfect" (Heb. 11:13 & 39-40).

In his ascent to the ends of time, Enoch was escorted by two angels to the ends of the great earth, where the heavens were completed, and in 18: 11; it is said; “And I saw a deep abyss, with columns of heavenly fire, and among them I saw columns of fire fall, which were beyond measure alike toward the height and toward the depth, and beyond that great abyss was nothing, a horrible waste.

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It was verses like this in that book that made me realise that this book couldnt be part of canonization. This passage gives footing the false doctrine of hell.

Turning to one of the escorting angels, Enoch enquires what place was this, and the angel answered, (Verse 14) This place is the ends of the heavens and earth, and is the prison of all the stars and the host of heaven. Enoch then goes on to say; “And I, Enoch, alone saw the vision, the ends of all things; and no man shall see as I have seen.”

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I can see you rely heavy on the book of Enoch to support your beliefs, but lets notice something here when we pay attention to all the words. It says "This place is the ends of the heavens". Now lets think for a minute. God dwells in heaven and even all the heavens couldnt contain Him yet in this book God must have an end because the heavens have end. Do you still think this book isnt contradictory to the scriptures. You know, i havent touched base about what heaven is that would really show this book to be a fraud.

Enoch, who was taken to heaven at the age of 365, is the one year old or 365 day old unblemished, which is sacrificed for the sins of man.

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Man this reincarnation stuff has you all confused. So Enoch has now been sacrificed for the sins of man? Oh it was Enoch first then reincarnated as Jesus who died for the sins of man. Oh brother!

The Greek word, “Christ,” mean anointed and Enoch, the only exception of all mankind to have been anointed at the command of God,

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Are you worshipping Enoch or Jesus? Youd be just as good to do what catholics do and pray to mary.

was the one who evolved within the body of mankind, by the gathering to him, of all the spirits of man in his ascent to the ends of time, is it He who is the true Christ to whom all the sins of the physical body in which he developed (Mankind) is ascribed, Psalms 51: 5; “Behold, I was shapen in iniquity and in sin did my mother (The body of mankind in which the spiritual Son of Man Develops) conceive me.”

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Nevermind. I have no more doubt. You are worshipping Enoch.

After choosing Jesus as his heir, it was His immortal body that was torn asunder and poured out on those who believed his words as spoken by his servant Jesus who was filled with the spirit of Enoch,

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Oh now Enoch is God. Wowsers!!! All the scriptures say Jesus was filled with the Spirit of God and yet you have stomped on this and given Enoch Jesus' title and place! The first words out of Jesus mouth when He was on earth starting His ministry was repent. You might wanna take heed.

which descended upon him as he rose from the baptismal waters and the heavenly voice was heard to say, “You are my beloved in whom I am pleased, Today I have become your Father.” See the more ancient and correct translations of Luke 3: 22.

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That is your problem. You are treating these other books as if they are the Word of God and they are not.

Jesus, who was the man Enoch reborn,

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reincarnation again.

was the first to be released from Enoch the glorious simulacrum (Blueprint)

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Heres something to think on. If Enoch was the first, then who was the Lord walking in the garden of eden? Hint, not God the Father because "no man has seen or heard God at anytime or seen His shape". Actually that right there destroys all of your Enoch theories.

who dies in the process of involution in order to be the saviour of his elect and chosen ones in the process of evolution,

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Are you a christian or Enochian? Because your worship of Enoch is not healthy.

has this to say, 108: 11-13; And now I will summon the spirits of the good who belong to the generation of light, and I will transform those who were born in darkness, who, in the flesh were not recompensed with such honour as their faithfulness deserved, And I will bring forth in shining light those who have loved MY holy name (I Am Who I Am) and I will seat each one on the throne of his honour. And they shall be resplendent for time without number.----And the sinners shall cry aloud and see them resplendent (In their immortal bodies of Light) and they (The sinners) shall go where days and seasons are prepared for them.

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Can we say immortal soul doctrine or is it the we always existed doctrine?

