For those who left the Christian Faith, let's discuss what you have discovered.

Christian Pilgrim · Apr 20, 2009

doppelgänger;1509948 said:
I've discovered that Christian symbols and mythology are becoming infinitely more meaningful as I outgrow the notion that they are about the vanity of belief or the hollow echo of metaphysics.

The universal symbol of Christianity is the cross. Do you think the message of the cross is foolishness to you? Christ and Him crucified on behalf of sinners for the purpose of bringing sinners to God, or to reconcile sinners to God, or to make peace with God... to ultimately glorify God and enjoy Him forever... is the Christian message and testimony for 2,000 years.

doppelganger · Apr 20, 2009

Christian Pilgrim said:
The universal symbol of Christianity is the cross.

It's one of many, many universal symbols in Christian art. There are books literally full of universal symbols used in Christianity (notice the proper use of the word "literally" in that sentence . . .

).

Christian Pilgrim said:
Do you think the message of the cross is foolishness to you? Christ and Him crucified on behalf of sinners for the purpose of bringing sinners to God, or to reconcile sinners to God, or to make peace with God... to ultimately glorify God and enjoy Him forever... is the Christian message and testimony for 2,000 years.

Actually, in that context it sure sounds like Christ was crucified to redeem "God" and not "sinners." I don't need any redemption. If you aren't separate from "God" there'd be no "God" for you to worship.

"Contemplate it on the Tree of Woe."

Christian Pilgrim · Apr 20, 2009

doppelgänger;1509964 said:
It's one of many, many universal symbols in Christian art. There are books literally full of universal symbols used in Christianity (notice the proper use of the word "literally" in that sentence . . . ).

Actually, in that context it sure sounds like Christ was crucified to redeem "God" and not "sinners." I don't need any redemption. If you aren't separate from "God" there'd be no "God" for you to worship.

"Contemplate it on the Tree of Woe."

Okay, then the message of the cross is foolishness to you, correct?

Green Gaia · Apr 20, 2009

Christian Pilgrim said:
This thread is for those who were once a professing Christian and have left the Christian Faith. Let's discuss what you have discovered. I'm open to discuss and debate anything that seems to be your reason for leaving Christianity. I am also curious in what you have replaced the Christian Faith with, whatever you're new religion or world view has become.

Since leaving Christianity, I've found a world full of wonder without fear, answers and questions I would have never dreamt of or asked while under the control of Christianity. I've found that religion can be beautiful and meaningful in the real world and not simply something you have to do to win favor or feel you are forced to do.

doppelganger · Apr 20, 2009

Christian Pilgrim said:
Okay, then the message of the cross is foolishness to you, correct?

Nope. The message of "Christian Pilgrim" is though . . . but don't feel bad. I have my own message from the Living God, and because it was delivered to me, it's simply far better for me than your message, as true as it may seem to you.

So just chill out and accept yourself, Christian Pilgrim. You don't need others to swallow your words for them to resonate with truth. You know that, right?

If you don't know that, then the message of the Cross is foolishness to you, my friend.

Christian Pilgrim · Apr 20, 2009

Green Gaia said:
Since leaving Christianity, I've found a world full of wonder without fear, answers and questions I would have never dreamt of or asked while under the control of Christianity. I've found that religion can be beautiful and meaningful in the real world and not simply something you have to do to win favor or feel you are forced to do.

Did you leave Christianity due to the view of some churches in regards to being gay. I think you can be gay and live for the glory of God as a Christian. What do you think about this website?

GayChristian.Net: The Gay Christian Network

Christian Pilgrim · Apr 20, 2009

doppelgänger;1509982 said:
Nope. The message of "Christian Pilgrim" is though . . . but don't feel bad. I have my own message from the Living God, and because it was delivered to me, it's simply far better for me than your message, as true as it may seem to you.

So just chill out and accept yourself, Christian Pilgrim. You don't need others to swallow your words for them to resonate with truth. You know that, right?

If you don't know that, then the message of the Cross is foolishness to you, my friend.

I put it in a question form. I simply asked if the message of the cross is foolishness to you. Your responses are your responses.

doppelgänger;1509964 said:
Actually, in that context it sure sounds like Christ was crucified to redeem "God" and not "sinners." I don't need any redemption. If you aren't separate from "God" there'd be no "God" for you to worship.

"Contemplate it on the Tree of Woe."

Passage: hebrews 6 (ESV Bible Online)

Passage: 1 corinthians 1 (ESV Bible Online)

Passage: 2 Corinthians 2:12-17 (ESV Bible Online)

Green Gaia · Apr 20, 2009

Christian Pilgrim said:
Did you leave Christianity due to the view of some churches in regards to being gay.

Nope.

Christian Pilgrim said:
I think you can be gay and live for the glory of God as a Christian. What do you think about this website?

GayChristian.Net: The Gay Christian Network

I think it's one of many online resources for gay Christians. :shrug:

doppelganger · Apr 20, 2009

Christian Pilgrim said:
I put it in a question form. I simply asked if the message of the cross is foolishness to you. Your responses are your responses.

Actually, no, "my responses" are NOT my responses. My responses are what YOU think they are.

And there's a parable in that . . .

Christian Pilgrim · Apr 20, 2009

doppelgänger;1510024 said:
Actually, no, "my responses" are NOT my responses. My responses are what YOU think they are.

