Heyo
Veteran Member
Yes, it is. We are not in a court of law but on a debate forum, so argumentative responses are to be expected.
Do you concede or do you have counter arguments?
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The Source of Rights
- Thread starter Truth in love
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Do you concede or do you have counter arguments?
How can I answer irrelevancy? And do you understand the point of "argumentative" which is not to be confused with debating?
Heyo
Veteran Member
Maybe I don't. There are multiple definitions, which are you using?
I believe the source of rights to be the interplay of self interest and enlightenment.
Koldo
Outstanding Member
What does it even mean to say that a right comes from our nature though? How do we not only determine that to be the case but also what does it even mean?
Heyo
Veteran Member
Well, you started it. And I have a purpose for arguing for an inalienable right to life: I'm very pro life and I try to convince other people so that they may at one time also gain that right. You should have it, even though you think you don't need it now.
So what I am saying is just this:
"When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness
So there you have it. Whether someone else violates it is irrelevant... it is still what it is.
Heyo
Veteran Member
Why are you reciting a 244 year old document that has no legal status? You can still be legally killed by your peers on the order of a judge and jury. Your "god-given" right, mentioned in the document, is a pipe dream without formal codification.
Terrywoodenpic
Oldest Heretic
This was. Of course referring to the collective rights of a new nation to break away from another.
It was not referring to the rights of an individual.
Oppression of natives , slaves, coloured people and the powerless, continued as always.
It was very far from an equal society.
But it established the truth and the ultimate goal. You can't get to a place until you know where you are going. The journey is long and difficult (such as the civil war) - but the goal is set.
Terrywoodenpic
Oldest Heretic
What Truth?
What Goal?
The USA has always operated under the principal that power is right.
An individual can exert as much power and wealth as he can attain.
How ever much that disadvantages or harms others.
With out regard to their life, liberty or pursuit of happiness.
It is an "only my life matters society"
Terrywoodenpic
Oldest Heretic
Of course you can get to a place with out a goal.
We do it all the time.
Very few people go though life with a particular target in mind
Or even day to day basis,
But we will arrive somewhere.
We even have a word for it, happenstance.
Or as the song sais"what will be will be"
I can't say it any better than what was written in the Declaration of Independence. What people do today isn't the subject matter.
Even the John Adams said "Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other."
If we cease to be moral and religious, there is consequences.
I see that as twisted thinking.
If you don't know where you are going, how do you know you arrived other than destitute? I have never heard someone say at the end of their life, "I just didn't know where I was going in my life" but if they didn't know it is usually, "I SHOULD have done this"Terry, to be honest, maybe I should say, "It is obvious with the above statement that he doesn't know where he is going with that and is happenstancingly posting hoping to hit any target, if there is one close by. I might as well move on".
Truth in love
Well-Known Member
Right are innate. They come from God. My rights are not issued by government or social contracts.
Terrywoodenpic
Oldest Heretic
Then do not be surprised when they are ignored by people with other beliefs.
Koldo
Outstanding Member
Then you ought to ask God to enforce them, not any government. Good luck.
That goal was already set in 1770 by the Somerset v. Stewart decision. The Declaration of Independence sought to undermine progress toward the goal of emancipation.
In the end, because of the Declaration of Independence, slavery persisted in the US 30 years longer than it would have if they had stayed in the British Empire.
Actually, no.
The Declaration of Independence opened the door for emancipation.;.. read it again and look at the wording.