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S-word said:

It isn’t hard to find the earthly physical body of which body, their spiritual godhead (Satan the accuser) stands before God night and day bringing accusations against his brothers, and if you can’t see that body on earth, then you are not only spiritually blind, but physically blind also. Get rid of that accusing nature out of the body of mankind and Satan the accuser ceases to exist.

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Still waiting on that chapter and verse.

You poor sick racist, your hated of we, the children of Abraham, must be eating at your guts like a devouring cancerous tumour, It will be the end of you my friend, it will completely consume and destroy you.

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I have not one racist bone in my body and technically after all jews are not a race. Im not going to waste my time defending myself again on this ridiculous accusation like i did in my thread http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/biblical-debates/74469-jews-not-race.html. Nor do i care whos a jew or a gentile. I know what is a jew and what is a gentile according to God and the scriptures and i know who are and what makes one the children of Abraham and what makes one "the seed of the devil". Maybe you might want to study that one also. I know the plan of God and what is to become of the "physical" jews. Maybe you should read Ezekiel and Isaiah more thoroughly and see and notice and understand that THEY ARE THE LAST TO BE SAVED OF ALL HUMANITY. Oh but going by your ignorance of the scriptures you didnt know that now did you? Oh and that right there crushes your "left behind" "rapture" scenario. The jews are THE LAST TO BE SAVED AFTER SODOM [who will judge them] SAMARIA[who will judge them], and the other one that is slipping my mind right now. LAST, LAST after her sisters are saved THEN WILL SHE.

Oh but im so filled with jealousy now huh? Gimme a break

Ah, but your spiritual and mysterious symbolic meaning of the fire of God’s wrath that will descend from heaven and bring an end to all physical life forms that remain on this planet, is correct, is it?

and it is at the sound of the last trumpet that according to Paul, in 1st Corinthians 15: 51-52; the elect and chosen will be translated in a moment,This is same preaching that those in Christendom do to dupe those who don’t know no better or know the spiritual to try to make their theories [false prophesying] fit.
No matey, this is the word of Lord and if you choose to call him a liar that is your prerogative. There is only a required number to be chosen as the host bodies to those who are to be reborn on earth, and you are only one of billions, who have no desire to be among that number.

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Gee i thought you were about to show me something with that rhetorical question "is correct, is it?", but instead you showed me nothing to prove me wrong. Maybe if you take another swing at it you might get a foul tip.

And where do you see any reference to the trinity in what I have said,

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It was there but as i read more of your stuff and your praise of Enoch, you aint worshipping a trinity, you just are worshipping another god and creation.

No matey, I realise that you are a bit thick, but I thought that you might have understood that the Son of Man who is the spirit that is currently developing within the body of mankind, increasing in wisdom, knowledge, and insight, from the lessons learned because of the sufferings of the body in which he develops which sufferings are caused by the sins and mistakes made by that body.

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Do anyone else see freewill in here again? I do. Eyes to see. So your god is still learning huh? What a crazy notion. My God knows all before He created anything and has no need to learn any more. Maybe your god can ask my God how to become all knowing.

And when His body of Mankind dies, and He, the spirit that had developed within that physical body is born, (as are all spirits at the death of the body in which they develop,) into the invisible fourth dimensional world that co-exists within this three dimensional visible world,

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Scream it to the rooftops "IMMORTAL SOUL, IMMORTAL SOUL DOCTRINE". When you die, you dont die, just your silly flesh, silly. In case you havent noticed im being sarcastic here. Doctrine of immortal soul strikes again.

from where He is able to descend into his dead past, to pay the penalty for the sins of the body in which he had developed, chose Jesus as the first of many brothers to be risen from his dead past, to be the cornerstone of the new Temple of God on earth, which Temple is made up by other human beings from his dead past, in which he can live in this visible three dimensional world and through his new body on earth he will gain dominion of all beings that preceded him in the evolution, which includes the animal, mankind.

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Throw out the Gospels where Jesus said He had all power before He came to earth. Throw out all scripture that say God does not dwell in a temple made by hands. You know you did really good in your thread historical Jesus but you are way out there in this thread.