And there's a parable in that . . .

You're a funny one. If Christianity is not true, then why do you appear to be so hostile. Fiction should not threaten your belief systems.

doppelganger · Apr 20, 2009

Christian Pilgrim said:
You're a funny one. If Christianity is not true, then why do you appear to be so hostile. Fiction should not threaten your belief systems.

I appear to be hostile because you are projecting.

I didn't say Christianity is not true - if I'm not mistaken, I think I said just the opposite actually. I said what you call "Christianity" is not true to me. There's all the difference in the world.

He who has ears to hear, let him hear.

Christian Pilgrim · Apr 20, 2009

doppelgänger;1510041 said:
I appear to be hostile because you are projecting.

I didn't say Christianity is not true - if I'm not mistaken, I think I said just the opposite actually. I said what you call "Christianity" is not true to me. There's all the difference in the world.

He who has ears to hear, let him hear.

LOL... the Biblical Christ does not make relative claims. We are talking about the One True Christ which does not include all the counterfeits (anti-christs).

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

For many will come in my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and they will lead many astray.

Many will come in my name, saying, ‘I am he!’ and they will lead many astray.

And he said, “See that you are not led astray. For many will come in my name, saying, ‘I am he!’ and, ‘The time is at hand!’ Do not go after them

doppelganger · Apr 20, 2009

Christian Pilgrim said:
LOL... the Biblical Christ does not make relative claims. We are talking about the One True Christ which does not include all the counterfeits (anti-christs).

Which, ironically, is a relative claim. Tee hee.

In any case, the "Biblical Christ" is a dead one. I get my revelation from living Christ.

Christian Pilgrim · Apr 20, 2009

doppelgänger;1510082 said:
Which, ironically, is a relative claim. Tee hee.

In any case, the "Biblical Christ" is a dead one. I get my revelation from living Christ.

What's your non-biblical Christ like? And how did you create the non-biblical Christ, through self-revelation?

doppelganger · Apr 20, 2009

Christian Pilgrim said:
What's your non-biblical Christ like? And how did you create the non-biblical Christ, through self-revelation?

Why do you care?

I mean, you appreciate the comedy of asking people what they find true and then after they answer trying to convince them it isn't true to them, right?

I'm not asking you to stop worshiping your "Biblical Christ" (nor would there be any point to doing so) so let's be clear on that. You asked a question and I answered it honestly. Why are you so scared that my answer doesn't agree with yours?

Christian Pilgrim · Apr 20, 2009

doppelgänger;1510131 said:
Why do you care?

I mean, you appreciate the comedy of asking people what they find true and then after they answer trying to convince them it isn't true to them, right?

I'm not asking you to stop worshiping your "Biblical Christ" (nor would there be any point to doing so) so let's be clear on that. You asked a question and I answered it honestly. Why are you so scared that my answer doesn't agree with yours?

Oh no my friend, I try to take all things captive and make in obedience to Christ as a way of life. I do enjoy the challenge of other world views which oppose the biblical world view. As long as we can do this with gentleness and respect, we should fit within Forum rules. How boring would it be if we believed all the same? Truth stands alone from myself, therefore when I error, I change toward the truth. Do you mind sharing what your non-biblical Christ is like? And how did you determine that, through some sort of self-revelation from within? What I find to be very interesting is listening to those who once had a Christian worldview and then replaced it with something else as it was more truthful. Subject and relative truths have the potential of creating 6 billion religions based on self revelation.

doppelganger · Apr 20, 2009

Christian Pilgrim said:
Do you mind sharing what your non-biblical Christ is like?

Living Christ is not non-Biblical to me. So I have no answer to your question. Suffice it to say, that my statement in my first post answering your question in this thread is an honest one.

Christian Pilgrim · Apr 20, 2009

doppelgänger;1510213 said:
Living Christ is not non-Biblical to me. So I have no answer to your question. Suffice it to say, that my statement in my first post answering your question in this thread is an honest one.

Why are you unwilling to share your beliefs? I find this to be a pattern for those who left Christianity.

Comicaze247 · Apr 20, 2009

Christian Pilgrim said:
Scripture does not teach that our wills are free in the sense that most think (including many Christians). Due to the fall of mankind (Genesis 3), scripture teaches our will is in bondage to our sin nature. In on our own fallen will, we do not have the ability nor the desire to accept or reject God. The Bible teaches that you must be born again before you can even see the kingdom of God. Nobody will choose the kingdom of God if they cannot see it. All humans choose what they desire, or think will give them the most pleasure or least amount of pain, when confronted with choice. The reason most do not choose Christ is that they do not see Jesus Christ as being desirable. Unless God changes your nature or inclination, you will never be able to choose God in Christ on your own. This is what the Bible teaches on free will.

So you have to choose "God" in the first place before you can have a choice?

Btw, that's quite contrary to what I've heard from other Christians on this forum, and also contrary to what I was taught when I was still Catholic.

Green Gaia · Apr 20, 2009

Christian Pilgrim said:
Why are you unwilling to share your beliefs? I find this to be a pattern for those who left Christianity.

Prehaps that's because of many ex-Christians aversion to proselyting. Also, my beliefs are my beliefs. I don't need you or anyone else to validate them for me. I think that's all Dopp is saying.

For those who left the Christian Faith, let's discuss what you have discovered.

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