And what scripture do you believe is broken here, 1st Peter 3: 18-20; He was put to death physically, but made alive spiritually and in his spiritual existence he descended through time and preached to those who were dead in relation to the days of the Roman Empire in which days Jesus lived. These were they who had been disobedient in the days when Noah was building the Boat.

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Again because you can see spiritually to take this verse literally and do as the mormons who came to get me to "at least read more of the bible" as if i didnt and didnt know what in it.

First off you have the immortal soul teaching again here going by what you believe and the dead in this verse are about as dead as the dead when Jesus said "let the dead bury the dead". Are ya getting now? No? Probably because of the whatever translation you have above. I could explain this passage but i dont have the time right now. "Spirits in prison" well heres a clue to this, me, you, and everyone else on earth "experiencing evil" are in this prison. That is the spirits.

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AK4 said:

Still waiting on that chapter and verse.

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And you will continue to wait until I have completed answering post 32.

Not only are you a racist, you are a very ignorant person! If you wish to put forward multiple questions, then please give me the courtesy of waiting until the first set of questions have been answered, before aiming another barrage at me, you ignorant, ignorant person.

I will not be responding to your latest barrage of senseless statements until first I have answered your original barrage of senseless statements, so sit back, shut your trap and continue to pick your nose and scratch your backside, until I have finished revealing your ignorance to Gods word as shown by your original senseless questions. Only then will I begin to respond to post 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, and 47. Gonna be a long, long, wait old mate, a long wait.

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S-word said:

AK4 said:

And you will continue to wait until I have completed answering post 32.

Not only are you a racist, you are a very ignorant person! If you wish to put forward multiple questions, then please give me the courtesy of waiting until the first set of questions have been answered, before aiming another barrage at me, you ignorant, ignorant person.

I will not be responding to your latest barrage of senseless statements until first I have answered your original barrage of senseless statements, so sit back, shut your trap and continue to pick your nose and scratch your backside, until I have finished revealing your ignorance to Gods word as shown by your original senseless questions. Only then will I begin to respond to post 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, and 47. Gonna be a long, long, wait old mate, a long wait.

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quote=AK4; Please show me in the scripture [not bible translations] that calls the great tribulation THE great tribulation.
See King James, Amplified, and Revised Standard translations for starters, Matthew 24: 21: “For then shall be great tribulation such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.” Immediately after the tribulation, “which tribulation” the great tribulation, in which the earth shall be swaddled by a cloud of dust, water vapour, and debris, which will dramatically filter out the light from the heavenly bodies, and act as a protective shield against what is beginning to occur in the heavens, an event which would eventually destroy all life that remains on this planet, but would have done so at the time of the tribulation, but for the protective shield that was put up.

But to continue.
So for us “it is appointed for us once to die” but for our Lord and Saviour He died at least twice by your theology? Where are you getting this stuff from?
I’d like to know where you’re getting your stuff from, as evidently, it does not come from the Holy scriptures, My lord and saviour cannot die, but He can give to us His immortal body of Light. I don’t know about yours though. 1st Timothy 1: 1; "Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by order of God our saviour, “By who”? By God our saviour and Christ Jesus our hope." 1st Timothy 2: 3; “This is good, for it pleases God our saviour, who wants every one to be saved and come to know the truth.” Even a racist like youself AKA. 1st Timothy 4: 10; “We have placed our hope in God, who is the saviour of all, and especially of those who believe.”

So you see AKA, even those who don’t believe or understand the truth, such as yourself, are still saved, albeit, they will not enter into the eternal eighth heaven of unapproachable light, but will be cast back into the refining fires of the seven cycles of physical existence, which revolve eternally in the eighth eternal day, where they will go through the process of re-incarnation, in which they will lose all memory of who they were. This is the second death, the first death being, in that the elements from which their bodies were created, are returned to the universal body of God from which they were borrowed, and the mind/spirit that Is “you” which had developed within that body through all the information taken in through the senses of that body, will be wiped from the eternal soul/life-force of God in your re-incarnation in the next universal body, or the new heavens and earth that God will create after this world disappears as explained in 2nd Peter 3: 10; who was taught by Jesus/the man Enoch reborn on earth. There, that portion of the eternal soul of God which was a part of you, will be given a new heart (Body) and a new spirit (Mind)

But to continue Titus 1: 3; “The commandments of God our saviour.” Titus 2: 10; “So as to bring credit to the teaching about God our saviour.” Jude 25, who quotes verbatim from the words of righteous Enoch, whose righteous truths are recorded in Gods Holy word, opening the door for all to quote from the word of righteous Enoch the evolved Godhead to this universal body, who has never experienced death, not even when his obedient servant, Jesus, the man Enoch reborn, who, while dying on the cross cried out to Enoch, "The Son of Man," our God and indwelling Father and Son ancestral spirit and saviour, “My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me”?

Jude 25; “To the only God our saviour, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, might, and authority etc.” Jesus/Enoch reborn, is the saviour of his body of believers. Our God, Enoch, The Son of Man, is the saviour of all, and especially of those who belong to the body of Jesus. Who he raises from death to sit upon the thrones that have been prepared for them. This I will explain in greater detail after you have been given the data by which you, (Well maybe not you) but the majority of others who reads these posts will be able to then understand.

Acts, "The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob who is our saviour, has given divine glory to his servant Jesus." Acts 17: 31; "For (God our saviour) has fixed a day in which he will judges the whole world with justice by means of a man he has chosen. He has given proof of this to everyone by raising that man from death." But apparently there are people like you, who refuse to accept that proof.

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Thief said:

The word 'rapture' does not appear in my King James....did I miss it?

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S-word said:

Nope, you did'nt, as the translation of our mortal physical bodies into immortal spiritual bodies at the sound of the last trumpet as spoken of by Paul in 1st Corinthians 15: 52-53; is not called the "Rapture" in the Bible. "Rapture, is the name that was given to the translation much later on, that's all.

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Thief said:

I get the part about surrendering the flesh.
But do you really take the rest of the Rapture seriously?
Do you think heaven and the kingdom are earth bound?

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AK4 said:

S-word said:

In all respect, are you not doing the same thing with some of these scenarios you have presented in this post. Youve taken many things outside the scriptures and added them to it and created a scenario that then becomes way foriegn to the scriptures. You are adding to the Word of God, in otherwords you are mixing lies with truth and thats the worse deception there is. These outside books are lies mixed with truth and then you are bringing those into the scripture.

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And now we begin on post 42, Only 43, 44, 45, 46 and 47 to go.

quote=AK4; In all respect, are you not doing the same thing with some of these scenarios you have presented in this post. Youve taken many things outside the scriptures and added them to it and created a scenario that then becomes way foriegn to the scriptures.

It only appears foreign to those are only allowed to eat from certain spiritual foods, such as yourself who obey your holy mother, who has determined for you the Canon, from which you can eat and has forbidden you to partake of the saving spiritual bread that came down from heaven, which bread has not been polluted by her added yeast. (Interpretations and added falsehoods such as the virgin birth, and the teachings that Jesus was not of the seed of Adam etc.) I eat of the unleavened bread that came down from heaven, which to you, who live in obedience to her, the diet upon which my spirit grows, is totally foreign to you, who have been convinced by your holy mother, that my spiritual food is only lies, for as words are spirit, so must be lying words.


quote=AK4; you are adding to the Word of God, in otherwords you are mixing lies with truth and thats the worse deception there is. These outside books are lies mixed with truth and then you are bringing those into the scripture.

If you think that the words recorded in the Pseudipegrapha of the Old Testament are lies, then tell your holy mother to ban the epistle of Jude, who is a half brother to Jesus and James the Righteous. For Jude quotes verbatim from the words of Righteous Enoch, who, after Adam, the Father spirit in the body of mankind that descended from him was rejected and his body was submerged in the baptismal waters of the earth from which the new inner Man arose.

Noah, his wife, their three sons and their wives are all direct descendants of Enoch, the only man redeemed from the previous world as spoken of by 2nd Peter 3: 5; as they are all descendants of Enoch’s six sons, Methusulah, Rigam, Riman, Urchan, Cherminion, and Giadad.

The Father spirit that dwells behind the veil to the innermost sanctuary of every person (Tabernacle/tent, for the kingdom of God is within you) who has descended from Noah, is the spirit of Enoch, to which all the spirits of his descendants are gathered in his evolution as he ascended to the ends of all things, where he witnessed the heavens burn up and fall as massive columns of fire beyond all measure in height and depth, into the Great Abyss/Black Hole, which the escorting angel told him was the prison of all the stars and the host of heaven. And it was He, the Son of Man who descended into his dead past, and to all those who received him as their God, he gave to them the power to become the sons of God.

Abraham was the first to accept the Son of Man as his God, and it was to Abraham that He said, “In blessing, I will bless you, and in multiplying, I will multiply you.” In other words, it would be through the genetic line of Abraham that the Sons of God would be born of God’s spirit.

From Noah, 'the Lord and spiritual centre of all his descendants,' “The first Melchizedek,” to Abraham, there are 10 generations, and when Abraham was born, not one of his post flood ancestors had died and been gathered to the indwelling spirit of Enoch, Abraham who was true to who he was, was a duplication of the pre-flood man, Enoch as he was at that point in time. And the good descendants of Noah who had fallen asleep in righteousness, were gathered to the bosom of Abraham, to the indwelling evolving spirit of Enoch, who was the compilation and spiritual enclosure of all the righteous ancestral spirits in the man Jesus. And Jesus, who had learnt through suffering to be obedient to his indwelling ancestral Father spirit, had become a duplication of the evolving Son of Man as he was at that particular point in his evolution.

When Jesus who, by these words from our lord and saviour, “Today I have become your Father,” was declared high priest in the line of succession to Melchizedek, was made dead in the flesh but alive in spirit, he went and preached the Good News to the dead also. From the body of Noah, he preached to those who were disobedient in the days before the flood. And there, within the kingdom of God, he will remain evolving until the death of the human body of mankind, and the chosen and elect will be transformed and meet him in heaven.

“Methuselah took a wife for his son Lamech, and she became pregnant by him and bore a son and his body was as white as snow and as red as the blooming of a rose, and the hair on his head and his long locks were white as wool, and his eyes beautiful. And when he opened his eyes, he lighted up the whole house like the sun, and the whole house was very bright. And thereupon he arose in the hands of the midwife, opened his mouth, and conversed with the Lord of righteousness. And his father Lamech was afraid of him, (Just as Eve was terrified when she first saw Cain the shinning one and thought to kill him) and Lamech fled and ran to his father Methuselah. And he said to him: “I have begotten a strange son, diverse from and unlike man, and resembling the sons of the God of heaven; and his nature is different, and he is not like us, and his eyes are as the rays of the sun, and his countenance is glorious. And it seems that he is not sprung from me, but from the angels. And I fear that in his days, a wonder may be wrought on the earth.

Jesus who, while the baby Noah was still in the hands of the midwife, opened the mouth of that baby and conversed with Enoch the righteous, had been reborn in another postion in time, and inherited the throne of the indwelling spirit in the body of all the descendants of Noah. And Jesus Is now our indwelling ancestral spirit, who is gathering to himself all the spirits of Good people who fall asleep in righteousness, and is the chosen cornerstone to the resurrected simulacrum, who descended and gave to us, his immortal body.

In relation to the land of Zebulun and Naphtali, the land of Galilee where Jesus grew up and where most of the mighty miracles that were seen through him were preformed; “The People who walked in darkness have seen a great light. They lived in a land of shadows, but now light is shining on them etc”--------- ‘A child is born to us! A son is given to us! And He will be our ruler. He will be called, “wonferful Counselor,” “Mighty God,” “Eternal Father,” “Prince of Peace.”

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Thief said:

I see you spent the entire night talking to yourself.

That's okay.

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